The Irrefutable Sabbath Facts

[Yeshua1]

hint - there is NO QJOTE of the text of the 3rd commandment - not to take God's name in vain.

But the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from several times in the NT - including Heb 4, and Rev 14:7.

The 4th commandment is Explicitly affirmed by the Baptist Confession of Faith as still applicable to the saints today..

So also do Andy Stanley, D.L. Moody, R.C. Sproul, C.H. Spurgeon specifically admit that the 4th commandment is still applicable to Christians today.

They get this simple Bible truth.

others could grasp it as well if they chose to.

in Christ,

Bob

Where did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the Sabbath day is still binding upon NT saints?

KNOW Ellen White states that it still is, where is ANY NT writer advocating that also?

 

[BobRyan]

Where did Jesus or any Apsotle write down in the NT canon that the Sabbath day is still binding upon NT saints?

Hint the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from in the NT - the text of the 3rd commandment "do not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain" is NEVER quoted in the NT.

Why did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the 3d commandment day is still binding? Possibly because the man made tradition "whatever is not repeated gets deleted" is a bogus doctrine not found in the Bible.

Meanwhile the Baptist Confession of Faith freely admits to the obvious Bible fact that BOTH of those commandments are STILL binding on the saints today and apply under the NEW Covenant.

(As Andy Stanley points out -a form of breaking the THIRD commandment is to make the bogus argument that God told you not to keep one of the TEN Commandments.)

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Yeshua1]

Hint the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from in the NT - the text of the 3rd commandment "do not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain" is NEVER quoted in the NT.

Why did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the 3d commandment day is still binding? Possibly because the man made tradition "whatever is not repeated gets deleted" is a bogus doctrine not found in the Bible.

Meanwhile the Baptist Confession of Faith freely admits to the obvious Bible fact that BOTH of those commandments are STILL binding on the saints today and apply under the NEW Covenant.

(As Andy Stanley points out -a form of breaking the THIRD commandment is to make the bogus argument that God told you not to keep one of the TEN Commandments.)

in Christ,

Bob

So you are admitting that there are NO NT verses to support the Sabbath day of isreal was placed back upojn the Church!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Where did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the Sabbath day is still binding upon NT saints?

KNOW Ellen White states that it still is, where is ANY NT writer advocating that also?

Legalists never tire of their legalism.
Legalists only demand <<Jesus or Apostle write down in the NT canon that the Sabbath day is still binding upon NT saints>>. NOBODY THAN THEY!

Meantime ...

Because Christ rose from the dead as FORETOLD throughout all Scripture, Old, AS, NEW, Testament, and as FULFILLED throughout all Scripture, Old, AS, NEW, Testament, "on the Sabbath in its fullness of being daylight mid-afternoon as it began to dawn towards the First Day of the week" ...

... meantime ...

... "THEREFORE", and "therefore" ONLY: "JESUS HAVING GIVEN THEM REST, KEEPING OF THE SABBATH DAY REMAINS <binding>, FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD."

NOT for any NOT of the People of God; ONLY "for the People of God ... for God THUS CONCERNING THE SEVENTH DAY SPAKE" ---"spake" of no other day, ever, "... in these last days ... BY THE SON."

Now reckon, neither <<Jesus or Apostle wr(o)te down in the NT canon that the Sabbath day is still binding upon NT saints>>!

Shucks!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

So you are admitting that there are NO NT verses to support the Sabbath day of isreal was placed back upojn the Church!

No one need admit such thing; the onus to <support> such 'back-placing' rests with the speaker, 'Yeshua1'.

But it was in fact no <<Sabbath day of isreal (that) was placed back upojn the Church>>.
Jesus made, created and gave the CHRISTIAN AND NEW TESTAMENT Sabbath to the Christian and New Testament Church HAVING RAISED FROM THE DEAD AND GRAVE, ON IT. “Thus God”—before any man—, “on the day the Seventh Day, from all his works, rested.”

 

[BobRyan]

Originally Posted by BobRyan
Hint the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from in the NT - the text of the 3rd commandment "do not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain" is NEVER quoted in the NT.

