The Value of Books

[tyndale1946]

I love how Spurgeon applied Scripture. Read "Choice Portions" if you get a chance (that's one of my favorite sermons).

If you don't like it then....well....you may not be a Baptist .

Thanks for that Jon... Touche'... and if I don't you may not be a moderator... Brother Glen

 

[JonC]

Just to be clear, I haven’t said anything of the sort, so please excuse me from your “you an’t a Baptist slander”.

peace to you

Sorry. I thought your rating was in agreement with Icon's post. Typically that is what we conclude when you rate posts "winner".

To clarify....you do NOT believe a Baptist is deficient of thought if they have not read Owen's books....but you believe the idea they are deprived to be a "winner"?

You disagree with Icon but believe his post to be good but incorrect?

 

[JonC]

Thanks for that Jon... Touche'... and if I don't you may not be a moderator... Brother Glen

You will like it. It's Spurgeon at his best.

 

[canadyjd]

Sorry. I thought your rating was in agreement with Icon's post. Typically that is what we conclude when you rate posts "winner".

To clarify....you do NOT believe a Baptist is deficient of thought if they have not read Owen's books....but you believe the idea they are deprived to be a "winner"?

You disagree with Icon but believe his post to be good but incorrect?

My “winner” for iconoclast (post 25) is that you have a “slimy way” of “twisting” people’s words.

It is the reason I rarely respond to you.

BTW, is it appropriate for a moderator to reveal something that was done in private (my giving iconoclast a “winner” icon) for the rest of the board to see?

Obviously your intention was to embarrass me, or try to catch me off guard.

Again, it demonstrates your “slimy” approach to posting in these threads.

peace to you

 

[Iconoclast]

A couple of problems with that.

First, Spurgeon was not a theologian.

Second, the statement was pastoral.

Third, I never said we do not learn from others. I said God gives the gift of teaching to our churches.

JonC
I am not wasting time as you attempt damage control.
I know what you said, others read your posts and doubletalk.
Spurgeon was well read, his library of theology books was large.
He sometimes pushed the envelope trying to urge sinners to repent.
His theology was solid.

 

[Iconoclast]

tyndale1946,
The only Ascended Master I know is sitting on a throne... His name is Jesus Christ!...
I put my faith in no man, and no preacher and I do not see ascended masters in scripture... Brother Glen.

That is because they are not in scripture but cults.
Ascended masters in the Ascended Master Teachings of a number of movements in the theosophical tradition[1] are held to be spiritually enlightened beings who in past incarnations were ordinary humans, but who have undergone a series of spiritual transformations originally called initiations. Associated with the number 33, their purpose is to guide humanity towards a better life.

Both "mahatma" and "ascended master" are terms used in the Ascended Master Teachings. Ascended Master is based on the theosophical concept of the Mahatma or Masters of the Ancient Wisdom. However, Mahatmas and Ascended Masters are believed by some to differ in certain respects.

According to the Ascended Master Teachings a "Master of Light", "Healer" or "Spiritual Master" is a Divine Human Being who has taken the Fifth Initiation and is thereby capable of dwelling in a 5th dimension. The teachings hold that an "ascended master" is a human being who has taken the Sixth Initiation, also referred to as Ascension,[2] and is thereby believed to be capable of dwelling in a 6th dimension.

The term "ascended master" was first used by Baird T. Spalding in 1924 in his series of books, Life and Teachings of the Masters of the Far East (DeVorss and Co.). Godfre Ray King (Guy Ballard) further popularized this concept of spiritual masters who had once lived on the earth in his book Unveiled Mysteries.[3]

They are above and beyond all regular teachers according to those who claim contact with them;
Claimed encounters with Saint Germain[edit]
Several Theosophists and practitioners of alternate esoteric traditions have claimed to have met Saint Germain in the late 19th or early 20th centuries:

• Annie Besant said that she met the Count in 1896.
• C. W. Leadbeater claimed to have met him in Rome in 1926 and gave a physical description of him as having brown eyes, olive colored skin, and a pointed beard; according to Leadbeater, "the splendour of his Presence impels men to make obeisance".[4] Leadbeater said that Saint Germain showed him a robe that had been previously owned by a Roman Emperor and that Saint Germain told him that one of his residences was a castle in Transylvania. According to Leadbeater, when performing magical rituals in his castle in Transylvania, Saint Germain wears "a suit of golden chain-mail which once belonged to a Roman Emperor; over it is thrown a magnificent cloak of Tyrian purple, with on its clasp a seven-pointed star in diamond and amethyst, and sometimes he wears a glorious robe of violet."[5]
• Guy Ballard, founder of the "I AM" Activity, claimed that he met Saint Germain on Mount Shasta in California in August 1930, and that this initiated his "training" and experiences with other Ascended Masters in various parts of the world.[6]
• Edgar Cayce, the "Sleeping Prophet", was asked while in trance if Saint Germain was present. Cayce's reply was: "When needed." (From reading # 254–83 on 2/14/1935.)
• Dorothy Leon, living author, has claimed to have had several encounters with Saint Germain and is an avowed disciple of his.
• Miroslav Zimmer, living poet, claim to have met St Germain in the Malá Fatra mountains in Slovakia in 2011 in the company of a Sam Bennett.
• David Narozny, living Czech music composer, claims to have met St Germain in Pruhonice on 23 May 2014.
• David Christopher Lewis, living spiritual teacher, claims that Saint Germain first came to him in person on 10 June 2004 in his home in Paradise Valley, Montana, and continued to come many times thereafter.[7]
• [[Peter Mt. Shasta, living spiritual teacher and author, claims that Saint Germain materialized before him in Muir Woods, Marin County, California, as well as many other times, some of which encounters he documents in his book.[8]

