The Sinners Ability to CHOOSE

[SavedByGrace]

Romans 9:15

psalm 5:5

Psalm 11:5

Matthew 13:15

Mark 4:10-12. Especially v 12

Romans 9:15, is answered by Romans 11:32, "For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all", which is speaking about Jews and Gentiles, which is the entire human race

Pslam 5:5, is answered by Psalm 106:40, "Therefore Yahweh burned with anger against his people. He abhorred his inheritance". God ABHORRED/HATED is OWN inheritance!

Psalm 11:5, as Psalm 106:40

Matthew 13:15, you will see here that Jesus does not quote from the traditional Hebrew text, where the Prophet Isaiah is Commanded by God to carry out God's wishes against His people, but rarther says, "And their eyes they have closed". Note THEY CLOSE THEIR OWN EYES

Intestesting, that the words in Mark are not from the Hebrew of Greek LXX, but the Aramaic Targum! As I have said, this is answered by the change of language in Matthew, and Paul's own quote at the end of Acts 28, where he also says that sinners CLOSE THEIR OWN EYES!

 

[SavedByGrace]

Sinners always reject the Gospel

to be able to REJECT, means that they CHOOSE, and therefore have a FREE WILL!

can you now see the FOLLY in reformed theology?

 

[SavedByGrace]

they are very clear

to you and those of your thinking!

 

[Marooncat79]

Acts 26:15–18

Finally, in Acts 26, the Lord says that Paul will be sent open the eyes of the spiritually blind, so that they might repent, believe, in order to receive forgiveness and a place among the saints.

15 And I said, ‘Who are you, Lord?’ And the Lord said, ‘I am Jesus whom you are persecuting. 16 But rise and stand upon your feet, for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to appoint you as a servant and witness to the things in which you have seen me and to those in which I will appear to you, 17 delivering you from your people and from the Gentiles—to whom I am sending you 18 toopen their eyes, so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’

Incredibly, this verse supplies an ordo salutis (order of salvation) on par with with Romans 8:30. It begins with the gospel call in Paul’s calling. This gospel call is what makes possible the effectual call, which in turn grants regeneration. Regeneration then produces faith and repentance that results in forgiveness and a place among the redeemed. In Acts, all of these truths are seen in multiple ways, and this verse, therefore, caps off a book that testifies to God’s grace that saves all people whom the Father chose in Christ before the world began. And wonderfully, this full doctrine of monergistic grace does not inhibit or impede evangelism and missions. Instead, it is the bedrock for preaching Christ to all people, praying for the lost, and even suffering in order to bring the gospel to all Christ’s people.

 

[Marooncat79]

to be able to REJECT, means that they CHOOSE, and therefore have a FREE WILL!

can you now see the FOLLY in reformed theology?

Free means ability to choose either or, man certainly does not have that ability outside of the New Birth in John 3

the New Birth brings about repentance and faith resulting in salvation

 

[SavedByGrace]

the New Birth brings about repentance and faith resulting in salvation

so VERY WRONG!!!

It is REPENTING and FAITH, that causes NEW BIRTH, not your upsidedown teaching!

Jesus did not say, now that you are saved, you must REPENT and BELIEVE!

 

[SavedByGrace]

Acts 26:15–18

Finally, in Acts 26, the Lord says that Paul will be sent open the eyes of the spiritually blind, so that they might repent, believe, in order to receive forgiveness and a place among the saints.

15 And I said, ‘Who are you, Lord?’ And the Lord said, ‘I am Jesus whom you are persecuting. 16 But rise and stand upon your feet, for I have appeared to you for this purpose, to appoint you as a servant and witness to the things in which you have seen me and to those in which I will appear to you, 17 delivering you from your people and from the Gentiles—to whom I am sending you 18 toopen their eyes, so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’