Why did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the 3d commandment day is still binding? Possibly because the man made tradition "whatever is not repeated gets deleted" is a bogus doctrine not found in the Bible.

Meanwhile the Baptist Confession of Faith freely admits to the obvious Bible fact that BOTH of those commandments are STILL binding on the saints today and apply under the NEW Covenant.

(As Andy Stanley points out -a form of breaking the THIRD commandment is to make the bogus argument that God told you not to keep one of the TEN Commandments.)
==========================

in that post above - I point out that the THIRD commandment ("do not take God's name in vain") is NEVER quoted from in the NT.

I contrast that by pointing out that the FOURTH Commandment (regarding the Sabbath ) IS quoted from a number of times IN THE NT.

And I conclude by pointing that BOTH are STILL applicable (as even the Baptist Confession of Faith admits) because there is NO such thing as "deleting whatever is not repeated" and the THIRD commandment is NOT repeated.

To which we get this non sequitur

So you are admitting that there are NO NT verses to support the Sabbath day

How odd -

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Yeshua1]

Originally Posted by BobRyan
Hint the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from in the NT - the text of the 3rd commandment "do not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain" is NEVER quoted in the NT.

Why did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the 3d commandment day is still binding? Possibly because the man made tradition "whatever is not repeated gets deleted" is a bogus doctrine not found in the Bible.

Meanwhile the Baptist Confession of Faith freely admits to the obvious Bible fact that BOTH of those commandments are STILL binding on the saints today and apply under the NEW Covenant.

(As Andy Stanley points out -a form of breaking the THIRD commandment is to make the bogus argument that God told you not to keep one of the TEN Commandments.)
==========================

in that post above - I point out that the THIRD commandment ("do not take God's name in vain") is NEVER quoted from in the NT.

I contrast that by pointing out that the FOURTH Commandment (regarding the Sabbath ) IS quoted from a number of times IN THE NT.

And I conclude by pointing that BOTH are STILL applicable (as even the Baptist Confession of Faith admits) because there is NO such thing as "deleting whatever is not repeated" and the THIRD commandment is NOT repeated.

To which we get this non sequitur



How odd -

in Christ,

Bob

Who should we heed as to how Christians operate in relationship to the Law and the sabbath?

Jesus and Paul
Ellen White
Writers on Confessions
Well?

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Originally Posted by BobRyan
Hint the text of the 4th commandment IS quoted from in the NT - the text of the 3rd commandment "do not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain" is NEVER quoted in the NT.

Why did Jesus or any Apostle write down in the NT canon that the 3d commandment day is still binding? Possibly because the man made tradition "whatever is not repeated gets deleted" is a bogus doctrine not found in the Bible.

Meanwhile the Baptist Confession of Faith freely admits to the obvious Bible fact that BOTH of those commandments are STILL binding on the saints today and apply under the NEW Covenant.

(As Andy Stanley points out -a form of breaking the THIRD commandment is to make the bogus argument that God told you not to keep one of the TEN Commandments.)
==========================

in that post above - I point out that the THIRD commandment ("do not take God's name in vain") is NEVER quoted from in the NT.

I contrast that by pointing out that the FOURTH Commandment (regarding the Sabbath ) IS quoted from a number of times IN THE NT.

And I conclude by pointing that BOTH are STILL applicable (as even the Baptist Confession of Faith admits) because there is NO such thing as "deleting whatever is not repeated" and the THIRD commandment is NOT repeated.

To which we get this non sequitur



How odd -

in Christ,

Bob

A valid argument worth taking and making note of, and, to take to heart, Sundayers!

Where's your similar argument for Sunday sacredness then?

No, you needed something far better and stronger for proof of your Sunday sacredness. Which you don't have either.

So you have to manufacture it yourself. And the only way to get Jesus rise on Sunday from the dead, is by covering up the truth He rose and would rise from the dead on God's Day-of-Rest, "the day The Seventh Day Sabbath of the LORD GOD."