Esoteric activities[/QUOTE]

 

[Iconoclast]

JonC,

Sorry. I thought your rating was in agreement with Icon's post. Typically that is what we conclude when you rate posts "winner".

You spend too much time worrying about winner, or funny emojis. You said it was immature to use them, and you have used them several times, so do not worry about it.

To clarify....you do NOT believe a Baptist is deficient of thought if they have not read Owen's books

...

I did not say it was required reading. I said baptists who would not read a padeo baptist theologian is why they remain ignorant of much theology and therefore remain ignorant and deficient of much solid theology. Here you twist it just enough to make it sound different. You do this all the time, so I will continue to point it out.

.but you believe the idea they are deprived to be a "winner"?

Sure...he has read your libel and twisting...he did not approve.

You disagree with Icon but believe his post to be good but incorrect?

You are seeking to be divisive but no one is buying what your selling. Nice try JonC

 

[Aaron]

This thread is attempted damage control by JonC.
We have all seen what he has been posting.
When we called attention to it, now his story changes, lol.

Most of his threads are.

 

[Aaron]

https://www.amazon.com/Fahrenheit-4...ocphy=9051879&hvtargid=pla-569861876081&psc=1
Staring JonC burning all non baptist books

Non-baptist? You mean his threads on atonement.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

You, @Martin Marprelate and @canadyjd can argue all day long that a Christian has a deficiency of thought until they have read John Owen's books...but you guys are not technically Baptists anyway (you reject the sufficiency of Scripture by demanding Baptists read Owen to keep from a deficiency in thinking).

I am trying to avoid any interaction with you on these threads, but it is impossible to do that if you keep lying about me.
Please either find a post by me where I have written that a Christian has a deficiency of thought until he has read John Owen or apologize and remove my name from your post.

 

[JonC]

JonC
I am not wasting time as you attempt damage control.
I know what you said, others read your posts and doubletalk.
Spurgeon was well read, his library of theology books was large.
He sometimes pushed the envelope trying to urge sinners to repent.
His theology was solid.

You are wrong.

@SavedByGrace is right. You do have a habit of posting your personal views that usually are not what the Bible actually teaches then you try to get out of your theological nonsense by trying to make others look unbiblical.

I never once said that Christians should not read books.

The main issue here is YOU KNOW THIS because we have discussed book recommendations.

Your insistence on trying to make members who disagree with you look bad by falsely accusing them of positions they never held is a serious issue. It shows your character.

Others (even those that disagree with me) know this because we all have had these types of discussions.

When you devolve into falsely accusing brothers in Christ you lose your argument. It demonstrates you are unable to defend your position, are too proud to admit it, and have such a spiritual deficiency that you are willing to make false accusations.

If this is not true then provide a post where I say books are bad, that we should not read books.

You can't. The reason is you approach this board as you approach Scripture. You see what you want to see and ignore what is there.

To restate what I have actually posted - Christians can learn a lot from books, from the experiences and ideas of those who have gone before us and who are here with us. Theology has to remain relevant (from a theological perspective, Owen is not relevant....from a historical perspective his works are). Christians need to first focus on God's Word. Only Scripture is the test of doctrine. You need to focus on God's Word rather than books because you have allowed yourself to be carried away by vain philosophy (it not only matters what you believe but why you believe it).

 

[JonC]

I am trying to avoid any interaction with you on these threads, but it is impossible to do that if you keep lying about me.
Please either find a post by me where I have written that a Christian has a deficiency of thought until he has read John Owen or apologize and remove my name from your post.

I was going off your agreement with @Iconoclast 's post (your rating).

I would prefer the rating system go away because it would force people to express their views more concisely. BUT it is here and you used it to express agreement with @Iconoclast . If you thought he was in error then perhaps you should not have agreed with him on the open forum.

Don't blame me for thinking your rating his post as correct means you agree with his post. You read :

"
If a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, It shows defective thinking.

You tossed in your agreement. That is on you.

The rating system goes both ways. You rate. Members see where you stand based on that rating. Period.

If you believed Iconoclast had drifted from the truth then, as a brother, you should have reached out to him rather than supporting his error.

 

[JonC]

My “winner” for iconoclast (post 25) is that you have a “slimy way” of “twisting” people’s words.

It is the reason I rarely respond to you.

