The Calvinist Gospel

[atpollard]

There is no Gospel( Good news) in Calvinism to point anyone to

Just for fun, I thought I would post the GOOD NEWS from a classic REFORMED (Calvinist) source in response to the implied challenge in the above quote. I don’t really care what happens to the topic after that ... I will have made the only point that I wanted to make.


Q. According to God’s righteous judgment we deserve punishment both now and in eternity: how then can we escape this punishment and return to God’s favor?

A. God requires that his justice be satisfied.[1] Therefore the claims of this justice must be paid in full, either by ourselves or by another.[2]
1 Ex. 23:7; Rom. 2:1-11
2 Isa. 53:11; Rom. 8:3-4


Q. Can we make this payment ourselves?

A. Certainly not. Actually, we increase our debt every day.[1]
1 Matt. 6:12; Rom. 2:4-5


Q. Can another creature—any at all—pay this debt for us?

A. No. To begin with, God will not punish any other creature for what a human is guilty of.[1] Furthermore, no mere creature can bear the weight of God’s eternal wrath against sin and deliver others from it.[2]
1 Ezek. 18:4, 20; Heb. 2:14-18
2 Ps. 49:7-9; 130:3


Q. What kind of mediator and deliverer should we look for then?

A. One who is a true[1] and righteous[2] human, yet more powerful than all creatures, that is, one who is also true God.[3]
1 Rom. 1:3; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:17
2 Isa. 53:9; 2 Cor. 5:21; Heb. 7:26
3 Isa. 7:14; 9:6; Jer. 23:6; John 1:1


Q. Why must the mediator be a true and righteous human?

A. God’s justice demands that human nature, which has sinned, must pay for sin;[1] but a sinful human could never pay for others.[2]
1 Rom. 5:12, 15; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:14-16
2 Heb. 7:26-27; 1 Pet. 3:18


Q. Why must the mediator also be true God?

A. So that the mediator, by the power of his divinity, might bear the weight of God’s wrath in his humanity and earn for us and restore to us righteousness and life.[1]
1 Isa. 53; John 3:16; 2 Cor. 5:21


Q. Then who is this mediator—true God and at the same time a true and righteous human?

A. Our Lord Jesus Christ,[1] who was given to us to completely deliver us and make us right with God.[2]
1 Matt. 1:21-23; Luke 2:11; 1 Tim. 2:5
2 1 Cor. 1:30


Q. How do you come to know this?

A. The holy gospel tells me. God began to reveal the gospel already in Paradise;[1] later God proclaimed it by the holy patriarchs[2] and prophets[3] and foreshadowed it by the sacrifices and other ceremonies of the law;[4] and finally God fulfilled it through his own beloved Son.[5]
1 Gen. 3:15
2 Gen. 22:18; 49:10
3 Isa. 53; Jer. 23:5-6; Mic. 7:18-20; Acts 10:43; Heb. 1:1-2
4 Lev. 1-7; John 5:46; Heb. 10:1-10
5 Rom. 10:4; Gal. 4:4-5; Col. 2:17


Q. Are all people then saved through Christ just as they were lost through Adam?

A. No. Only those are saved who through true faith are grafted into Christ and accept all his benefits.[1]
1 Matt. 7:14; John 3:16, 18, 36; Rom. 11:16-21


Q. What is true faith?

A. True faith is not only a sure knowledge by which I hold as true all that God has revealed to us in Scripture;[1] it is also a wholehearted trust,[2] which the Holy Spirit creates in me[3] by the gospel,[4] that God has freely granted, not only to others but to me also,[5] forgiveness of sins, eternal righteousness, and salvation.[6] These are gifts of sheer grace, granted solely by Christ’s merit.[7]
1 John 17:3, 17; Heb. 11:1-3; James 2:19
2 Rom. 4:18-21; 5:1; 10:10; Heb. 4:14-16
3 Matt. 16:15-17; John 3:5; Acts 16:14
4 Rom. 1:16; 10:17; 1 Cor. 1:21
5 Gal. 2:20
6 Rom. 1:17; Heb. 10:10
7 Rom. 3:21-26; Gal. 2:16; Eph. 2:8-10

(from the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563)
This is what I used to teach my daughter about the “Theology” of God and what was important to know.
How we live our lives and handle the everyday trials and triumphs is how we taught her about the reality of living in Covenant with God and the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That is my “Calvinist Gospel”.

