THE RAPTURE

Too bad it's not a biblical definition given by Paul, but only a theological belief of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Paul's definition concerns ONLY THOSE who have been baptized by the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

This did not occur until AFTER THE RESURRECTION on the day of Pentecost.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

Paul VERIFIES that his body did not begin until after his death and resurrection.

Ephesians 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Ephesians 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Ephesians 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Ephesians 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

Ephesians 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

He VERIFIES it again by the illustration of Eph.5. Adam got his WIFE "after he slept".

Ephesians 5:30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

Ephesians 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

Ephesians 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

Genesis 2:22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Genesis 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Genesis 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

So much for the UNBIBLICAL teaching of the Southern Baptist Convention, which stands in CONTRADICTION of Paul the apostle, who revealed the mystery of the body of Christ.

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Ephesians 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Ephesians 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

 

Too bad it's not a biblical definition given by Paul, but only a theological belief of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Paul's definition concerns ONLY THOSE who have been baptized by the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

This did not occur until AFTER THE RESURRECTION on the day of Pentecost.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

Paul VERIFIES that his body did not begin until after his death and resurrection.

Ephesians 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Ephesians 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Ephesians 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Ephesians 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

Ephesians 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

He VERIFIES it again by the illustration of Eph.5. Adam got his WIFE "after he slept".

Ephesians 5:30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

Ephesians 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

Ephesians 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

Genesis 2:22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Genesis 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Genesis 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

So much for the UNBIBLICAL teaching of the Southern Baptist Convention, which stands in CONTRADICTION of Paul the apostle, who revealed the mystery of the body of Christ.

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Ephesians 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Ephesians 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power. </font>[/QUOTE]Can I ask a stupid question? Why are you quoting these particular verses? Am I missing something or does your post sound like it comes from Pentecostal beliefs?

 

carlaimpinge,

Keep on reading Carl, and read in context.

Ephesians 3:2-3 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

The dispensation and the mystery that Paul had been explaining all throughout chapters two and three is that the Gentile believers and the Jewish believers were now one in Christ.

For example, in one of the verses you quoted:
Ephesians 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
--The word both refers to both Jews and Gentiles. He hath reconciled both unto God in one body by the cross. Even in this verse it is disputable what the phrase "one body" may be referring to.
He is writing to the Ephesian church, whom he refers to as the body. And it is. It is a body of believers, as is every local church. In the church at Ephesus there were both Gentile and Jewish believers that had been reconciled to God and the enmity between them had been removed because of the cross.
DHK

 

Too bad it's not a biblical definition given by Paul, but only a theological belief of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Paul's definition concerns ONLY THOSE who have been baptized by the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

This did not occur until AFTER THE RESURRECTION on the day of Pentecost.

Acts 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

Paul VERIFIES that his body did not begin until after his death and resurrection.

Ephesians 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Ephesians 2:14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Ephesians 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

Ephesians 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

Ephesians 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

He VERIFIES it again by the illustration of Eph.5. Adam got his WIFE "after he slept".

Ephesians 5:30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

Ephesians 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

Ephesians 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
Genesis 2:21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

Genesis 2:22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Genesis 2:23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

Genesis 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

So much for the UNBIBLICAL teaching of the Southern Baptist Convention, which stands in CONTRADICTION of Paul the apostle, who revealed the mystery of the body of Christ.

Ephesians 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,

Ephesians 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

Ephesians 3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

Ephesians 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Ephesians 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power. </font>[/QUOTE]Can I ask a stupid question? Why are you quoting these particular verses? Am I missing something or does your post sound like it comes from Pentecostal beliefs? </font>[/QUOTE]I gave the verses to IDENTIFY "when" the baptism of the Holy Spirit BEGAN historically. It was Pentecost, not before.

 

Keep on reading Carl, and read in context.

Ephesians 3:2-3 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward: How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

The dispensation and the mystery that Paul had been explaining all throughout chapters two and three is that the Gentile believers and the Jewish believers were now one in Christ.