BTW, is it appropriate for a moderator to reveal something that was done in private (my giving iconoclast a “winner” icon) for the rest of the board to see?

Obviously your intention was to embarrass me, or try to catch me off guard.

Again, it demonstrates your “slimy” approach to posting in these threads.

peace to you

But she have not twisted anybody's words.

@Iconoclast posted:

"
If a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, It shows defective thinking.

I maintain he means that if a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, it shows defective thinking.

HOW IS THAT TWISTING HIS WORDS?????

And....do you believe

"
If a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, It shows defective thinking.

???

BTW....ratings are not done in private. Every member can see exactly where you stand.

 

[Reformed1689]

Is this thread even useful or just going to be member bashing?

 

[JonC]

JonC,



You spend too much time worrying about winner, or funny emojis. You said it was immature to use them, and you have used them several times, so do not worry about it.
...

I did not say it was required reading. I said baptists who would not read a padeo baptist theologian is why they remain ignorant of much theology and therefore remain ignorant and deficient of much solid theology. Here you twist it just enough to make it sound different. You do this all the time, so I will continue to point it out.



Sure...he has read your libel and twisting...he did not approve.


You are seeking to be divisive but no one is buying what your selling. Nice try JonC

I do not care about ratings. But I do look to see who is in agreement when talking about points of the thread.

"
If a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, It shows defective thinking.

I believe this statement a serious error (evidence of defective Christian thought).

You say I have twisted your words by claiming you posted that if a Baptist does not read books by Owen or in our day Sinclair Ferguson, It shows defective thinking.

Members can decide. Two agreed with your comment. That is where they stand, and that is fine. But they needn't ehine when we all see them standing there.

 

[Iconoclast]

You are wrong.

@SavedByGrace is right. You do have a habit of posting your personal views that usually are not what the Bible actually teaches then you try to get out of your theological nonsense by trying to make others look unbiblical.

I never once said that Christians should not read books.

The main issue here is YOU KNOW THIS because we have discussed book recommendations.

Your insistence on trying to make members who disagree with you look bad by falsely accusing them of positions they never held is a serious issue. It shows your character.

Others (even those that disagree with me) know this because we all have had these types of discussions.

When you devolve into falsely accusing brothers in Christ you lose your argument. It demonstrates you are unable to defend your position, are too proud to admit it, and have such a spiritual deficiency that you are willing to make false accusations.

If this is not true then provide a post where I say books are bad, that we should not read books.

You can't. The reason is you approach this board as you approach Scripture. You see what you want to see and ignore what is there.

To restate what I have actually posted - Christians can learn a lot from books, from the experiences and ideas of those who have gone before us and who are here with us. Theology has to remain relevant (from a theological perspective, Owen is not relevant....from a historical perspective his works are). Christians need to first focus on God's Word. Only Scripture is the test of doctrine. You need to focus on God's Word rather than books because you have allowed yourself to be carried away by vain philosophy (it not only matters what you believe but why you believe it).

 

[canadyjd]

BTW....ratings are not done in private. Every member can see exactly where you stand.

Then I stand corrected. I had no idea that all board members could see who was posting the ratings icons. I know I get a notice if someone posts a rating on my own post.

Perhaps you could explain how I can view what members are rating other posts?

peace to you

 

[JonC]

Then I stand corrected. I had no idea that all board members could see who was posting the ratings icons. I know I get a notice if someone posts a rating on my own post.

Perhaps you could explain how I can view what members are rating other posts?

peace to you

You should be able to click on the "list" near the ratings. The other depends on the members setting and I can't remember how to get there. I have not used it since I've been a mod. Plus I'm getting old.

Edit -. Another way is to click on a profile and check recent activities. You don't even have to be logged in to do this. It will show where the member rated posts. (I tested this one without logging in).

 

[JonC]

Then I stand corrected. I had no idea that all board members could see who was posting the ratings icons. I know I get a notice if someone posts a rating on my own post.

Perhaps you could explain how I can view what members are rating other posts?

peace to you

BTW, I take it (from your reply) that you (and the others I mentioned) believe @Iconoclast 's comment was an error (that a Baptist who has not read books by John Owen are not necessarily deficient in thought).

This is one reason I do not like rating systems. People (myself included) hit the button without really agreeing with the post. I think it is better to have members express their support of (or lack thereof) in an actual reply.

Sorry if I misunderstood your intentions.

 

[canadyjd]

BTW, I take it (from your reply) that you (and the others I mentioned) believe @Iconoclast 's comment was an error (that a Baptist who has not read books by John Owen are not necessarily deficient in thought).

This is one reason I do not like rating systems. People (myself included) hit the button without really agreeing with the post. I think it is better to have members express their support of (or lack thereof) in an actual reply.

Sorry if I misunderstood your intentions.

I made no error. I agreed with the part of the post that referenced the way you post on these threads. It was a “winner”!

Iconoclast has explained in detail his meaning and intention concerning his own posts, which is obviously not what you keep beating the dead horse about.

Why not just accept his explanation and move on to something substantive?

BYW, thanks for explaining how to view the ratings. Good info.

peace to you