ten-reasons-to-not-ask-jesus-into-your-heart-0

[Martin Marprelate]

'The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked' (Jer. 17:9). "....Out of the heart of men proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, deceit, lewdness.....etc." (Mark 7:21-22). And you're going to invite Christ into that? No, salvation is God saying to you, "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes" (Ezekiel 36:26-27).

Then He will come and make His home with you (John 14:23)

 

[Internet Theologian]

No God practices His standard which is much higher than yours or mine

Yet in your description of Him and how He must act to remain just and fair, you're making His standard bow to yours. That standard my friend isn't very high since it is a given you are not God.

 

[revmwc]

So, you may think God is being unfair by electing some and not others but in fact He is being very fair. He just didn't tell you why His way is more fair than yours.

No God is clear about His Standards. He lays them out in the law and scripture. No man except one has ever lived by those standards. By His standards not one person should go to Heaven and yet a murderer was chosen to make it by your standard while a just Pharisee was condemned

 

[Jerome]

Uh oh:

Hanserd Knollys, The World to Come (1681)

"Secondly, Open your hearts to Christ, when he knocks at the Door of your Souls, and calls you to come to him, to receive him, and let him come into your hearts, and dwell in your hearts by his holy Spirit, and sanctifying Grace, Rev. 3.20. Behold I stand at the Door and knock, if any man hear my voice, and will open the Door, . . I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. If the Sinner be willing to open the door of his heart, Christ will come in by his holy Spirit, and HE will communicate of his Grace to his Soul."


John Bunyan, The Doctrine of the Law and Grace Unfolded (1685)

"Object[ion]: But, I am afraid the day of Grace is past, and if it should be so, what should I do then?
Answ[er]: . . . .First, doth the Lord knock still at the door of thy Heart by his Word and Spirit? If so, then the day of Grace is not past with thy Soul; for where he doth so knock, there he doth also proffer, and promise to come in and Sup, (that is, to Communicate of his things unto them) which he would not do, was the day of Grace past with the Soul, Rev. 3. 20."


Thomas Killcop, The Pathway to Justification (1660)

"Obj: There is a passive receiving of Christ without a hand, when God forceth open mans spirit, and powreth in his Son in despite of the receiver.
Answ. This contradicts Christ, who saith, Behold I stand at the door and knock, if any man will open to me, I will come into him and sup with him, and he with me, Rev. 3.20."


Benjamin Keach, The Glory of God's Rich Grace Displayed (1694)

"O know you, Sinners, this Day, that Jesus Christ, this glorious King, and Prince of the Kings of the Earth, this mighty Saviour is come to your Doors: Behold, I stand at the Door and knock: Rev. 3.20. Will you not open the Door, nor cry to him to help you to open to him, to enable you to believe in him? What do you say, shall the Son of God stand at your Doors, and you not so much as ask, Who is there? Who is at my Door? Shall Christ be kept out of your Hearts, and stand at your Doors, whilst Sin commands the chiefest Room, and has absolute Power over you, and rules in you? How will you be able to look this Blessed Saviour in the Face another Day?"


Charles Spurgeon, "Knock" (1883)

"There stands the Ever-Blessed, knocking at the door of the soul, but the hinges are rusted, the door, itself, is fast bolted and wild briars and all kinds of creeping plants running up the door prove that it has been along time since it was moved. You know what it all means—how continuance in sin makes it harder to yield to the knock of Christ and how evil habits creeping up, one after another, hold the soul so fast that it cannot open to the sacred knocking. Jesus has been knocking at some of your hearts ever since you were children—and still He knocks. I hear His blessed hand upon the door at this moment! Do you not hear it? Will you not open?"

 

[TCassidy]

No God is clear about His Standards. He lays them out in the law and scripture. No man except one has ever lived by those standards. By His standards not one person should go to Heaven and yet a murderer was chosen to make it by your standard while a just Pharisee was condemned

You seem to be having some trouble following the discussion. Nobody is talking about Christ's living a perfect life.