For example, in one of the verses you quoted:
Ephesians 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
--The word both refers to both Jews and Gentiles. He hath reconciled both unto God in one body by the cross. Even in this verse it is disputable what the phrase "one body" may be referring to.
He is writing to the Ephesian church, whom he refers to as the body. And it is. It is a body of believers, as is every local church. In the church at Ephesus there were both Gentile and Jewish believers that had been reconciled to God and the enmity between them had been removed because of the cross.
DHK </font>[/QUOTE]I don't know what you think I'm saying. You must have misunderstood something brother.

I know that Jewish believers and Gentile believers are ONE in Christ. The reason for the prooftexts are to IDENTIFY when that body came into existence HISTORICALLY. In the context, the Lord had DIED. It was proffered in REBUTTAL of the false teaching that ALL BELIEVERS through the ages are in the body of Christ. They certainly are not.

It is not disputable about the one body either in the context. There is only one. (Eph.4) There are not MANY BODIES of Christ, as local churches. There is a BODY of Christ, which local churches are part of. A part is spoken of as the whole. (See Corinthians and Romans)

 

Too bad it's not a biblical definition given by Paul, but only a theological belief of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Paul's definition concerns ONLY THOSE who have been baptized by the Spirit.
</font>[/QUOTE]Can I ask a stupid question? Why are you quoting these particular verses? Am I missing something or does your post sound like it comes from Pentecostal beliefs? </font>[/QUOTE]

Maybe I'm completely misunderstanding this. If I am would you please explain where I'm wrong.

True, Pentecost was the day. How does this relate with the Baptist Faith and Message today?

 

Carl,

We as baptists understand what Ephesians chapter 2 talking about Calvary. Calvary now made both Jews and Gentiles reconciled unity together into one. Jesus said, it is finished.

But, dispensationalists believe God still have TWO programs for 'Church' and 'Israel' for the future event. For example, Disps saying Israel is not part of the Body of Christ, it is separated from the Body of Christ. Also, disps saying, "trib saints" who will miss rapture, will be saved during great tribulation, yet they are NOT part of Body of Christ.

Huh??

Does Christ failed to make both reconciled together at the cross, at once 2,000 years ago?

What is the purpose of Calvary?

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

Too bad it's not a biblical definition given by Paul, but only a theological belief of the Southern Baptist Convention.

Paul's definition concerns ONLY THOSE who have been baptized by the Spirit.
</font>[/QUOTE]Can I ask a stupid question? Why are you quoting these particular verses? Am I missing something or does your post sound like it comes from Pentecostal beliefs? </font>[/QUOTE]

Maybe I'm completely misunderstanding this. If I am would you please explain where I'm wrong.

True, Pentecost was the day. How does this relate with the Baptist Faith and Message today? </font>[/QUOTE]The SB statement concerns those OF ALL AGES. The body didn't begin UNTIL Pentecost with the baptizing of the Holy Spirit INTO THAT BODY.

 

Carl,

Aren't Old Testament saints now in the heaven?

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

Many bible believers follow biblical dispensationalism UNLIKE OTHERS.

The nation of Israel IS NOT the body of Christ. Paul distinguished BOTH from each other.

Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

Israel is not saved.

Members of the body of Christ are saved which include Jews and Gentiles.

Romans 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:

Romans 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,

Romans 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?


Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

Romans 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,

Romans 11:3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.

Romans 11:4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.

Romans 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Romans 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

Romans 15:15 Nevertheless, brethren, I have written the more boldly unto you in some sort, as putting you in mind, because of the grace that is given to me of God,

Romans 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Ghost.

Israel IS NOT the body of Christ.

THEY WILL BE SAVED.

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

Romans 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Romans 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Romans 11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

Romans 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

ISRAEL'S HEART WILL TURN TO THE LORD.

