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The REAL Jack Hyles
- Thread starter Charles Meadows
- Start date
David Ekstrom
New Member
Jack Hyles was self-obsessed. His preaching was unbiblical. His leadership was abusive. His doctrines were in serious error. His ministries were more hype than substance. Reports on conversions and attendance were so grossly exaggerated that they are more lie than anything else. I'm not saying this because I want to rant against a dead man. I hope that others will not follow his example.
R
RightFromWrong
Guest
AMEN Larry
Just so you know, I am not a Hyles man. I just watch as people judge and derail a man no longer here to defend himself. Take anyones ministry and you will find it flawed. If you find a perfect church ya better not join it.
Not trying to start an argument. Just amazed at the wolf pack mentality of this board. If this board is a true representation of baptists then where are the Hyles supporters. Lets get some two sided debate going.
Not trying to start an argument. Just amazed at the wolf pack mentality of this board. If this board is a true representation of baptists then where are the Hyles supporters. Lets get some two sided debate going.
Charles Meadows
New Member
Soulman,
Just so you know, I am not a Hyles man. I just watch as people judge and derail a man no longer here to defend himself. Take anyones ministry and you will find it flawed. If you find a perfect church ya better not join it.
Just curious...
Would you also defend Billy Graham?
Just so you know, I am not a Hyles man. I just watch as people judge and derail a man no longer here to defend himself. Take anyones ministry and you will find it flawed. If you find a perfect church ya better not join it.
Just curious...
Would you also defend Billy Graham?
Regretfully, we have a problem with letting the dead bury the dead in this case. There are those who are continueing to follow the methods and philosophies promulgated by Brother Hyles. And in many situations, the ratioanale is: "This is the way it was done at FBC-Hammond." or "This is the way Brother Hyles did it." In other words, while the man is dead, his legacy lives on.
Yeah, we couldn't get the same good fortune the world had after Herbie Armstrong croaked. Looks as if his WWCOG is becoming legit, even following many Baptist practices. Seems as if their 7th Day Adventist/Universalist heresy is over and done.
PRAISE THE LORD!
Now, if people would leave HYLES in the ground....
Would you like to judge the honesty of Hyles' ministry?
He claims he preached 50,000 sermons! That's 1000 sermons a year for 50 years! Do the math! That's roughly three sermons a day, every day, for fifty years!
The man was a liar. There is no way one can get around this fact.
He claims he preached 50,000 sermons! That's 1000 sermons a year for 50 years! Do the math! That's roughly three sermons a day, every day, for fifty years!
The man was a liar. There is no way one can get around this fact.
I view this situation much like a war. The primary conflict is over. The dead are dead and buried. However, there are still land mines and unexploded ordinance in the ground waiting to blow off some unwary soul's leg off. The wounded are among us. And a piece of military wisdom applies here: Generals want to fight and win the last war. The ACW saw both sides emulatng Napoleon. In WW1, the French wanted to refight the F-PW. Then there was the Maginot Line. In Iraq, we went in with a force equiped to fight the Russians. The same applies here. Many in leadership use Brother Hyles as their benchmark.
That is why the man and his philosophy of ministry still matter even after his death.
That is why the man and his philosophy of ministry still matter even after his death.
ccrobinson
Active Member
Indeed it does matter, and not just because many of us have serious concerns about the ministry of the late Jack Hyles. The bigger concern is the impact he and his ministry had on FBC/HAC and fundamentalism, and what the impact is today.
A team from FBC was at my church recently and there were some things brought out that made me question there credibility. There were rhetorical questions asked like where would fundamentalism be but for Jack Hyles. Wouldn't it be wherever God wanted it to be? It just seems to me that the majority of HAC/FBC folks are giving Jack Hyles credit for what God has done.
A statement was also made that FBC has a goal of 25,000 baptisms in one year and they were well on their way to meeting that goal. Assuming the traditional Baptist practice of Sunday morning, Sunday evening and Wednesday night services, they would have to baptize an average of 160 every service to reach the goal. That's an astounding number to me.
I've never been to FBC, so maybe they have a good number of baptistries and an incredible system for making them happen quickly. If the building had 8 baptristies, and each baptism took 1 minute from the time the new believer got in the water and out, and they used all the baptristies every week, it is possible that an average of 160 people could get baptized every single week. Is it me, or does that seem like an unrealistic number? Things like that continue to call into question the credibility of FBC.
Again, what Jack Hyles was about should be questioned because he still has an impact on FBC/HAC and fundamentalism, though he's been dead for 4 years now.
A team from FBC was at my church recently and there were some things brought out that made me question there credibility. There were rhetorical questions asked like where would fundamentalism be but for Jack Hyles. Wouldn't it be wherever God wanted it to be? It just seems to me that the majority of HAC/FBC folks are giving Jack Hyles credit for what God has done.
A statement was also made that FBC has a goal of 25,000 baptisms in one year and they were well on their way to meeting that goal. Assuming the traditional Baptist practice of Sunday morning, Sunday evening and Wednesday night services, they would have to baptize an average of 160 every service to reach the goal. That's an astounding number to me.