Make of it what you will ... I am not YOUR servant. (Rom 14:4)

 

[JonC]

Just for fun, I thought I would post the GOOD NEWS from a classic REFORMED (Calvinist) source in response to the implied challenge in the above quote. I don’t really care what happens to the topic after that ... I will have made the only point that I wanted to make.


Q. According to God’s righteous judgment we deserve punishment both now and in eternity: how then can we escape this punishment and return to God’s favor?

A. God requires that his justice be satisfied.[1] Therefore the claims of this justice must be paid in full, either by ourselves or by another.[2]
1 Ex. 23:7; Rom. 2:1-11
2 Isa. 53:11; Rom. 8:3-4


Q. Can we make this payment ourselves?

A. Certainly not. Actually, we increase our debt every day.[1]
1 Matt. 6:12; Rom. 2:4-5


Q. Can another creature—any at all—pay this debt for us?

A. No. To begin with, God will not punish any other creature for what a human is guilty of.[1] Furthermore, no mere creature can bear the weight of God’s eternal wrath against sin and deliver others from it.[2]
1 Ezek. 18:4, 20; Heb. 2:14-18
2 Ps. 49:7-9; 130:3


Q. What kind of mediator and deliverer should we look for then?

A. One who is a true[1] and righteous[2] human, yet more powerful than all creatures, that is, one who is also true God.[3]
1 Rom. 1:3; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:17
2 Isa. 53:9; 2 Cor. 5:21; Heb. 7:26
3 Isa. 7:14; 9:6; Jer. 23:6; John 1:1


Q. Why must the mediator be a true and righteous human?

A. God’s justice demands that human nature, which has sinned, must pay for sin;[1] but a sinful human could never pay for others.[2]
1 Rom. 5:12, 15; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:14-16
2 Heb. 7:26-27; 1 Pet. 3:18


Q. Why must the mediator also be true God?

A. So that the mediator, by the power of his divinity, might bear the weight of God’s wrath in his humanity and earn for us and restore to us righteousness and life.[1]
1 Isa. 53; John 3:16; 2 Cor. 5:21


Q. Then who is this mediator—true God and at the same time a true and righteous human?

A. Our Lord Jesus Christ,[1] who was given to us to completely deliver us and make us right with God.[2]
1 Matt. 1:21-23; Luke 2:11; 1 Tim. 2:5
2 1 Cor. 1:30


Q. How do you come to know this?

A. The holy gospel tells me. God began to reveal the gospel already in Paradise;[1] later God proclaimed it by the holy patriarchs[2] and prophets[3] and foreshadowed it by the sacrifices and other ceremonies of the law;[4] and finally God fulfilled it through his own beloved Son.[5]
1 Gen. 3:15
2 Gen. 22:18; 49:10
3 Isa. 53; Jer. 23:5-6; Mic. 7:18-20; Acts 10:43; Heb. 1:1-2
4 Lev. 1-7; John 5:46; Heb. 10:1-10
5 Rom. 10:4; Gal. 4:4-5; Col. 2:17


Q. Are all people then saved through Christ just as they were lost through Adam?

A. No. Only those are saved who through true faith are grafted into Christ and accept all his benefits.[1]
1 Matt. 7:14; John 3:16, 18, 36; Rom. 11:16-21


Q. What is true faith?

A. True faith is not only a sure knowledge by which I hold as true all that God has revealed to us in Scripture;[1] it is also a wholehearted trust,[2] which the Holy Spirit creates in me[3] by the gospel,[4] that God has freely granted, not only to others but to me also,[5] forgiveness of sins, eternal righteousness, and salvation.[6] These are gifts of sheer grace, granted solely by Christ’s merit.[7]
1 John 17:3, 17; Heb. 11:1-3; James 2:19
2 Rom. 4:18-21; 5:1; 10:10; Heb. 4:14-16
3 Matt. 16:15-17; John 3:5; Acts 16:14
4 Rom. 1:16; 10:17; 1 Cor. 1:21
5 Gal. 2:20
6 Rom. 1:17; Heb. 10:10
7 Rom. 3:21-26; Gal. 2:16; Eph. 2:8-10

(from the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563)
This is what I used to teach my daughter about the “Theology” of God and what was important to know.
How we live our lives and handle the everyday trials and triumphs is how we taught her about the reality of living in Covenant with God and the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That is my “Calvinist Gospel”.