2 Corinthians 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

2 Corinthians 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

2 Corinthians 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

2 Corinthians 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

2 Corinthians 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

2 Corinthians 3:12 Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

2 Corinthians 3:13 And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

2 Corinthians 3:14 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

2 Corinthians 3:15 But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

2 Corinthians 3:16 Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

Saints of the tribulation are not in the body of Christ. They are DIVIDED as two groups of believers within the tribulation.


Revelations 7:1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.

Revelations 7:2 And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea,

Revelations 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

Revelations 7:4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

Revelations 7:5 Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand.

Revelations 7:6 Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.

Revelations 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand.

Revelations 7:8 Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.

Revelations 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Revelations 7:10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.

Revelations 7:11 And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God,

Revelations 7:12 Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen.

Revelations 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

Revelations 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

The BODY OF CHRIST IS DELIVERED FROM THE WRATH TO COME WHICH TRIBULATION SAINTS GO THROUGH.

1 Thessalonians 1:10 And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.

Matthew 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

Matthew 24:16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

Matthew 24:17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

Matthew 24:18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

Matthew 24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

Matthew 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


That's because BOTH the Lord and John PREACHED the gospel of the kingdom, which WILL BE PREACHED during the tribulation.

BUT YOU REJECT THOSE VERSES, giving you darkness in understanding.

The family and household of God is made up of SEVERAL GROUPS.

Gentiles without the law under conscience.
Jews under promise.
Jews under the law.
Body under grace.
Tribulation saints under testimony of Jesus and commandments of God.
Gentiles who fear God.
Millenials saints under reign of righteousness

ALL OF THOSE ARE NOT IN THE BODY OF CHRIST. Some will be on earth, while others will be in the New Jerusalem, while others take the place of the angels in the heaven. They are all different.

 

Exactly MY question DeafPosttrib----thank you for clarifying it!

Regardless of HOW they were saved, they are NOW, TODAY, part of the BODY of Christ. Obviously this includes dead people, so those who made it to heaven from the OT are part of that BODY!

 

Exactly MY question DeafPosttrib----thank you for clarifying it!

Regardless of HOW they were saved, they are NOW, TODAY, part of the BODY of Christ. Obviously this includes dead people, so those who made it to heaven from the OT are part of that BODY! </font>[/QUOTE]No brother. Pauline statement does not INCLUDE OT saints. That's WHY I gave the HISTORICAL BASIS for entrance into the BODY OF CHRIST, which is the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

No OT SAINT was baptized by the Holy Spirit into the body of Christ. Death makes you dead, not a member of the body of Christ.

There are FACTIONS within the household.

Hebrews 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

Hebrews 12:24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

John 3:29 He that hath the bride is the bridegroom: but the friend of the bridegroom, which standeth and heareth him, rejoiceth greatly because of the bridegroom's voice: this my joy therefore is fulfilled.

Revelations 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 

Carl,

Aren't Abraham and O.T. saints invloved in this group of Hebrews 12:22-23, that they are part of Mount Zion. How about New Jerusalem of Revelation chapter 21?

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

Go back and read my posts concerning the different factions in the family of God. Those are "souls" which are NOW on Mt. Zion, in the HEAVENLY JERUSALEM.

 

Well it doesn't make any difference where they are all the saved of all time are part of the Church, the Church which is
1. The Body of Jesus Christ,
2. The Bride of Jesus Christ,
3. The general assembly of the first born,
4. The New Jerusalem,
5. The city for which Abraham looked whose builder and maker is God,
6. The Heavenly Jerusalem,
7. Mount Zion.

