\
to be a sheep, believe if one hasn't believed, they are not sheep
He came to seek and to save the lost,
Luk 19:10
For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.
Are your elect ,not lost?
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
The Extent of Jesus' Death
- Thread starter Acts2.21
- Start date
- Status
to be a sheep, believe if one hasn't believed, they are not sheep
He came to seek and to save the lost,
Luk 19:10
For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.
Are your elect ,not lost?
They, we all have the same opportunity, or does God have favorites?
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
The sheep believe because Christ died for them. If people ultimately do not believe, it is because he did not.
the debt is paid , total, It is your fault if you choose not to receive the gift
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
God is no respecter of persons. This is why "foreseeing faith in some" is a false belief.
Our belief does not change the fact the price has been paid, We only believe correctly when we accept the finished work of Christ. Our belief only affects us ,not Jesus.
If no one believed, total sin would have been paid
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
But this makes you the savior, not Jesus.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
If God saves the helpless, he gets the glory. If you save yourself, you get the glory.
OldArmy
Member
Atonement and application, it seems to me as if you conflate the two.
that would be choosing favorites but the verse does not say as you present
And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
The verse says the opposite, the heathen would be saved depending on faith,
So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
no, we cant save ourselves, We must depend on God, alone, God gets the glory
OldArmy
Member
Ding! Ding! Ding!
OldArmy
Member
Um, no it doesn't.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
If your unregenerate (fleshly) "decision" saves you, you are the savior based on works and self-righteousness. Grace saves those who cannot believe, turning them into believers and lovers of God through the new birth.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
But God saves us when we cannot believe turning us into believers through the new birth.
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
God is a respecter of persons if he chose you based on your foreseen goodness. But instead, he arbitrarily chose many who had no goodness for salvation at Christ's expense.
Let's revisit the concept of the atonement as it relates to the Christ.
First, the blood. The blood was shed and some captured into a bowl and sprinkled upon the mercy seat. It was not for a select few but for all (even strangers) who were dwelling "in the land."
The Lord by virtue of the creator of all, and nothing exists that He did not create, shed His blood for all in the land - even the strangers to His grace.
However, the other aspect of the atonement was that it had death and life. The lamb died, the scapegoat lived and was lead outside the camp.
The Christ died, not from loss of blood, but because He surrendered His Spirit to God (the Father). Does not the Scriptures teach in John 10:
What verse then states that the death and resurrection are only beneficial to the believer?
1 Peter 3:
1 Corinthians 15:
Romans 6:
So, the principle is that it is that the death and resurrection only benefits the believer, but the blood removed that which stood between God and man, and by the removal Paul could then preach reconciliation that those who were given by the Father to believe (as John 10 shows) would believe (as John 10 shows) and that nothing could remove them from the Christ or Father. (as John 10 and Romans 8 show).
First, the blood. The blood was shed and some captured into a bowl and sprinkled upon the mercy seat. It was not for a select few but for all (even strangers) who were dwelling "in the land."
The Lord by virtue of the creator of all, and nothing exists that He did not create, shed His blood for all in the land - even the strangers to His grace.
However, the other aspect of the atonement was that it had death and life. The lamb died, the scapegoat lived and was lead outside the camp.
The Christ died, not from loss of blood, but because He surrendered His Spirit to God (the Father). Does not the Scriptures teach in John 10:
What verse then states that the death and resurrection are only beneficial to the believer?
1 Peter 3:
18For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, 19in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, 20because they formerly did not obey, when God’s patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water.21Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, 22who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers having been subjected to him.
12Now if Christ is proclaimed as raised from the dead, how can some of you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? 13But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even Christ has been raised.14And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain. 15We are even found to be misrepresenting God, because we testified about God that he raised Christ, whom he did not raise if it is true that the dead are not raised. 16For if the dead are not raised, not even Christ has been raised. 17And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile and you are still in your sins. 18Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ have perished. 19If in Christ we have hope in this life only, we are of all people most to be pitied.
5For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his. 6We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin. 7For one who has died has been set freeb from sin. 8Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him. 10For the death he died he died to sin, once for all, but the life he lives he lives to God. 11So you also must consider yourselves dead to sin and alive to God in Christ Jesus.
So, the principle is that it is that the death and resurrection only benefits the believer, but the blood removed that which stood between God and man, and by the removal Paul could then preach reconciliation that those who were given by the Father to believe (as John 10 shows) would believe (as John 10 shows) and that nothing could remove them from the Christ or Father. (as John 10 and Romans 8 show).
1689Dave
Well-Known Member
Who would accept Christ who didn't already believe in him? You must believe or you would never choose to believe.
Who would believe in Christ if they did not already accept Him?
Kind of circular don't you think?
- Status