The Glorious "Gospel of Election"

[canadyjd]

All have the truth presented to them. It is what is done with that truth that matters and condemns. If no truth is presented, no condemnation can be made. Even the calvinist believes those who perish reject Christ, so how can one not know the truth...but still reject it

I believe all have rejected God's revelation, based on Romans 1. That is the truth that is rejected and which condemns.

I don't believe all have heard and rejected the gospel of Christ, though those who do will have that fact presented as "exhibit A" in their judgment.

(edit) Looks like AmyG beat me to it.:thumbs:

peace to youraying:

 

[Frogman]

:laugh: Amen.

BTW, Ancient China believed the emperor to be the 'son' of heaven. imagine that, sounds similar to the gospel message, to the kingdom of God, etc, perverted, but still have to wonder where did they get such an idea//??

Check Heb. 11:13

God has not changed.

bro. Dallas:wavey:

 

[Brother Bob]

Rom 10:16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Rom 10:17So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Rom 10:18But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

 

[Brother Bob]

Luther held onto alot of RCC error.

The truth is the belief or disbelief of election or the process of election would have no effect whatsoever on one's condition.


The most beautiful difference between C/A is that all who believe their choice is what set them apart from other sinners were also elected just as much as anyone who believes God chose them. :thumbs:

bro. Dallas:wavey:

Also, just a beautiful is the fact that all who believe that God chose them, also believe that "they must believe".........

 

[canadyjd]

:laugh: Amen.

BTW, Ancient China believed the emperor to be the 'son' of heaven. imagine that, sounds similar to the gospel message, to the kingdom of God, etc, perverted, but still have to wonder where did they get such an idea?

Satan is a great counterfieter. Emperor Augustus called himself "the son of a god", because his father was Juilius Ceasar, and Ceasar was declared to be "a god" after he died. Clever fellow, Satan. The Emperor of Rome was calling himself, "the son of a god" when the one and only Son of God was born in Judea.

BTW, I had a prof. is seminary, one of the most humble, godly men I have ever met. He said the first time he heard of predistination/election, he got so mad he wanted to spit. But the more he studied, the more he could not deny the testimony of scripture to the truth of the doctrine.

The more he understood scripture, the more he appreciated God's grace in his own life, even to the point of seeing God's hand in his birth in a country where the gospel could come to him, and in his godly parents and so on. And the more he understood, the more urgent witnessing to the truth of the gospel became to him.

What if the person I meet and witness to at the gas station will only have that one opportunity to hear the gospel? What an incredible priviledge that Almighty God would include me in bringing salvation to men.

peace to youraying:

 

[Amy.G]

Rom 10:16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
Rom 10:17So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Rom 10:18But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

I think these verses refer to the Jews who had heard. Not the entire earth.

 

[Amy.G]

BTW, I had a prof. is seminary, one of the most humble, godly men I have ever met. He said the first time he heard of predistination/election, he got so mad he wanted to spit. But the more he studied, the more he could not deny the testimony of scripture to the truth of the doctrine.

peace to youraying:

Sounds like me. Except for the "humble man" part. :laugh:

 

[Brother Bob]

I think these verses refer to the Jews who had heard. Not the entire earth.

Romans 1:




1: Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
2: (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
3: Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;
4: And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
5: By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
6: Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:
7: To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
8: First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.


10: For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11: For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
12: For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.
13: For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14: How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
15: And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
16: But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
17: So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
18: But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Scripture speaks for itself.

 

[canadyjd]

Rom 10:16But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

Rom 10:17So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Rom 10:18But I say, Have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world.

Paul is quoting from Psalm 19, "the heavens are declaring the glory of God...."

He is refering to the general revelation that has gone out to the ends of the earth, but did not save. Now comes the specific revelation of Christ that must, too, go out to the ends of the earth, but has not yet reached that goal. Thus the need for a preacher to preach the gospel.

peace to youraying:

 

[Brother Bob]

Paul is quoting from Psalm 19, "the heavens are declaring the glory of God...."

He is refering to the general revelation that has gone out to the ends of the earth, but did not save. Now comes the specific revelation of Christ that must, too, go out to the ends of the earth, but has not yet reached that goal. Thus the need for a preacher to preach the gospel.

peace to youraying:

What did the general revelation do???


18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness

 

[canadyjd]

Sounds like me. Except for the "humble man" part. :laugh:

A boy named Sue...errr...Amy? Humble woman, then.:wavey:

It is not a coincident that those who hold to the doctrines of grace tend to base their beliefs on scripture. Those who deny them, tend to base their beliefs on their emotional response to the doctrines.

How many times I have heard, "I won't worship a God that........(fill in the anti-grace mantra here)", as if they have a choice.

peace to youraying:

 

[Amy.G]

Paul is writing about the Jews that he desires to come to Christ because the prophets had been declaring the coming of the Messiah for ages past ("surely they (the Jews) have never heard, have they? Indeed they have!")
They (the Jews) had heard because of the prophets.

Paul isn't talking about all the earth hearing the gospel.

 

[Brother Bob]

A boy named Sue...errr...Amy? Humble woman, then.:wavey:

It is not a coincident that those who hold to the doctrines of grace tend to base their beliefs on scripture. Those who deny them, tend to base their beliefs on their emotional response to the doctrines.

How many times I have heard, "I won't worship a God that........(fill in the anti-grace mantra here)", as if they have a choice.

peace to youraying:

Like these:

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

1 Timothy 2:3-6 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

BBob,

 

[Amy.G]

What did the general revelation do???


18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness

I think it condemns us all until we put our faith in the Savior.

 

[canadyjd]

What did the general revelation do???


18: For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness

Looks like it brought only wrath (because it was rejected by all). It certainly didn't bring salvation. Thus the need for a preacher to preach the good news of Christ to the whole world.

peace to youraying:

 

[Amy.G]

1 Timothy 2:3-6 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
BBob,

If God will have all men to be saved, why aren't all men saved? Why isn't God's will done to save all men?

If it's God's will to save all men, why aren't they, since Paul says "who resists His will"? (Romans 9:19)

 

[Brother Bob]

I think it condemns us all until we put our faith in the Savior.

would that condemnation go into all the world? Also, what is that condemnation Amy ?

 

[Brother Bob]

If God will have all men to be saved, why aren't all men saved? Why isn't God's will done to save all men?

If it's God's will to save all men, why aren't they, since Paul says "who resists His will"? (Romans 9:19)

Rom 13:2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

If God's will were always done, there would be no sin. Surely you don't believe it was God's will for that daughter and boyfriend kill her entire family, do you?

 

[Frogman]

Dear Brother Bob,
I believe Amy already answered the general revelation question.

Is this a good place to state the topic of this thread is not related to Absolute Predestination. I have noticed alot of people on both sides of the questions here believe the election of God's children means there is an election unto condemnation.

That is not the case. The fact that a person sins does not mean God has decreed that act.

bro. Dallas:wavey:

 

[Brother Bob]

Looks like it brought only wrath (because it was rejected by all). It certainly didn't bring salvation. Thus the need for a preacher to preach the good news of Christ to the whole world.

peace to youraying:

If it was rejected by all Canadajd; they must of heard it or somehow knew of it, to disobey it. Would you agree or not.

BBob,