Make of it what you will ... I am not YOUR servant. (Rom 14:4)

Recently an opposing view was presented. Thank you for providing an different position (perhaps explaining to others how Calvinism views the gospel).

 

[atpollard]

Recently an opposing view was presented. Thank you for providing an different position (perhaps explaining to others how Calvinism views the gospel).

You are welcome.
As Mama Lily would say, “l love to brag on my Jesus”.

 

[JonC]

You are welcome.
As Mama Lily would say, “l love to brag on my Jesus”.

Here's my summary:

 

[Sai]

Yet at 5 years old a person can hear the gospel and call upon God in Christ. Therefore my friends, the gospel is pretty hard to mess up. Jesus died my death and paid the price of my sin, he was resurrected for my life, and will come again for my glorification. I did not have to do anything, he has done all of this, for me.


Joy unspeakable full of glory

 

[Barry Johnson]

Just for fun, I thought I would post the GOOD NEWS from a classic REFORMED (Calvinist) source in response to the implied challenge in the above quote. I don’t really care what happens to the topic after that ... I will have made the only point that I wanted to make.


Q. According to God’s righteous judgment we deserve punishment both now and in eternity: how then can we escape this punishment and return to God’s favor?

A. God requires that his justice be satisfied.[1] Therefore the claims of this justice must be paid in full, either by ourselves or by another.[2]
1 Ex. 23:7; Rom. 2:1-11
2 Isa. 53:11; Rom. 8:3-4


Q. Can we make this payment ourselves?

A. Certainly not. Actually, we increase our debt every day.[1]
1 Matt. 6:12; Rom. 2:4-5


Q. Can another creature—any at all—pay this debt for us?

A. No. To begin with, God will not punish any other creature for what a human is guilty of.[1] Furthermore, no mere creature can bear the weight of God’s eternal wrath against sin and deliver others from it.[2]
1 Ezek. 18:4, 20; Heb. 2:14-18
2 Ps. 49:7-9; 130:3


Q. What kind of mediator and deliverer should we look for then?

A. One who is a true[1] and righteous[2] human, yet more powerful than all creatures, that is, one who is also true God.[3]
1 Rom. 1:3; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:17
2 Isa. 53:9; 2 Cor. 5:21; Heb. 7:26
3 Isa. 7:14; 9:6; Jer. 23:6; John 1:1


Q. Why must the mediator be a true and righteous human?

A. God’s justice demands that human nature, which has sinned, must pay for sin;[1] but a sinful human could never pay for others.[2]
1 Rom. 5:12, 15; 1 Cor. 15:21; Heb. 2:14-16
2 Heb. 7:26-27; 1 Pet. 3:18


Q. Why must the mediator also be true God?

A. So that the mediator, by the power of his divinity, might bear the weight of God’s wrath in his humanity and earn for us and restore to us righteousness and life.[1]
1 Isa. 53; John 3:16; 2 Cor. 5:21


Q. Then who is this mediator—true God and at the same time a true and righteous human?

A. Our Lord Jesus Christ,[1] who was given to us to completely deliver us and make us right with God.[2]
1 Matt. 1:21-23; Luke 2:11; 1 Tim. 2:5
2 1 Cor. 1:30


Q. How do you come to know this?

A. The holy gospel tells me. God began to reveal the gospel already in Paradise;[1] later God proclaimed it by the holy patriarchs[2] and prophets[3] and foreshadowed it by the sacrifices and other ceremonies of the law;[4] and finally God fulfilled it through his own beloved Son.[5]
1 Gen. 3:15
2 Gen. 22:18; 49:10
3 Isa. 53; Jer. 23:5-6; Mic. 7:18-20; Acts 10:43; Heb. 1:1-2
4 Lev. 1-7; John 5:46; Heb. 10:1-10
5 Rom. 10:4; Gal. 4:4-5; Col. 2:17


Q. Are all people then saved through Christ just as they were lost through Adam?

A. No. Only those are saved who through true faith are grafted into Christ and accept all his benefits.[1]
1 Matt. 7:14; John 3:16, 18, 36; Rom. 11:16-21