 

It's simply amazing at the DOGMATIC OPINIONS OF FALSEHOOD which are spewed forth from the mouths of people. They don't think about what they say about a passge, which CONTRADICTS others. They arbitrarily "change" the wording to SUIT them. (the terms are general assembly AND church of the firstborn, DISTINGUISHING TWO CLASSES) The poor brother also LEFT OUT another class. (The spirits of just men made perfect)

Again note the foolishness. MOUNT ZION and HEAVENLY JERUSALEM are part of the CHURCH in his opinion. They certainly are not. They are not people. The context concerns a CONTRAST IN PLACE where PEOPLE ARE FOUND. (Mt. Sinai on earth, Mt. Zion in heaven.) They concern a MOUNT within a city which is IN HEAVEN, which has been there SINCE REVELATION of the Holy Scriptures. It is where God, the LORD, the KING of the whole earth, DWELLS. It is a PLACE. (Literally and physically IN HEAVEN)

Psalms 48:2 Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is Mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King.

Isaiah 14:13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

Hebrews 12:22 But ye are come unto Mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

The THRONE OF GOD is located on Mt. Sion, in the heavenly Jerusalem. That's where SATAN was (Ez.38), but has been thrown down, while wanting to ASCEND AGAIN and take over. (Isaiah 14) He will be cast down to earth, then the bottomless pit, then the lake of fire in the future. (Rev. 12, 20)

All of the classes ARE NOT the CHURCH, which is his body, for it is plainly separate from OT saints without law (Adam-Moses, Rom.5), under the law (Moses-John, Matt.11), Elect and Saints of the great tribulation (Rev.7,11), Israel as a REDEEMED NATION, who rules over GENTILES within the millenium. (Rom.11, Isaiah 60-66) The CHURCH WHICH IS HIS BODY comes between John and Tribulation Saints, AS IT DOES IN THE HOLY BIBLE.

Matt-John/Romans-Philemon/Hebrews-Revelation

NONE OF THE OTHERS ARE STATED TO BE WITHIN HIS BODY.

Wrong again, my friend.

 

There are those who believe and teach that Satan was an angel who was cast out of Heaven because of his rebellion against God. The basis for this is presumably Isaiah 14:4, 12-16 and Ezekiel 28:12-19. Study of the passage from Isaiah in the context of Chapter 14 will show that the subject of this passage, Lucifer, was the name used for a Babylonian king under judgment of God [Isaiah 14:4]. Isaiah 14:16 reiterates that Lucifer was mere man.

Isaiah 14:4, 12-16, KJV
4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
16 They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;

Similarly a study of the passage from Ezekiel in the context of Chapter 28 shows that the passage deals with God’s judgment of the king of Tyre.

Ezekiel 28:12-19, KJV
12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

Bible believers teach that Satan CAN APPEAR as an "angel of light" (2 Cor.11), but that he is a CHERUB, an annointed one, (Ez.28:14) which was OVER THE THRONE OF GOD at one time. Nothing is PRESUMED by these scriptures, but is BELIEVED by those who read them.

Bible believers understand that the mystery of iniquity and mystery of the beast concerns the MANFIFESTATION of Satan AS A MAN. (2 Thess.2, Rev.17) The passage in Isaiah 14 speaks of these mysteries revealed by Paul and John.

Lucifer is certainly a man, the SON OF PERDITION, who is DESTROYED by the Lord Jesus Christ. (2 Thess.2)

The Son of Perdition, Satan manifested AS A MAN, is also revealed through the King of Tyre in the passage. This king of Tyre was in EDEN, in the garden of God. (Gen.2-3, Ez.28:13) It is SATAN. Satan has 7 heads and 10 horns. (Rev.12)He will be associated with the king of Tyre IN THE FUTURE for Tyre is one of the 10 kings which give their kingdom unto the BEAST, the Son of Perdition, which DESTROY Jerusalem. (Rev.17, Psalm 83)

So much for the thoughts of others.

 

I thought allegorical interpretation was "verboten" to dispensationalists.

 

You thought wrong again.

Allegorical teaching is clearly given by Paul, the author of Pauline dispensationalism. (Gal.4)

Of course, this is not allegorical teaching, but ACTUAL SCRIPTURAL INTERPRETATION from the NT concerning OT passages of statement. Paul calls it comparing scripture with scritpure. (1 Cor.2)

Some people just don't have understanding due to their rejection of bible truth.