It so much as in so many words is written in the Fourth Commandment that "God the Seventh Day REVIVED". Then God REVIVED Christ in the New Testament Scriptures "on the Sabbath"; but you still say the Fourth Commandment is not repeated in the New Testament.

THAT IS ODD! because the very exact WORD that Christ revived on is repeated in the New Testament. And repeated indeed it is FROM the Fourth Commandment that "God THUS CONCERNING The Seventh Day spake: And God the day The Seventh Day from all his works rested.

THAT now, is PLAIN SILLY RIDICULOUS the Fourth and Sabbath Commandment is not repeated in the New Testament!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Who should we heed as to how Christians operate in relationship to the Law and the sabbath?

Jesus and Paul
Ellen White
Writers on Confessions
Well?

One, Irrelevant;

Two, Find out on Judgment Day!

 

[BobRyan]

Who should we heed as to how Christians operate in relationship to the Law and the sabbath?

Jesus and Paul
Ellen White
Confessions of Faith?
(Baptist Confession of Faith)
(Westminster Confession of Faith)


Well?

Since they all agree on that - I guess you can take your pick.

For now you appear to settle for 'none of the above' - which I for one - find very odd.

Romans 2:13

Prov 28:9

1John 2:3-6

1John 5:2-3

Rev 14:12 the saints "KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus"

Rom 3:31 "Do we then make void the law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we ESTABLISH the Law of God!"

1Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"

Mark 7:6-13 Christ calls the Commandments - the "Commandment of God" and calls it "The WORD of God" and also condemns the traditions of man that try to set it aside.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Speaking of irrefutable Sabbath facts and sources that Y1 enjoys ignoring -

Here is what D.L. Moody thought were irrefutable facts for the Sabbath
=================

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2011586&postcount=65

Originally Posted by BobRyan

Moody makes HIS claim as he opposes Sabbath breakers.

DWIGHT L. MOODY

The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17 ​

.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.

​

THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly?You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales?Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was.I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.

"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)

It isjust as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins withthe word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stoneat Sinai.How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away [FONT=&quot]with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; if you give up the church the home goes; and if the home goes the nation goes. That is the direction in which we are traveling.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]=======================================

1. Moody claims the 4th commandment - Sabbath was given to MANKIND in Eden. So does the Baptist Confession of Faith - by contrast DHK thinks it was only given to Israel - starting at Sinai.

2. Moody claims that the Sabbath - of the 4th commandment REMAINS in effect from Eden until today and is just as needful today as it ever was. By contrast DHK condemns Sabbath keepers.

3. Moody claims that Sabbath breakers who insist that the 4th commandment Sabbath was done away with have no grounds to stand on. DHK claims that he vehemently opposes Sabbath KEEPERS.[/FONT]

 

[Yeshua1]

Speaking of irrefutable Sabbath facts and sources that Y1 enjoys ignoring -

Here is what D.L. Moody thought were irrefutable facts for the Sabbath
=================

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2011586&postcount=65

Originally Posted by BobRyan

Moody makes HIS claim as he opposes Sabbath breakers.

DWIGHT L. MOODY

The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17 ​

.
The Fourth Commandment
Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.

​

THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly?You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales?Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was.I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.

"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)

It isjust as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins withthe word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stoneat Sinai.How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away [FONT=&quot]with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes; if you give up the church the home goes; and if the home goes the nation goes. That is the direction in which we are traveling.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]=======================================

1. Moody claims the 4th commandment - Sabbath was given to MANKIND in Eden. So does the Baptist Confession of Faith - by contrast DHK thinks it was only given to Israel - starting at Sinai.

2. Moody claims that the Sabbath - of the 4th commandment REMAINS in effect from Eden until today and is just as needful today as it ever was. By contrast DHK condemns Sabbath keepers.

3. Moody claims that Sabbath breakers who insist that the 4th commandment Sabbath was done away with have no grounds to stand on. DHK claims that he vehemently opposes Sabbath KEEPERS.[/FONT]

starnge that you keep citing Him and others, but NEVER Jesus or Paul?