Q. What is true faith?

A. True faith is not only a sure knowledge by which I hold as true all that God has revealed to us in Scripture;[1] it is also a wholehearted trust,[2] which the Holy Spirit creates in me[3] by the gospel,[4] that God has freely granted, not only to others but to me also,[5] forgiveness of sins, eternal righteousness, and salvation.[6] These are gifts of sheer grace, granted solely by Christ’s merit.[7]
1 John 17:3, 17; Heb. 11:1-3; James 2:19
2 Rom. 4:18-21; 5:1; 10:10; Heb. 4:14-16
3 Matt. 16:15-17; John 3:5; Acts 16:14
4 Rom. 1:16; 10:17; 1 Cor. 1:21
5 Gal. 2:20
6 Rom. 1:17; Heb. 10:10
7 Rom. 3:21-26; Gal. 2:16; Eph. 2:8-10

(from the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563)
This is what I used to teach my daughter about the “Theology” of God and what was important to know.
How we live our lives and handle the everyday trials and triumphs is how we taught her about the reality of living in Covenant with God and the Lordship of Jesus Christ. That is my “Calvinist Gospel”.

Make of it what you will ... I am not YOUR servant. (Rom 14:4)

Where is the Gospel in there? No Romans 10.9 no 1 cor 15 .1-4 no Romans 1.16 no 1 cor 1.21 . no eph 1 .13-14 ?. All that and no Gospel ? Thus confirming there is no Gospel in Calvinism is only clever philosophical reasons why scripture is not true .

 

[atpollard]

Where is the Gospel in there? No Romans 10.9 no 1 cor 15 .1-4 no Romans 1.16 no 1 cor 1.21 . no eph 1 .13-14 ?. All that and no Gospel ? Thus confirming there is no Gospel in Calvinism is only clever philosophical reasons why scripture is not true .

So HERE is your Gospel (from the verses listed above):

• [Rom 10:9 NASB] 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus [as] Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
• [1Co 15:1-4 NASB] 1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
• [1Co 1:21 NASB] 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not [come to] know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
• [Eph 1:13-14 NASB] 13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of [God's own] possession, to the praise of His glory.

From the above:

1. I need to confess that Jesus is God.
2. I need to believe that God raised Jesus from the dead.
3. Christ died for our sins.
4. Christ was buried and raised.
5. we have to believe foolishness to be saved.
6. After hearing and believing, God seals us with the Holy Spirit and we inherit "something"

So the only thing that I need to do is confess that Jesus is God and believe that God raised him from the dead. Whew, I was afraid I would have to stop living a reprobate lifestyle and actually DO something. But this salvation is so easy, even a demon can do it!

Now if you want to look up the verses in the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563 and do the same thing for the Reformed Gospel, be my guest.

 

[Yeshua1]

Where is the Gospel in there? No Romans 10.9 no 1 cor 15 .1-4 no Romans 1.16 no 1 cor 1.21 . no eph 1 .13-14 ?. All that and no Gospel ? Thus confirming there is no Gospel in Calvinism is only clever philosophical reasons why scripture is not true .

In regards to the Gospel, calvinism teaches and affirms highest view of the grace of God!

 

[Reformed]

There is only one Gospel.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

 

[Barry Johnson]

So HERE is your Gospel (from the verses listed above):

• [Rom 10:9 NASB] 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus [as] Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
• [1Co 15:1-4 NASB] 1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
• [1Co 1:21 NASB] 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not [come to] know God, God was well-pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
• [Eph 1:13-14 NASB] 13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is given as a pledge of our inheritance, with a view to the redemption of [God's own] possession, to the praise of His glory.

From the above:

1. I need to confess that Jesus is God.
2. I need to believe that God raised Jesus from the dead.
3. Christ died for our sins.
4. Christ was buried and raised.
5. we have to believe foolishness to be saved.
6. After hearing and believing, God seals us with the Holy Spirit and we inherit "something"

So the only thing that I need to do is confess that Jesus is God and believe that God raised him from the dead. Whew, I was afraid I would have to stop living a reprobate lifestyle and actually DO something. But this salvation is so easy, even a demon can do it!

Now if you want to look up the verses in the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563 and do the same thing for the Reformed Gospel, be my guest.

As an evangelist who speaks regularly in the towns and cites and can assure you I'm not reciting the Heidelberg Catechism of 1563. I can very easily explain the Gospel from the verses above in the correct way and order .

The Content of the Gospel is 1 cor 15 . 1-4 Kjv

The definition of the Gospel is Rom 1.16 kjv

The application / appropriation of the gospel is Romans 10.9+10 kjv

The order of salvation is Ephesians 1.13-14 .( Salvation is eternally secured by the sealing of the spirit, not “election.” )kjv

1 cor 1.21 says that God is pleased to save those that believe, not cause belief in those he saves.God’s sovereignty in salvation means that he executes it in accordance with Scripture .kjv

 

[Barry Johnson]

Here's my summary:

View attachment 4209

John 12 .32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me

 

[Barry Johnson]

In regards to the Gospel, calvinism teaches and affirms highest view of the grace of God!