We are talking about your suggestion that God is not being fair unless He does things your way, the way you approve of.

 

[revmwc]

You seem to be having some trouble following the discussion. Nobody is talking about Christ's living a perfect life.

We are talking about your suggestion that God is not being fair unless He does things your way, the way you approve of.

You seem to miss the fact that Christ Jesus is the only one who can and ever has met The Fathers standard. So by God's Standard all have sinned and come short of God's glory and therefore His standard. He demands a sacrificial Death for sins and we can't pay that price why because one has to be perfect to be the sacrifice. Without that sacrifice no one would make it to Heaven. How does one come to Salvation by accepting the sacrifice. That sacrifice is Jesus who appeased God's standard for payment. That is His requirement! Yet some believe God must supply the Faith for one to believe on the Sacrifice God provided. Jesus those who believe are not condemned and those who believe not are condemned already Why? Because they failed to believe on Jesus, they failed to do as Paul and call upon the Lord. Yet some say God didn't allow them to believe instead according to their belief certain to perish for their unbelief while God choose murderers and theives to go to Heaven

 

[Iconoclast]

they do not want to believe being bound in sin....they love their sin.

 

[TCassidy]

You seem to miss the fact that Christ Jesus is the only one who can and ever has met The Fathers standard.

Again, that is not what we are talking about.

We are talking about your assertion that God has to do something the way you think it ought to be done in order to be fair.

 

[SovereignGrace]

now wait if God gives those who are His faith,

He does.

then all who are unregenerate don't willfully reject.

Did Adam run to God after he sinned or did he go and hide in the bushes? Hmmmm? He willfully ran away from God. No one made him run, he freely chose to flee. It's that way even to this day. None seek after God...NONE. He hunts them down. Romans 3 and John 15 state this as biblical fact. There's only One seeker...God.

For God makes them reject they have no choice.

You have no clue do you? Who on here has ever stated, ever avered that God makes anyone reject Him? God did, in fact, harden Pharaoh's heart, but he was a pagan to begin with. He was born fallen in Adam, and was already in a state of rebellion at birth.

You see either all men have volition to believe or reject or no one does.

No one possesses a free will. It is either bound in Satan or bound in Christ. In Satan, the will is bound, is bent towards sin and self. In Christ, it is directed towards Christ. Man freely acts in accordance with their wills.

So do unregenerate people willfully reject or does God make them reject.

Already answered this.

To be clear I believe and scripture is clear when properly understood that ALL mankind has volition free to choose for God or to reject God.

And yet the bible avers something entirely different than this. Jesus proclaimed no man can come unto Him unless they are first drawn. That's not free in any way, shape, form or fashion.

Did the bones in Ezekiel 37 have a choice when Ezekiel prophesied? Did dead Lazarus have a choice when Jesus yelled, "Lazarus, come out!!"? This is two pictures of divine quickening that no man had/has lot or say in. Jesus told that to Nicodemus in John 3:3 and John 3:8. Then there is John 1:13. Then there is Romans 9:16.

Once they have been quickened, brought back to life, they then have something to do, and not before. They exercise God-given faith and God-given repentance and are saved.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Hmmm seems that Galatians states that "the Spirit of His Son is sent into" the HEARTS of BELIEVERS, wonder when that occurs?

When someone is regenerated by the Spirit of God. That is when this happens. If someone believed prior to the Spirit's moving within them, then you have belief prior to faith. You are espousing Pelagianism Monsieur.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Ephesians 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
2 Corinthians 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
Romans 5:5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Romans 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Acts 8:37, And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Salvation comes to all those who believe and call, and the Spirit of the Son is given to them in their Hearts by faith. Seems the bible does say so.

More eisegesis I see. None of these verse...I reiterate...NONE...have anything to do with asking Christ to come into their heart.