Incredibly, this verse supplies an ordo salutis (order of salvation) on par with with Romans 8:30. It begins with the gospel call in Paul’s calling. This gospel call is what makes possible the effectual call, which in turn grants regeneration. Regeneration then produces faith and repentance that results in forgiveness and a place among the redeemed. In Acts, all of these truths are seen in multiple ways, and this verse, therefore, caps off a book that testifies to God’s grace that saves all people whom the Father chose in Christ before the world began. And wonderfully, this full doctrine of monergistic grace does not inhibit or impede evangelism and missions. Instead, it is the bedrock for preaching Christ to all people, praying for the lost, and even suffering in order to bring the gospel to all Christ’s people.

here is a curve ball for you. IF, as you and some others on here say, that God GRANTS some sinner to believe and be saved, then HOW can He Justly punish those to DISBELIEVE, as we read in John 3:18? Your theology makes God unfair!

 

[Marooncat79]

so VERY WRONG!!!

It is REPENTING and FAITH, that causes NEW BIRTH, not your upsidedown teaching!

Jesus did not say, now that you are saved, you must REPENT and BELIEVE!

Incorrect

we greatly disagree

 

[Marooncat79]

here is a curve ball for you. IF, as you and some others on here say, that God GRANTS some sinner to believe and be saved, then HOW can He Justly punish those to DISBELIEVE, as we read in John 3:18? Your theology makes God unfair!

the unregenerate get what we all deserve which is hell

even the saved deserve hell

again, Paul addresses that in Romans 9

 

[Marooncat79]

He invited ... didn't come crashing in.

Really?

Was Abraham seeking God? No

Was Saul/Paul seeking God? No

what about Adam and Eve? We’re they seeking God? No. They were hiding

 

[SavedByGrace]

we greatly disagree

so does the Bible with you!

 

[SavedByGrace]

the unregenerate get what we all deserve which is hell

even the saved deserve hell

again, Paul addresses that in Romans 9

you are avioding what the Bible says,

"He who believes in him is not judged. He who doesn’t believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God" John 3:18

IF, as you say, it is God Who GRANTS Repentance and Faith to only the elect, so that they are saved. then HOW can He Justly condemn those who DO NOT BELIEVE, as it is God Who did not give these the ABILITY to Repent and Believe? Do you grasp what I am saying here? Your theology makes God to be UNJUST!

 

[SavedByGrace]

He invited ... didn't come crashing in.

Really?

Was Abraham seeking God? No

Was Saul/Paul seeking God? No

what about Adam and Eve? We’re they seeking God? No. They were hiding

It is clear that Adam and Eve REJECTED what God clearly COMMANDED that they sould not do! Both Abraham and Paul, as was John the Baptist, are special cases, for unique Works of God. You still ignore Jesus' own words in Matthew 22, where He says to INVITE!

 

[Marooncat79]

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

 

[Marooncat79]

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

 

[Marooncat79]

John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, ——-nor of the will of man, but of God.

Romans 9:16.

16 ———So then it is not of him that willeth, ——-nor of him that runneth, ———-but of God that sheweth mercy.

 

[SavedByGrace]

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

do you see the important word here? SERVE, and NOT SAVE!

Psalm 106:40 says that God DETESTS His own People! a much stronger Hebrew word than that used for Easu in Malachi!

 

[SavedByGrace]

John 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, ——-nor of the will of man, but of God.

Romans 9:16.

16 ———So then it is not of him that willeth, ——-nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

Slavation is from the Lord, but His Mercy is for the entire human race, as Romans 11:32, John 3:16, etc, say!

 

[AustinC]

so VERY WRONG!!!

It is REPENTING and FAITH, that causes NEW BIRTH, not your upsidedown teaching!

Jesus did not say, now that you are saved, you must REPENT and BELIEVE!

Are you really unable to see read your statement and NOT see it is salvation by works?
You have human works causing God to re-birth you.
You reject grace and make human action the cause while God acting on your behalf is the effect.

Honestly, if you cannot see it, then you are no different than a Pharisee in Matthew 23.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Are you really unable to see read your statement and NOT see it is salvation by works?
You have human works causing God to re-birth you.
You reject grace and make human action the cause while God acting on your behalf is the effect.

Honestly, if you cannot see it, then you are no different than a Pharisee in Matthew 23.

Ho hum