The Authority of the scriptures is how we understand the Gospel ,not philosophy.

 

[Barry Johnson]

In regards to the Gospel, calvinism teaches and affirms highest view of the grace of God!

Grace is a ubiquitous reality, not a selective force. (Tit. 2:11-13

Grace is just fine on it’s own as it’s found in scripture. Any modifier other than “free,” such as “sovereign,” “irresistible,” or “prevenient” indicate someone is either confused or attempting to confuse. (Rom. 3:24; 5:15; Jn. 1:16; Tit. 2:11-13)

 

[Yeshua1]

The Authority of the scriptures is how we understand the Gospel ,not philosophy.

All calvinists would say Amen!

 

[Barry Johnson]

All calvinists would say Amen!

I dont assume they think otherwise. Its only evident to those outside of Calvinism. Thats how strong the mind is once it fixes on something.

 

[JonC]

John 12 .32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me

Good verse.

I need to be clear here - I am not saying that I hold to a Calvinistic understanding of the gospel. At one time I was a Calvinist, but that was years ago. I am saying it is good to see a member explaining the gospel in accordance with his understanding.

Some people understand the gospel through Calvinism and that is fine. It is nothing to me but perhaps everything to that other person. I would not want to sway a Calvinist away from Calvinism because that is not my role on this forum or in life.

What if that Calvinist believed Calvinism was actually the gospel? I'd be risking removing not only error but also the gospel contained within that error. We are accountable to God and Christ can make us stand - whether holding Calvinism, Arminianism, Amyrladianism, Free-Will Theology, etc.

The gospel of Jesus Christ is not altered by our understanding of it.

That said, discussion can be had. If you want to discuss faults within any system you have to find people who held but have left that system. A Calvinist is not qualified to deal with errors within Calvinist any more than an Open Theist is qualified to deal with errors in their theology. The disqualification being a lack of ability (a Calvinist is not capable of seeing any error in Calvinism, otherwise they would cease to be a Calvinist).

 

[Yeshua1]

Good verse.

I need to be clear here - I am not saying that I hold to a Calvinistic understanding of the gospel. At one time I was a Calvinist, but that was years ago.

Some people understand the gospel through Calvinism and that is fine. It is nothing to me but perhaps everything to that other person. I would not want to sway a Calvinist away from Calvinism because that is not my role on this forum or in life.

What if that Calvinist believed Calvinism was actually the gospel? I'd be risking removing not only error but also the gospel contained within that error. We are accountable to God and Christ can make us stand - whether holding Calvinism, Arminianism, Amyrladianism, Free-Will Theology, etc.

The gospel of Jesus Christ is not altered by our understanding of it.

That said, discussion can be had. If you want to discuss faults within any system you have to find people who held but have left that system. A Calvinist is not qualified to deal with errors within Calvinist any more than an Open Theist is qualified to deal with errors in their theology. The disqualification being a lack of ability (a Calvinist is not capable of seeing any error in Calvinism, otherwise they would cease to be a Calvinist).

we have to define though what is meant by terms such as world and all?

 

[JonC]

we have to define though what is meant by terms such as world and all?

Everyone (regardless of "camps") need to define their terms. There has been a reluctance on the part of some to do this (requests that terms be defined are ignored) and this only fosters inaccuracy and error.

People do not have to agree on definitions, but in order to effectively communicate they do need to understand how one another defines words as well as the "baggage" terms may carry under opposing perspectives.

It would be outstanding if all sides were forthright about theological presuppositions, but it is very often that people are unable to see presuppositions that they hold.

 

[Yeshua1]

Everyone (regardless of "camps") need to define their terms. There has been a reluctance on the part of some to do this (requests that terms be defined are ignored) and this only fosters inaccuracy and error.

People do not have to agree on definitions, but in order to effectively communicate they do need to understand how one another defines words as well as the "baggage" terms may carry under opposing perspectives.

It would be outstanding if all sides were forthright about theological presuppositions, but it is very often that people are unable to see presuppositions that they hold.

free will would be a big one to be defined by all posting here!

 

[JonC]

free will would be a big one to be defined by all posting here!

Free will - the opposite of "not free-will"