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The Effects Of Calvinism On Scripture

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by MB, Dec 10, 2019.

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  1. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    "Who would have pleasure in the death of the wicked?"
    The greater wicked.

    "But God would not be good if he didn't kill sinners and send them to hell. "
    So now you deny the sovereignty of God? God is forced to do something he does not want to do?

    Killing sinners and sending them to hell is not a requisite of Good, it is however greatly encouraged by Evil.

    Calvinist Jesus would have certainly stoned the woman caught in adultery.

    Satan favors your version of God, the worst the news, the less mercy found, the better. The reliance of making others suffer, sadism, thats the meat and potatoes of the devil.
     
  2. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Six Hour Warning
    This thread will be closed sometime after 8 PM Pacific.
     
  3. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    The only things I'm not aware of is the proof of any Calvinist doctrine. Your welcome to show me scripture to prove them if you wish though I've most likely seen all the scriptures Calvinist use to support there doctrines and every one has proved nothing of the sort that the Calvinist claim

    None of this for example is supported by your Calvinism. Jn' 3:16 destroys your idea of only some that Christ died for.
    MB
     
  4. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    Utilyan, when a criminal is found guilty and the judge sentences them according to the guidelines of the law, is that judge doing good or doing evil?

    Would a judge that refuses to sentence a criminal, but instead lets them free with no consequence for breaking the law be a good and loving judge?
     
  5. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    This one is called Justice, and without forgiveness. what we all deserve, when do not ask for
    forgiveness.

    The Last is actually best. It's called forgiveness. We all sin of course but the forgiveness is glorious to God and us to be forgiven. For giving is rare among people.Yet God has commanded all of us to forgive. The Calvinist rejects forgiveness as anything glorious the natural man can do.Though more natural men do it than Calvinist.
    MB
     
    #165 MB, Dec 13, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  6. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    Have you ever seen an addict beg for forgiveness while still using? I have. Have you seen a murderer beg for forgiveness? I have? Was the judge unloving when he sentenced him according to the guidelines, even though he begged for forgiveness?
    I have seen families forgive a murderer, but applaud the just sentencing.
    You see, MB, justice is an act of love. Injustice is an act of evil. You are glorying in injustice.

    God killed his perfect Son to justly apply the law to my sin. Sin does not come with no cost. God does not judge our sin, because Jesus atonement paid for our sin. It is Jesus imputed righteousness on our behalf that saves us, not our begging for forgiveness that saves us.
    When John wrote: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins," he was writing to those who were already redeemed, not to unredeemed rebels.
    God doesn't forgive us because we beg him. God forgives us because Christ paid the debt for our lawbreaking and sin.
     
  7. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    NOT true.Not one of us deserve forgiveness
    I've been in more court rooms than I ever wanted to be praying for defendants to get mercy.
    God does not forgive for anything but Love and few there be that you can honestly say are really saved.
    I've also seen an innocent man sent to prison and was there 16 years for a crime he didn't commit I call this injustice.
    Stop comparing God to human judges they do not compare.
    MB
     
    #167 MB, Dec 13, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  8. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    Does God throw innocent men in prison?
     
  9. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    This is why you can't compare God with men. God is the Judge Jesus is the advocate if you have Jesus well enough said Guilty or not you win because of forgiveness.
    MB
     
  10. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    You didn't answer my question.
    Does God throw innocent men in prison?
     
  11. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    No Man does that.
    MB
     
  12. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    Correct.
    This means that God is loving when he justly sends lawbreakers to hell, because God never sends an innocent person to prison.
    It would be unloving and unjust if a lawbreaker didn't have to pay the required penalty that the law demanded. The judge who ignored the requirements of the law would be an unjust judge and therefore an unloving judge.
    So, let's look at John 3:16 in that light.
    “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

    God gave his Son as the payment for sin and whoever has faith to believe he atoned for their sins will not be sentenced to hell, but instead will have eternal life because...God lovec the world.
     
    #172 Particular, Dec 13, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  13. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    That's the bible story..
    MB
     
  14. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    [

    We are all guilty and deserve hell. But because of asking God to be forgiven set's us free.
    MB
     
  15. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    Like when the criminal was found being a JEW and is sentenced to death as his NAZI master demands?

    The Judge is doing EVIL.


    "Would a judge that refuses to sentence a criminal, but instead lets them free with no consequence for breaking the law be a good and loving judge?"

    Like when a Criminal was found being a JEW? He might even be a HERO.

    Your sense of justice is trash. Soley based on the retribution and distribution of suffering.

    The Character you hold of God is just as evil as randomly strapping a bomb to a little girl, setting it off to kill people and then blaming the girl for it. No difference what-so-ever

    If some omnipotent Demon or Alien ever landed on earth.......you are the first guy we will all look at to sell us out.

    All that demon or alien has to do is get a Jesus name tag.

    God is constantly tells you what is the right thing. The right thing isn't the EASY thing. You have to be sincere to your good conscience.

    You prob always going to have a selfish perspective until its someone you care about on the chopping block.

    Your ultimate opposition is someone who loves everyone wants no one to suffer. I don't even have to put a Jesus name tag on him. He has the highest love. Endless mercy. He absolutely knows no fear. He doesn't need POWER to be the most powerful, He doesn't need a crown to make him king. What you got is a playground joke, a bully child's perspective of power.
     
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  16. Walpole

    Walpole Well-Known Member

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    Perfectly said!
     
  17. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    That's the theology you despise and call Calvinism.
     
  18. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Calvinism is not in Jn 3;16. Calvinism demands that you be elect. It tells us God does not need you to believe until after you are saved. Calvinism places the cart before the horse. Calvinism forces Salvation.
    MB
     
  19. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Calvinism for all intents and purposes is not supported by scripture None of it's tulip is found in scripture. this makes it a religion of man not God.
    There is no whosoever believes in Calvinism Only determinism.
    MB
     
  20. Particular

    Particular Well-Known Member

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    So, by your claim, God is evil. God says we all have sinned and the wages of sin is death.

    Are Jews not sinners like Gentiles? Does God view them as sinless and perfect? If, they are sinners, do they not deserve God's wrath like you and I deserve his wrath?
    It seems you despise justice, utilyan. God judges based on his moral law. He judges justly, yet you say he judges without merit. Your hatred of God is evident.
    Hyperbole aside, you simply show you are biblically ignorant at best and a hater of God at worst.
    Once again, this shows your biblical ignorance. It seems you may get your theology from the movie Aliens.
    So he's of Latin descent, not Jewish...

    Where do we find that in scripture, utilyan? Or is this a line from the syfy movie you are referencing?
    I have watched people die in front of my eyes, utilyan. I know much about sorrow and grief. God's grace has been profoundly helpful. But, you're not trying to make a point, you're just displaying the hatred you have in your heart. I forgive you.
    You have yourself dressed up like the Jesus you want to worship, not the Jesus of the Bible.
    The Jesus of the Bible spoke more about hell than anyone else in scripture. He warned people of their peril and need for repentance. He told people what the outcome is if they refused to repent and believe. He is a just and loving judge and King. Do you know this Jesus, utilyan, or do you only know the Jesus you made up in your head?
    What I have is a King who rules on his throne.

    Revelation 21:5-8 And he who was seated on the throne said, “Behold, I am making all things new.” Also he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.” And he said to me, “It is done! I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. To the thirsty I will give from the spring of the water of life without payment. The one who conquers will have this heritage, and I will be his God and he will be my son. But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

    Utilyan, you scream against God, not me. Everyone who reads what you wrote and what you have claimed here can see your heart and I pray they will pray for you and ask God to help you with the anger you have burning in your heart.
     
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