 

[SovereignGrace]

I don't see the "into my heart" language to be problematic. Describing the supernatural, salvation, can be tricky. Even repentance is a metaphor, turn and go the other direction. Exact verbiage isn't prescribed, the attitude of the heart, however is. God is able to save even when the best words I have fail to adequately express the intention of my heart.

Here's the problem. The heart is desperately wicked and who can know it?[Jeremiah 17:9] Yet ppl on here aver that asking Christ into your heart is founded upon scripture? Only God can change the heart of sinners from hating Him to loving Him...from being His enemies to being reconciled. The hearts of the unregenerate are wicked, hate all things God. And yet they can ask God to come into that wicked, God-hating heart?

 

[SovereignGrace]

God can do as He pleases, however if He is just and true as Deuteronomy 32:4 He is a God of truth and without iniquity just and right is He. So if He gives faith to some and not to others while allowing men by there free will to willfully reject Him does that not bring into question His being a just God as scripture says?

Even more eisegesis I see. God being just is that He always does the right thing. If He sends someone to hell, He did the right thing. If He saves a sinner, He did the right thing. If He hardens a heart, He did the right thing. If He kills someone, He did the right thing. Everything He does is just. But He has never been fair in the way you purport fairness to be. He chose Noah and his family and killed the rest. He chose Israel over every other nation and left them to themselves. He chose Jacob over Esau. He chose His sheep over the goats.

If I bring one co-worker something to eat, and the others got nothing, I did no harm to them I brought no food to. I am not obligated to bring that one co-worker something to eat to begin with. It is out of kindness I bring them some food. I did no harm to those who I brought nothing, as they didn't have it to begin with. That is how it is with God. God did not have to give salvation to anyone, yet in His mercy, He is saving a multitude that no man can number. The ones He left in their fallen state He did no harm to. They were already fallen in Adam.

Read Romans 9 and the vessels of wrath and mercy.

 

[SovereignGrace]

You seem to miss the fact that Christ Jesus is the only one who can and ever has met The Fathers standard.

He never missed this, but what you said here is true...and refreshing to see it from you.

So by God's Standard all have sinned and come short of God's glory and therefore His standard.

Agree.

He demands a sacrificial Death for sins and we can't pay that price why because one has to be perfect to be the sacrifice. Without that sacrifice no one would make it to Heaven.

Agree.

How does one come to Salvation by accepting the sacrifice.

How does one accept this? It is by faith. Not innate faith...but God-given saving faith. Supernatural faith.

That sacrifice is Jesus who appeased God's standard for payment.

Agree.

That is His requirement!

Yes it is!!

Yet some believe God must supply the Faith for one to believe on the Sacrifice God provided.

These 'some believe' are correct. The others? Not so much.

Jesus those who believe are not condemned and those who believe not are condemned already.

Yes.

Why? Because they failed to believe on Jesus,

Bzzzzzz! They were already condemned in Adam. Many died never hearing of Jesus. They never heard the gospel and died condemned because they were sinners. Period. End of story.

they failed to do as Paul and call upon the Lord.

How can those who never knew Jesus call upon Him. Read Romans 10:8-17.

Yet some say God didn't allow them to believe instead according to their belief certain to perish for their unbelief while God choose murderers and theives to go to Heaven

God does not restrain sinners from coming to Him, their love of sin does that. Granted, He does not seek after many and leave them to their own devices, but He does not hold a palm against their face and hold them from coming t Him. If He does not seek them FIRST, they will never seek Him. Period. End of Story.

 

[JonC]

mwc,

Once again, you have created a god to your own liking. He must fit into what you believe to be fair and just or he cannot be your God. If he does fit into what you believe to be fair and just, then you will bow down and worship what you've fashioned in your mind. This is what man has done since the dawn of time, thoughtfully giving attributes to wood, stone, brass, silver and gold, then worshiping this 'image'. This my friend is none other than classic idolatry.

