The Bible says a lot of things

[utilyan]

I'm still waiting for you honest folk to put up scripture that says the bible is the final and only authority.

 

[Matt Janes]

@utilyan
I'm amazed. I've been to many Christian websites for years.

I've never seen a defender of the faith who does it as well as you.

To say I'm extremely impressed, is an understatement!

 

[Alcott]

"I don't call him anything. His body has been in the grave for almost 28 years, but I hardly every spoke to him before that."

Who?

My old man; my dad. I thought that's what you meant when you asked, "What do you call your father? chuck"?

 

[utilyan]

My old man; my dad. I thought that's what you meant when you asked, "What do you call your father? chuck"?

I just wanted to hear you call him Dad.

 

[steaver]

@utilyan
I'm amazed. I've been to many Christian websites for years.

I've never seen a defender of the faith who does it as well as you.

To say I'm extremely impressed, is an understatement!

Ok, so we have Matt and Matt who agrees with Utilyan's post which declare a person can reject the Lord Jesus Christ and still be saved by their good works. Are there any other's here who also believe this?

 

[Adonia]

“Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for THE FAITH WHICH WAS ONCE DELIVERED UNTO THE SAINTS” (Jude 3).

It wasn't a book which was delivered, it was the "faith', the "truth", which is salvation through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ which was spread by preaching. Jesus did not just write a book and say here, read this, go figure it out for yourselves and you are saved. St. Paul did not just write a book either, he went out and preached as did the other Apostles. The compilation of the New Testament was an afterthought, collected by the leaders of the new Christian Church for further enlightenment and study after the principal players were gone.

 

[Adonia]

EIGHTH, THE ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH HAS NO AUTHORITY IN THE BIBLE. ITS CLAIM TO AUTHORITY MUST COME FROM OUTSIDE OF THE BIBLE.

The Roman Catholic Church claims that its authority lies in the popes as the successors of the apostles and in the priesthood. There is not a hint of this in the New Testament Scripture.

1. Show me in the Bible where Jesus Christ established the office of the pope as it is found in the Catholic Church and where He made provision for the continuation of such an office.

2. Show me in the Bible where Jesus Christ established the Catholic priesthood. Where do we find such a priesthood described? Where do we find the standards for how to choose such priests? Where do we find a description of how to ordain such priests? Where do we find a description of the seven sacraments that they perform?

For my part, I have Scriptural authority for the gospel that I believe (that salvation is by the grace of Jesus Christ alone through His completed atonement alone through faith alone without works and sacraments—Acts 16:30-31; Rom. 3:23-26; 4:1-8; Eph. 2:8-10; 1 Cor. 15:1-4) and for the type of simple New Testament church that I attend. My faith is in Jesus Christ, and I learn of Him through the Scriptures that He gave through divine inspiration.

I have an infallible test whereby to judge the teachings of man. Every teaching and tradition that is contrary to that inspired Scripture I reject on the authority of God’s Word.

These decisions have eternal consequences, and I refuse to stake the eternal salvation of my soul on anything but the very highest authority.

“So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God” (Romans 10:17).

Is the Bible the Sole Authority for Faith and Practice?

The only thing you have is your interpretation of the Scriptures as you argue against the Universal Church and it's authority. Every institution on this earth has it's leaders with legal authority, so why would Christ ordain anything different for His church here on earth?

When St. Paul was writing his letters to the "other" churches, he was using his authority to admonish them, to tell them to get with the program. He was part of the CENTRAL authority of the new Christian Church, an authority which continued on into the future after he was gone through the authority of the ordained episcopate.

 

[utilyan]

Ok, so we have Matt and Matt who agrees with Utilyan's post which declare a person can reject the Lord Jesus Christ and still be saved by their good works. Are there any other's here who also believe this?

Speak up folks, Steaver needs a concentration camp list.


Liar always gotta lie.

I said acceptance is defined by Christ not by you. Nor do I believe salvation by works.

Listen hear ACCUSER.

I'm still waiting for you to put up scripture that says the bible is the final and only authority.

You do not follow the bible. You make up unbiblical rules.

I gave scripture for all those challenges.

Where is your scripture to for your FAKE RULE? How dare you insult God by adding Fake RULES.

 

[steaver]

Show me where it says SCRIPTURE is the ONLY AND FINAL AUTHORITY.

You said there is a bible verse that says that, YOU swear it to GOD and you SHOW NOTHING.

I think you have me mixed up with someone else. Our discussion has been about Jesus preaching He is the Son of God and one believing it makes no difference, people can believe He is or not, their good works will save them.

I had a long discussion with a Catholic on the topic of Sola Scriptura once and he became frustrated that he could not prove the Catholic Church was given any kind of Authority over the interpretations of the Scriptures. He kinda did the same as you do, trying to demand a Scripture that states Sola Scripture, but when it was turned on him to provide a Scripture which states his RCC has authority over the scriptures he could not, because of course it cannot be defended from the Scriptures.

