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The consequences of deception are loss of trust

06.29.2005 David Sirota

Why Bush Will Never Be Able to Regain Support for the War
The media today is always trying to find new reasons why the Bush administration can't seem to gain any public support for its rhetoric about Iraq. Much of it, to be sure, is because of mounting casualties and because the situation is getting more and more out of control. But that still does not explain it - there were big casualties in other wars, but the public remained supportive of the President.

So what's going on? It's simple: this President, unlike any other, brazenly lied to America about why we went to war, and polls show Americans know he lied. All of his rhetoric now about helping spread freedom, stabilizing Iraq, and fighting terrorists there is not only at odds with reality on the ground, but it is insulting to Americans' intelligence, because it reminds us that he's trying to trick us into forgetting what we were told we were going to war for in the first place.

Everytime Bush talks about ending oppression and tyrrany, the average American thinks "but you told us all of this bloodshed was necessary because Saddam was an urgent danger to Americans." Everytime he talks about aiding democracy, the average American thinks "where was the imminent threat we were told about?" And everytime he justifies the American casualties, the average American thinks "where are the WMDs we were told to fear?"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/theblog/archive/david-sirota/why-bush-will-never-be-ab_3408.html#comments

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/contributors/bio.php?nick=david-sirota&name=David%20Sirota

 

[OCC]

Woah guys...you are doing the same thing I did...only I was charged and convicted of slander. lol

I still have my beliefs but I have decided I don't want to offend people when I don't even live in the U.S. (though I do live two minutes away)

Here is a link I've found and just glanced at so far. It focuses on Canada but maybe it gets the point across. Sorry you have to copy and paste it.

http://www.adidem.org/articles/DS5.html

 

[poncho]

I'm a Christian and a Baptist KJ it's my destiny to offend people for seeking and speaking the truth.

 

[KenH]

I am ashamed of anyone who claims to be a Christian and uses the Hitler analogy for President Bush.

I guess ya'll have forgotten the warning given by Jesus:

Matthew 12:36 (ESV)
I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak,

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by poncho:
If George W. Bush doesn't want to be compared to Hitler then he never should have aligned himself with people that use many of the same techniques Hitler used.

[ June 29, 2005, 10:04 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by prophecynut:
So far, I've seen nothing to eliminate the possibility that Bush is on the same course as Hitler.

[ June 29, 2005, 10:04 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]

 

[poncho]

Originally posted by KenH:
I am ashamed of anyone who claims to be a Christian and uses the Hitler analogy for President Bush.

I guess ya'll have forgotten the warning given by Jesus:

Matthew 12:36 (ESV)
I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak,

I haven't forgotten Ken. I would never say anything like that unless it was well documented and it is. Nice try on the appeal to authority technique though.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by poncho:
If George W. Bush doesn't want to be compared to Hitler then he never should have aligned himself with people that use many of the same techniques Hitler used.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's documented.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by prophecynut:
So far, I've seen nothing to eliminate the possibility that Bush is on the same course as Hitler.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also documented.

[ June 29, 2005, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by poncho:
1) It's documented.

2) Also documented.

1) That has not been documented. And you know it.

2) That has not been documented. And you know it.

<personal attack deleted>

[ June 29, 2005, 10:16 PM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]

 

[KenH]

I am amazed and greatly saddened that on a Christian board that a thread whose sole purpose was to provide a link for ways to show support for our troops has been turned into a Bush-bashing fest by malcontents.

I guess it just goes to show that the claims by some that they support our troops are hollow boasts since they have hijacked this thread in the manner in which they have.

 

[LadyEagle]

Reminder: This is a debate board. This is the Politics Forum. People are entitled to their opinions in this forum as long as they do not violate the BB posting rules.

Insinuating that other members are liars or not Christians or not *as good* of a Christian will not be tolerated. Personal attacks will edited out. Period. That goes for insinuations, denigrations, or put downs.

Lady Eagle,
Moderator

 

[KenH]

But I guess it's okay to do it to a fellow Christian who currently is president of the United States, eh, LadyEagle?

You better have you edit key at the ready, LadyEagle, cause to paraphrase the Twisted Sister song from the mid-1980s - I'm not gonna take it anymore!!!!

I am not going to allow these unChristian Hitler analogies to go unchallenged.

 

[OCC]

Ken said "guess it just goes to show that the claims by some that they support our troops are hollow boasts since they have hijacked this thread in the manner in which they have."

I hope you aren't talking about me. No hollow boasts from me and no hijacking. I simply provided a link related to the internet slander issue.

 

[OCC]

"I am not going to allow these unChristian Hitler analogies to go unchallenged."

Just don't act like him in the process ok Ken?

 

[KenH]

No, it was not directed at you, KJ. You are one of those who is actually posting like a Christian in this forum.

 

[LadyEagle]

I am not going to allow these unChristian Hitler analogies to go unchallenged.

Then challenge them. Have a real debate on the merits or lack of merits. Get down to the nitty gritty and compare notes. Provide links. Do delve into historical patterns or lack of historical patterns, etc.

But no personal attacks or inuendoes will be allowed.

 

[OCC]

Ok Ken, no problem. We even if we disagree on things. I am committed to debating like a Christian, though I may fail at times. Iron sharpens iron eh?

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
Then challenge them.

Then I guess maybe I should perhaps start comparing some of these Bush bashers to Stalin or maybe Pol Pot. If this forum is going to become a name-calling, mud throwing venue, then I reckon I'll just throw mud, too. That'll really provide a great witness to unbelievers to see Christians throwing comparisons to Hitler and other bad folks around left and right.

Still, I am saddened that a Christian board even allows the president of the United States to be compared to Hitler.

 

[poncho]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />I am not going to allow these unChristian Hitler analogies to go unchallenged.

Then challenge them. Have a real debate on the merits or lack of merits. Get down to the nitty gritty and compare notes. Provide links. Do delve into historical patterns or lack of historical patterns, etc.

But no personal attacks or inuendoes will be allowed. </font>[/QUOTE]I'm open to the idea of a good debate on this issue. However I would suggest we all take a couple days off from the subject and cool down abit.

 

[Kiffen]

If Bush was like Hitler, millions of Iraqis civilians would be dead and no concern for civilians would be exercised. Fallujah and Sadir city would be in rubble and all opposition would be executed.

I am not a fan of President Bush but the Hitler illustrations are not fair. I do not think he is evil.

 

[KenH]

This is where the degradation of American political discourse has brought us, but it isn’t where it will end. When calling an opponent ‘‘worse than Hitler’’ or ‘‘another Pol Pot’’ has lost its sting, what new invective will the slanderers move on to? When opponents of the war can no longer whip up a frenzy by depicting Bush as Hitler or by likening US troops to the SS and KGB, what fresh venom will they come up with?

Politics ain’t beanbag. But there used to be limits — including rhetorical limits — that decent men and women respected. As those limits are shredded and forgotten, our political environment is growing dirtier, uglier, and sicker.

- SOURCE