I agree with you, IT, in the position that you take with salvation being entirely the work of God. But there also seems to be an inconsistency (or at least an area which needs explanation), regarding this justice.

It seems to me that you are accusing (or approaching that accusation) MWC of idolatry because he fits God into what he believes to be fair and just. I agree with you that the doctrine he holds approaches that (if taken to it's logical conclusion). But at the same time, many Calvinists argue that God must punish the wicked because not to do so would be unjust (God's justice must be satisfied) and therefore he satisfies that demand for justice by pouring out his wrath on his Son so that he can forgive men (and remain just). I am not sure that MWC is holding such a different view of justice and fairness here. How do you see it differently?

 

[revmwc]

mwc,

Once again, you have created a god to your own liking. He must fit into what you believe to be fair and just or he cannot be your God. If he does fit into what you believe to be fair and just, then you will bow down and worship what you've fashioned in your mind. This is what man has done since the dawn of time, thoughtfully giving attributes to wood, stone, brass, silver and gold, then worshiping this 'image'. This my friend is none other than classic idolatry.

That you for the false accusation

 

[Internet Theologian]

That you for the false accusation

I am only going by your own logic presented here. You have laid claim to what God must be in order to be just and fair, note your post in post #28:

God can do as He pleases, however if He is just and true as Deuteronomy 32:4 He is a God of truth and without iniquity just and right is He. So if He gives faith to some and not to others while allowing men by there free will to willfully reject Him does that not bring into question His being a just God as scripture says?

Others have called you on this as well, and have addressed thte same error, 'accusing' you of the same.

Note this post that addresses your belief in the same manner:

So, do you think God must always practice your standard of what is right and wrong? Might he not know something you don't know?

Do you think Romans 9:21 is wrong? "Or hasn’t the potter a right over the clay, from the same lump to make one part a vessel for honor, and another for dishonor?"

There are more posts that do the same from others toward your position. You put your beliefs out there, then handle the repercussions of your error without the accusations and slanderous comment.

IOW don't go around calling me a liar. That is one thing I don't tolerate from any person and is not one thing I practice. Thanks.

 

[Internet Theologian]

I agree with you, IT, in the position that you take with salvation being entirely the work of God. But there also seems to be an inconsistency (or at least an area which needs explanation), regarding this justice.

You are accusing MWC of idolatry because he fits God into what he believes to be fair and just. At the same time, many Calvinists argue that God must punish the wicked because not to do so would be unjust (God's justice must be satisfied) and therefore he satisfies that demand for justice by pouring out his wrath on his Son so that he can forgive men (and remain just). I am not sure that MWC is holding such a different view of justice and fairness here.

You are one confused individual. Perhaps your army of straw men have led you astray? Yes, that is what it is.

 

[revmwc]

I am only going by your own logic presented here. You have laid claim to what God must be in order to be just and fair, note your post in post #28:



Others have called you on this as well, and have addressed thte same error, 'accusing' you of the same.

Note this post that addresses your belief in the same manner:



There are more posts that do the same from others toward your position. You put your beliefs out there, then handle the repercussions of your error without the accusations and slanderous comment.

IOW don't go around calling me a liar. That is one thing I don't tolerate from any person and is not one thing I practice. Thanks.

No your going by your indoctrination and beliefs about God. God must fit into your box, where as God in His Sovereignty deals with mankind by His attributes.

 

[JonC]

You are one confused individual. Perhaps your army of straw men have led you astray? Yes, that is what it is.

I agreed with your conclusion, but was asking you a question. I asked how MWC's idea that God must be just differs from the Calvinistic doctrine that God must be just. If you are unable to answer that's fine. Just say so.

But you need to stop the asinine and foolish insults when people ask questions of you. When you do things like this it looks as if it's a defense tactic to hide ignorance. I am asking how his view of divine justice differs from yours, not challenging you to a battle of insults. How is his understanding that God must be just idolatry when Calvinists also believe that God must be just (I also believe that God is just)?