Tell me about the CSB

[Van]

That is interpretation. I understand it literaly. I take the meaning of not written (past tense). I do not take it to mean not to have ever been written.

Again I am of the persuasion names are blotted out, Psalms 69:28, or never to be blotted out, Revelation 3:5.

Those whose names were not written are the subject of Revelation 13:8. But by inference, others whose names were written in the Lamb's book of life since the foundation of the world did not suffer the same fate.

Christ promised to never blot out names written in the Lamb's book of life.

 

[McCree79]

Here is the major problem with that, those two verses are not talking about the same book.

Rev 3:5 is likely the same book as 13:8. However Jesus never says any name is actually blotted out. What he says is that οὐ μὴ ἐξαλείψω τὸ ὄνομα αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῆς βίβλου τῆς ζωῆς

The double negation "ου υη" is emphatic that names will not be removed. There is never one time where names are said to be removed from the book of life. Only a guarantee they won't. The Lord keeps those who are his is the emphasis.

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[Van]

Do you believe everyone starts out saved, and then we can lose our salvation? The vast majority of Christians hold that you can't lose salvation (Calvinism and OSAS).

You should start a topic on this. It would be interesting to see comments by OSAS believer who believe in an age of accountability. If a baby dies, does he go to Hell or Heaven? If Heaven, then how can he lose his salvation later?

Thanks Shoostie, this post presents a thoughtful question. If we are saved before the age of accountability (if such an age exists) and OSAS is valid, then how do we "lose" our prior salvation?

This does not impact my view, because I believe everyone starts out condemned due to unbelief, but lots of folks do not agree with me. If the age of accountability exists, and I believe it does, then my view is we do not store up wrath for our missteps before we reach that age.

 

[Reformed1689]

Rev 3:5 is likely the same book as 13:8. However Jesus never says any name is actually blotted out. What he says is that οὐ μὴ ἐξαλείψω τὸ ὄνομα αὐτοῦ ἐκ τῆς βίβλου τῆς ζωῆς

The double negation "ου υη" is emphatic that names will not be removed. There is never one time where names are said to be removed from the book of life. Only a guarantee they won't. The Lord keeps those who are his is the emphasis.

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No I agree with that. I was saying it is not the same book being discussed in Psalms

 

[McCree79]

No I agree with that. I was saying it is not the same book being discussed in Psalms

Agreed

Sorry I mis read you. I thought you were implying Rev 3 and 13 were different books. My fault.

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[37818]

Christ promised to never blot out names written in the Lamb's book of life.

Only to those who are born from God, 1 John 5:4, Revelation 3:5. Otherwise not, Psalms 69:28.

 

[37818]

I believe everyone starts out condemned due to unbelief,

So little children who die being not of an age to believe . . . .

 

[37818]

. . . Jesus never says any name is actually blotted out . . .

It is not recorded Jesus to have said allot of things. Psalms 69:28.

 

[McCree79]

It is not recorded Jesus to have said allot of things. Psalms 69:28.

That is a request by David to withhold salvation. Jonah also made such a demand of God and was denied. There is also zero indication that said book is the Lambs book of life.



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[Just_Ahead]

Lot of twists and turns in this thread.

 

[Van]

Only to those who are born from God, 1 John 5:4, Revelation 3:5. Otherwise not, Psalms 69:28.

Right, when we are born anew, we are enrolled in the general assembly in the Lamb's book of life. All the names that have been written since the foundation of the world remain and will never be blotted out.

You keep citing Psalms 69:28 as if you think this book of the living is the Lamb's book of like. It is not.

 

[Reformed1689]

Right, when we are born anew, we are enrolled in the general assembly in the Lamb's book of life. All the names that have been written since the foundation of the world remain and will never be blotted out.

I'm confused. You seem to say that we are written in at the beginning of creation but then again when we are saved? Can you clarify?

 

[Van]

So little children who die being not of an age to believe . . . .

Little children who die before the age of accountability and those (the feeble minded) unable to be accountable do not "go to heaven" because they are already condemned for unbelief. John 3:18.

However, they also have not stored up any wrath, so they also do not face punishment in the afterlife. Thus perfect justice will provide rest and no pain or suffering.

Any other view does not conform to scripture.

 

[Reformed1689]

Little children who die before the age of accountability and those (the feeble minded) unable to be accountable do not "go to heaven" because they are already condemned for unbelief. John 3:18.

However, they also have not stored up any wrath, so they also do not face punishment in the afterlife. Thus perfect justice will provide rest and no pain or suffering.

Any other view does not conform to scripture.

They do not go to heaven but they also don't suffer in Hell? Where in the world is that in Scripture?

 

[Van]

I'm confused. You seem to say that we are written in at the beginning of creation but then again when we are saved? Can you clarify?

Yet another post without a quote. Where did I "seem to say" our names are entered "at the beginning of creation?"

Our names are entered once, sometime after creation which is the obvious meaning of since the foundation of the world. Our names are written when God credits our faith as righteousness and transfers us into the kingdom of His Son.

 

[Reformed1689]

Yet another post without a quote. Where did I "seem to say" our names are entered "at the beginning of creation?"

Our names are entered once, sometime after creation which is the obvious meaning of since the foundation of the world. Our names are written when God credits our faith as righteousness and transfers us into the kingdom of His Son.

Didn't know I needed to quote when I asked you to clarify your whole statement. That being said, since the foundation of the world obviously means from the very beginning. So the names are there at the beginning. You seemed to say that they were written when we are actually born again.

 

[Van]

They do not go to heaven but they also don't suffer in Hell? Where in the world is that in Scripture?

God provides perfect justice in the afterlife of the condemned. I have cited support scripture.

 

[Reformed1689]

God provides perfect justice in the afterlife of the condemned. I have cited support scripture.

Which post? I haven't seen it and I definitely don't see anything that there will be people who are not in Heaven that will not have suffering. That is not in Scripture.

 

[Van]

Didn't know I needed to quote when I asked you to clarify your whole statement. That being said, since the foundation of the world obviously means from the very beginning. So the names are there at the beginning. You seemed to say that they were written when we are actually born again.

Since the foundation of the world obviously starts at the very end of creation and extends to the end of the age, at some future time.

 

[McCree79]

Since the foundation of the world obviously starts at the very end of creation and extends to the end of the age, at some future time.

Who builds a foundation last? The foundation would be the very first thing built. Not the last.

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