What really proves the RCC has no authority to interpret scripture is played out here on these types of forums everyday. Just look at the twisted views Catholics hold to and preach. Catholics have transgressed further into apostasy over the years. when I began studying scripture 20 years ago the main difference between Catholics and Christians on salvation was the Sacraments. It use to be the Catholics taught there was NO salvation apart from being a Catholic. Then that was softened to you did not have to be a Catholic but you had to trust in Jesus Christ or be lost. And now today it has transgressed into you do not even have to trust in Jesus Christ, just do some good deeds.

 

[steaver]

I said acceptance is defined by Christ not by you. Nor do I believe salvation by works.

Well this is easy to clear up...

Can a person reject the Lord Jesus Christ, reject He is the Son of God, and still be saved by their good works? Yes or No and then you can post any text to support your answer. (Yes or No clarifies your position without question, posting scripture can be abused or out of context)

 

[utilyan]

I think you have me mixed up with someone else. Our discussion has been about Jesus preaching He is the Son of God and one believing it makes no difference, people can believe He is or not, their good works will save them.

I had a long discussion with a Catholic on the topic of Sola Scriptura once and he became frustrated that he could not prove the Catholic Church was given any kind of Authority over the interpretations of the Scriptures. He kinda did the same as you do, trying to demand a Scripture that states Sola Scripture, but when it was turned on him to provide a Scripture which states his RCC has authority over the scriptures he could not, because of course it cannot be defended from the Scriptures.

What really proves the RCC has no authority to interpret scripture is played out here on these types of forums everyday. Just look at the twisted views Catholics hold to and preach. Catholics have transgressed further into apostasy over the years. when I began studying scripture 20 years ago the main difference between Catholics and Christians on salvation was the Sacraments. It use to be the Catholics taught there was NO salvation apart from being a Catholic. Then that was softened to you did not have to be a Catholic but you had to trust in Jesus Christ or be lost. And now today it has transgressed into you do not even have to trust in Jesus Christ, just do some good deeds.

I'm not Catholic today.

I'm just a Bible Believing Christian who is upset with your desecration of the Holy Scriptures.

Namely your claim that the bible plainly states that scripture is the only and final authority.

Show me where it says SCRIPTURE is the ONLY AND FINAL AUTHORITY.


It shouldn't be a problem since you say you have a verse chapter and verse.

Do you need to borrow someone's bible? some glasses maybe?

 

[steaver]

Speak up folks, Steaver needs a concentration camp list.

I ask because I am trying to understand if this teaching that one can reject the Lord Jesus Christ and still be saved by their good works is RCC wide or just a few rogue Catholics here on this board.

 

[steaver]

I'm just a Bible Believing Christian who is upset with your desecration of the Holy Scriptures.

Namely your claim that the bible plainly states that scripture is the only and final authority.

I made no such claim on this thread. We could begin a thread on it if you like. Our discussion here has been concerning salvation by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, which you claim is not necessary. One only need good works.

 

[utilyan]

Well this is easy to clear up...

Can a person reject the Lord Jesus Christ, reject He is the Son of God, and still be saved by their good works? Yes or No and then you can post any text to support your answer. (Yes or No clarifies your position without question, posting scripture can be abused or out of context)

No.

Those are easy question so long as Hitler or You don't provide false implications which nullify the truth.

PLUS, you could have worded your trap better.

Paul for example was saved not only while rejecting Jesus, but actively murdering christians and hunting them down.

Paul is a perfect example of ZERO FAITH, ZERO WORKS, get God intervenes, his intervention is an act of mercy, this saved Paul not anything Paul DID or Believe.

 

[utilyan]

I made no such claim on this thread. We could begin a thread on it if you like. Our discussion here has been concerning salvation by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, which you claim is not necessary. One only need good works.

Steaver beating your wife is not proper christianity. Why do you teach this?

Have you stop beating your wife today?





Loaded questions and misrepresentations.

No one can go to heaven rejecting Jesus, And works are not the cause of salvation.


Maybe you could remember my stance if you stop smoking crack.

 

[steaver]

Paul for example was saved not only while rejecting Jesus, but actively murdering christians and hunting them down.

Paul is a perfect example of ZERO FAITH, ZERO WORKS, get God intervenes, his intervention is an act of mercy, this saved Paul not anything Paul DID or Believe.

Oh, that is what we call Calvinism. So you are a Catholic Calvinist??

 

[steaver]

No.

Wonderful! Now you can stop saying the Muslim and the Jew which rejects the Lord Jesus Christ is saved by their good works. You could have just said so to begin with.

 

[steaver]

Steaver beating your wife is not proper christianity. Why do you teach this?
Have you stop beating your wife today?
Loaded questions and misrepresentations.

How have I misrepresented you? Do you believe Jews and Muslims who reject the Lord Jesus Christ are still going to be saved as long as they love others and do good works?

 

[utilyan]

Oh, that is what we call Calvinism. So you are a Catholic Calvinist??

No. Paul wasn't given respect for being elect or being a reprobate. He tells us he was shown mercy for being IGNORANT.

If you win a cake you still have to eat it.

So #1 requirement for being saved........is you NEED to be saved.

 

[steaver]

He tells us he was shown mercy for being IGNORANT.

What do you think Paul meant by this ignorance? Paul knew the Gospel message. Paul knew Christians followed Jesus as the Son of God, which is why he hunted them down and killed them, for worshiping Jesus as God. So what was Paul ignorant of?