 

[BobRyan]

How odd that the reference to Jesus' words in Mark 2:27 (that you quote) is not accepted by you as a statement "by Jesus" but rather you take it as a reference to D.L. Moody.

Is it your claim that if D.L. Moody accepts a given Bible text - where Jesus is speaking - that it is no longer Jesus in that text - but it is now D.L. Moody??

What kind of exegesis is that?

 

[BobRyan]

In yet another example on this same thread - I quote God. For those here who deny that Jesus is God - then you may also reject this as evidence of Jesus' words?

Originally Posted by BobRyan
Here is the 4th Commandment I mentioned above.

Ex 20
8 ""Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 "" Sixdays you shall labor and do all your work,
10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you or your son or your daughter, your male or your female servant or your cattle or your sojourner who stays with you.
11 "" For in six days the LORD made theheavens and the earth, the sea and allthat is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day andmade it holy.


Ex 16
23 then he said to them, ""This is what the LORD meant: Tomorrow is the Sabbath observance, a holy Sabbath to the LORD. Bake what you will bake and boil what you will boil, and all that is left over put aside to be kept until morning.''
24 So they put it aside until morning, as Moses had ordered, and it did not become foul nor was there any worm in it.
25 Moses said, ""Eat it today, for today is a Sabbath to the LORD; today you will not find it in the field.
26 "" Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day, the Sabbath, there will be none.''
27 It came about on the seventh day that some of the people went out to gather, but they found none.

=============================
Gen 2
2 By the seventh day God completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done.
3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
4 This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made earth and heaven.

 

[BobRyan]

Here is "yet another example" where Jesus and Paul and everyone under the sun in the Bible - is being referenced.

Since you ask about your own Baptist Confession of Faith - the one I am quoting from reads like this -

http://www.creeds.net/baptists/1689/kerkham/1689.htm#Ch19

THE LAW OF GOD

19.1 God gave to Adam a law of universal obedience written in his heart,1 and a specific precept not to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.2 By this he bound him and all his descendants to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience. God promised life on fulfilling it, and threatened death on breaching it, and he endued him with power and ability to keep it.3
(1) Gen 1:27; Ecc 7:29; Rom 2:12a,14-15
(2) Gen 2:16-17
(3) Gen 2:16-17; Rom 10:5; Gal 3:10,12


19.2 The same law that was first written in the human heart continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the fall.1 It was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in TEN commandments (written in two tables) the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six our duty to our fellow beings.3
(1) For the Fourth Commandment: Gen 2:3; Exo 16; Gen 7:4; 8:10,12. For the Fifth Commandment: Gen 37:10. For the Sixth Commandment: Gen 4:3-15. For the Seventh Commandment: Gen 12:17. For the Eighth Commandment: Gen 31:30; 44:8. For the Ninth Commandment: Gen 27:12. For the Tenth Commandment: Gen 6:2; 13:10-11
(2) Rom 2:12a,14-15
(3) Exo 32:15-16; 34:4,28; Deu 10:4


19.3 Besides this law, commonly called the moral law, God was pleased to give the people of Israel ceremonial laws containing several typical ordinances. These were partly concerning worship, and in them Christ was prefigured—his graces, actions, sufferings, and benefits.1 They also gave instructions about various moral duties.2 All of these ceremonial laws were appointed only until the time of the New Testament, when Jesus Christ abrogated them and took them away, for he was the true Messiah and only law-giver, and was empowered to do this by the Father.3
(1) Heb 10:1; Col 2:16-17
(2) 1Co 5:7; 2Co 6:17; Jude 1:23
(3) Col 2:14,16-17; Eph 2:14-16


19.4 To the people of Israel he also gave various judicial laws which lapsed when they ceased as a nation. These are not binding on anyone now by virtue of their being part of the laws of that nation,1 but their principles of equity continue to be applicable in modern times.2
(1) Luk 21:20-24; Act 6:13-14; Heb 9:18-19 with 8:7,13; 9:10; 10:1
(2) 1Co 5:1; 9:8-10


19.5 Obedience to the moral law remains forever binding on all, both justified persons and others,1 both in regard to the content of the law, and also to the authority of God the Creator who gave the law.2 Nor does Christ in any way dissolve this law in the Gospel, on the contrary, he strengthens our obligation [to obey the moral law].3

No wonder then that D.L. Moody, and R.C. Sproul and Andy Stanley, and C.H. Spurgeon and Charles Stanley and everyone who follows in agreement with their acceptance of these particular Bible principles - can see these points so clearly.

