The limits of free will...

[Robert Snow]

It is so tiresome for you to say the same old worn-out lines in every post Robert.

You post the same things as well!

You speak rubbish. I was referencing Romans 9 in case you didn't know -- not The Institutes.

Interesting that you mention rubbish and the Institutes in the same context.

You complain about my attitude toward Calvinism, yet you call my viewpoint rubbish. I believe the pot just called the kettle black!

 

[quantumfaith]

yes, we all will still struggle while in this fallen flesh BUT...

The unsaved have NO MEANS to restrain this within themselves, as their sin nature is their Master..

Christians have now Holy Spirit residing in them, s CAN choose which will be their Master, Sin or Spirit

Unsaved in "bondage to Flesh" Sin DOES have mastery over them
Saved can choose to have Holy Spirit have Christ as their Master

BIg difference in free will at that point!

Excellent Point JesusFan.

 

[Rippon]

You post the same things as well!

I do not post your sort of trite nonsensical lines that you repeat ad nauseam.

Interesting that you mention rubbish and the Institutes in the same context.

Your rubbish is the old canard that everying I believe is filtered through the lens of John Calvin. Please get a new gig Robert.

Get a new act. You're dyin' on stage.

You complain about my attitude toward Calvinism, yet you call my viewpoint rubbish.

I was being polite by calling your constant lies rubbish. Try telling the truth for a change. And,as I have asked you before --read and study instead of posting your potshots.

 

[glfredrick]

Funny how we are still having VERY LITTLE conversation about the actual question in the OP.

Folks, there are a ton of threads out there where we can argue back and forth about everyone's pet peeve. Can't we discuss the question about the limits or lack thereof of free will in this thread?

I'm reminded of Skandelon's oft used quip...

That which is avoided is the weakest part of one's argument.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

GL

Here is your question:

What say the persons holding a free will perspective? Limits or not? Please justify your response in some fashion instead of making "I think so..." statements.

I do not believe in LFW so I cant answer. If man contributes any essential part towards his salvation, he effectively becomes his own savior..... thats my belief.

 

[sag38]

So Fredrick, since no one seems to want to answer your question why don't you answer it for us. Knowing your view point most know that if they answer the question that all you will do is use it against them try and prove that you are right and that they are wrong. Why bother? For me who has some problems with fully accepting limited atonement and irresistible grace there is no point in continuing the argument. It's been debated ad nausea and as of yet I have not been convinced that five pointers have a fool proof lock down. It's not as cut and dry as you would make it out to be.

 

[glfredrick]

GL

Here is your question:

What say the persons holding a free will perspective? Limits or not? Please justify your response in some fashion instead of making "I think so..." statements.

I do not believe in LFW so I cant answer. If man contributes any essential part towards his salvation, he effectively becomes his own savior..... thats my belief.

So, to clarifty, your response indicates that we have no free will at all, either here or in eternity.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So, to clarifty, your response indicates that we have no free will at all, either here or in eternity.

I should think my statement is crystal clear! I should clarify, my statement centers around atonement. The efficacy of atonement centers on Christs saving work alone not on a sinners faith & repentance.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So Fredrick, since no one seems to want to answer your question why don't you answer it for us. Knowing your view point most know that if they answer the question that all you will do is use it against them try and prove that you are right and that they are wrong. Why bother? For me who has some problems with fully accepting limited atonement and irresistible grace there is no point in continuing the argument. It's been debated ad nausea and as of yet I have not been convinced that five pointers have a fool proof lock down. It's not as cut and dry as you would make it out to be.

so in other words your saying that for fear of retaliation your not answering a question that should be paramount to you Faith Belief.....that's some assurance you got there Pastor.

 

[Allan]

I do not believe in LFW so I cant answer. If man contributes any essential part towards his salvation, he effectively becomes his own savior..... thats my belief.

So, by your own statement and the fact that 'faith' is essential, you believe that anyone who does not hold the Calvinistic view of salvation, is unsaved. You must because if anyone is their 'own' savior they hold to a false gospel and is, without question, unsaved.

BTW - just to qualify my stance, I don't hold to LFW. I believe in limited freedom. The freedom's limits are determined by God, via the choices he gives them.
It is important to define with LFW is as it is defined differently by various people. The C's define it differently than those who actually hold to the view. I don't know if it has been fleshed out in the this thread.

 

[Dr. Bob]

The limits of discussion have been reached.

Cannot imagine it, but if anyone did not have their "say" and want to start another topic on a point of this debate, go for it.

This one is closed.