I've never been to FBC, so maybe they have a good number of baptistries and an incredible system for making them happen quickly. If the building had 8 baptristies, and each baptism took 1 minute from the time the new believer got in the water and out, and they used all the baptristies every week, it is possible that an average of 160 people could get baptized every single week. Is it me, or does that seem like an unrealistic number? Things like that continue to call into question the credibility of FBC.
Again, what Jack Hyles was about should be questioned because he still has an impact on FBC/HAC and fundamentalism, though he's been dead for 4 years now.
Posted by Charles Meadows: Would you also defend Billy Graham?
I can't honestly say that I would. I am not disputing anyones claims against Jack Hyles. The man's ministry has already been judged of God. Jack Hyles is where he will spend eternity.
It is one thing to discuss a ministries shortcommings. It is another to attack a dead man like a bunch of scavenging jackals.
If you think Jack Hyles was corrupt, so be it. The laborers are few. Mabey some of you experts should go to Hammond and show them how it should be done in a Godly biblical manner.
I can't honestly say that I would. I am not disputing anyones claims against Jack Hyles. The man's ministry has already been judged of God. Jack Hyles is where he will spend eternity.
It is one thing to discuss a ministries shortcommings. It is another to attack a dead man like a bunch of scavenging jackals.
If you think Jack Hyles was corrupt, so be it. The laborers are few. Mabey some of you experts should go to Hammond and show them how it should be done in a Godly biblical manner.
And you leave aside many have endeavored to deal with the problem in a non-confrontational manner over the years. However, because of the positions taken by Brother Hyles, any attempts at reconcilation have come to nought.
The truly bad theology of hyles lives on in the legacy of young preachers whom he trained or influenced.
His soul winning 1-2-3-pray-after-me technique will result in more people THINKING they are born again and on their way to hell than any other false teaching short of infant baptism.
Lying, personal indiscretions, justifying and applauding convicted child molestors . . man, it is sickening.
And my disdain for the false "kjvonly" is only heightened by his position of requiring it for salvation.
But the worst condemnation is his praise and defense of his son. Dave is a whoremonger of the most vile type (I will NOT detail the adultery and abuse). You cannot imagine a "christian" much less a pastor conducting a life such as Dave. But Jack lied to cover for him, would not admit his sin, and said his son was the best Christian he ever knew.
THAT is the legacy most disgraceful. Vile practice and vile theology and a reproach on the name of Christianity, much less Fundamentalism.
His soul winning 1-2-3-pray-after-me technique will result in more people THINKING they are born again and on their way to hell than any other false teaching short of infant baptism.
Lying, personal indiscretions, justifying and applauding convicted child molestors . . man, it is sickening.
And my disdain for the false "kjvonly" is only heightened by his position of requiring it for salvation.
But the worst condemnation is his praise and defense of his son. Dave is a whoremonger of the most vile type (I will NOT detail the adultery and abuse). You cannot imagine a "christian" much less a pastor conducting a life such as Dave. But Jack lied to cover for him, would not admit his sin, and said his son was the best Christian he ever knew.
THAT is the legacy most disgraceful. Vile practice and vile theology and a reproach on the name of Christianity, much less Fundamentalism.
FundamentalDan
New Member
Doc,
Here is a quote from a message that he preached. I actually liked the message up until the point that he said this, "Sometimes I think that God feels how I felt..." He was talking about being disappointed, but I was struck by how low his view of God was. We should not ever compare ourselves to God, and when we do, we think way too much of ourselves. Maybe I am overreacting to that statement, but it bothered me. And that tape was from the year 1981. Perhaps a lot that followed had to do with that view of God that was accidentally (I believe) expressed.
Here is a quote from a message that he preached. I actually liked the message up until the point that he said this, "Sometimes I think that God feels how I felt..." He was talking about being disappointed, but I was struck by how low his view of God was. We should not ever compare ourselves to God, and when we do, we think way too much of ourselves. Maybe I am overreacting to that statement, but it bothered me. And that tape was from the year 1981. Perhaps a lot that followed had to do with that view of God that was accidentally (I believe) expressed.
You know Dan, I have noticed that, among the HAC grads that I know, many have that same low view of God. I think it's an over-emphasis on Christ's humanity.
I don't know about you, but I need to know that Christ is so far above me and my ways. If not, I won't fear Him, follow Him, or faith Him.
I don't know about you, but I need to know that Christ is so far above me and my ways. If not, I won't fear Him, follow Him, or faith Him.
AVL1984
<img src=../ubb/avl1984.jpg>
Hey, Dan...Didn't see you there!
Chris I agree with you...if God feels like we feel, I don't think I would be able to serve Him. It would be awfully hard. I know he was tempted in all points like we are in Christ Jesus in the form of a man, but other than that...no way.
HAC grads are notorious for trying to bring God down to the lowest human denominator.
Chris I agree with you...if God feels like we feel, I don't think I would be able to serve Him. It would be awfully hard. I know he was tempted in all points like we are in Christ Jesus in the form of a man, but other than that...no way.
HAC grads are notorious for trying to bring God down to the lowest human denominator.