They are obvious to the objective unbiased Bible students.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

The only 'irrefutable Sabbath facts remaining' are not those remaining in the Law in dead letter in stone but AROSE ANEW TO LIFE IN JESUS CHRIST AS APPEARED IT FROM THE DEAD.

 

[The Biblicist]

Here is "yet another example" where Jesus and Paul and everyone under the sun in the Bible - is being referenced.



No wonder then that D.L. Moody, and R.C. Sproul and Andy Stanley, and C.H. Spurgeon and Charles Stanley and everyone who follows in agreement with their acceptance of these particular Bible principles - can see these points so clearly.

They are obvious to the objective unbiased Bible students.

in Christ,

Bob

But NOT ONE of these "objective unbiased Bible students" such as Moody, Sproul, Stanley, Spurgeon believed or observed Saturday as the Sabbath or the fulfillment of the Sabbath principle.

 

[Yeshua1]

But NOT ONE of these "objective unbiased Bible students" such as Moody, Sproul, Stanley, Spurgeon believed or observed Saturday as the Sabbath or the fulfillment of the Sabbath principle.

Interesting that BOB keeps omiting that fact, Eh?

 

[BobRyan]

But NOT ONE of these "objective unbiased Bible students" such as Moody, Sproul, Stanley, Spurgeon believed or observed Saturday as the Sabbath

Hint - they all accept the Bible fact that Saturday was the Sabbath as God gave it in Eden and reminded Israel of it in Ex 16 "Tomorrow is the Sabbath" and repeated it in Ex 20:11.

They all admit that it was fulfilled as God gave it - by keeping the actual 7th day of the week (If one is going to go "sola scriptura" on this doctrine)

In the Six points of the Sabbath doctrine - those sources accept the first 4. And then they try and "Bend the Sabbath" to point to "week-day 1".

1. Made for mankind in Gen 2:1-3, According to Mark 2:27 and Exodus 20:11.
2. Applicable to all mankind even for eternity in the future - Is 66:23.
3. Kept by gentiles in both OT (Isaiah 56) and NT (Acts 13, 17, 18)
4. Still binding on the saints today (James 2 - Heb 4 there remains therefore a Sabbath rest for the people of God)

5. Cannot be "bent" to point to "week-day-1" by the traditions of man - Mark 7:6-13.
6. The language of Ex 20:11 and Gen 2:3 specify God’s own selected seventh-day of the week – not the mythical and much imagined “any-ol day in seven” idea. Ex 16 “Tomorrow is the Sabbath” – not “any day in seven you wish”.

Point 6 is demonstrated not only in the language and historic facts in Exodus 16 – showing that God selects the very day that is to be considered the 7th day – and no other, but also in the Genesis 1 and 2 fact that the seventh day in Genesis 2 is actually the SECOND day of Adam’s week! God’s selection for the 7th day was not the 7th day of Adam’s week – but of Creation week as seen by God! God Himself selects the very day based on his observation of earth - not man's observation.

· - note if you swap week-day-1 for 7 – then the week only has week-day-1. Not week day 7 since the only thing made on week day 7 – was week-day 7.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[The Biblicist]

Hint - they all accept the Bible fact that Saturday was the Sabbath as God gave it in Eden

They all accepted that the Jews practiced it on Saturday but not necessarily the first Sabbath in Eden was on Saturday. You bridge that gap with your own logic. You reason that if they identify the Jewish Sabbath as Saturday then that means they identifid the original Sabbath as Saturday. You reason that if the "seventh day" was recognized as Saturday to the Jews then it must have been in Eden. That leap of logic is not stated by them anywhere I can find.