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"Truth without any mixture of error"

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Revmitchell, May 2, 2008.

  1. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    IMHO you infact side stepped what I said. And you seem to separate faith and discipleship. Scripture doesnt. This emphasis of treating others over what we believe is nonsensical. I do not say that to be bombastic. Faith and discipleship are in fact one. You cannot have faith and not be a disciple. The Bible is full of what we are to believe. And Christ spoke quite extensively about that.

    I would also add that discipleship has the eternal in view not so much what is going on now which was clearly exemplified in Christs ministry.
     
    #21 Revmitchell, May 3, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: May 3, 2008
  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Anyone else? Anyone? Anyone?
     
  4. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    You totally misunderstand what I am saying. I guess we should just drop the subject.
     
  5. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Well you are welcome to move on. But lets be clear. I did understand what you were saying.

    You take a principle like discipleship and works and place a greater emphasis on them than you do scripture so that you can feel comfortable with believing in errors in scripture. That way scripture becomes subjective and gives room for more personal thought and less room for dogmatism. That way we can all get along and follow Christ the way we "feel" lead. After all feelings and experiences speak more to a true faith than dogmatic words written in a "book" to use your own word.

    Hows that for understanding?
     
  6. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    If there are errors in scripture it would not destroy my faith because my faith is not dependant on words recorded by men who were inspired by God. My faith is in God and I will stand by and with Him through all. Faith, discipleship and works are a trinity ... all are important but for different reasons. I promised God years ago that when he opened a door I would go through it. He has opened many doors, and I must say some have led to most interesting places and events. I would hope you would do the same, follow Him wherever he leads, even if it proves costly to you in some way. It seems that your faith is totally dependent on your own understanding of scripture. We all are prone to error in our interpretations.

    As to your last question, I stand by my other statement, you seem to totally misunderstand what I am saying.
     
    #26 Crabtownboy, May 3, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: May 3, 2008
  7. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Interesting. How do you know God is opening the door? By what standard do you measure that experience against?
     
  8. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    When a door is opened but there seems to be insurmountable problems that disappear leaving the way clear, then I take it that God oened the door and I follow. I do not have time to go into all the details, but over the last 4 years 5 doors were opened for us to work in seminary libraries in the Czech Republic and in Moscow, Russia. We were not sure how we could arrange this for a number of reasons ... one being, what do we do about our house in the States seeing as to how we will be away from 5 weeks to six months. In each instance God has brought someone into our life who needed a place to live the exact amount of time, and at the same time, we were to be away. We never had to advertise, never had to go asking people if they knew someone who needed a place to live ... they just appeared. God is amazing.

    So, if a door, opportunity, whatever you want to call it, is presented to me and the potential problems simply are taken care of without my having to work at them .... I would work at them if necessary ... I will go anywhere he leads. Am I worried about going? No I am not. He calls me to go and I do not worry about returning. If I die while doing His work, that is all right with me. He calls me to go and opens the doors. He does not guarantee the return, and that is fine with me.
     
  9. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Ok let me try this another way. How do you know the opportunity is of God? What standard do you use to determine that what is behind the door is of God?
     
  10. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    Do you mean do I look for a verse or a passage that says, "Yes, go to Russia and work in a seminary library?" No, I don't. But I would not go if it was to do something that I see as a violation of discipleship in scripture.[I was a bit nervous going to Russia, but that did not play a part in my going. We cannot let our fears control our saying "yes" to God. [We wrote the man, who is a Ph.D. student here in Prague but lives in Moscow most of the time, telling him we were a bit nervous having heard stories about the Russian Mafia. He replied in an e-mail, "Don't worry about them. They are now too busy killing politicians to worry about tourists."

    We had a wonderful time in Moscow and met some wonderful Christians.

    Would I think it was from God if it was to go and do something that was unethical or illegal? No, in cases like that I would not believe it was from God.

    Does it fit my skills? Will it be helpful to someone? If the answer is yes, then I would consider it from God.

    I do not believe God will call us to do somethat that is harmful, illegal or unethical.

    My guess is you are asking me, "Does it fit into scripture?" And, yes it would have to fit scripture for the reasons above.

     
  11. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    So is it fair to say that your feelings and experiences are measured by the standard of the "book" (bible)?
     
  12. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    To the best of my ability.
     
  13. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    So then your faith does rest on words in a book?



    *note-I cringe to reuse your words characterizing the Bible
     
  14. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    Back awhile, in the first few years after I came to know the Lord, an older gentleman (gosh, he had to be in his mid-twenty’s :laugh: ) said, “If there is one mistake in the Bible, then I would give up my faith”.
    I was impressed enough with the statement to remember it.

    As I’ve grown I’ve come to believe that it’s a miserable way to live.
    And the statement is close enough to what MB said that it’s scary.

    MB: “If there is one mistake that changes what it says then the whole of it is false.”

    Crabby: “To me this is one of the saddest comments I can imagine.”

    I agree! :thumbs:

    I believe that God’s word is without error.
    But even if I were to find an err, I’d still believe!
    My ability to reason things out helps to strengthen my faith but isn’t integral to my faith.

    Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen.
    Hebrews 11:1 NASB95

    Rob
     
  15. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Does this mean you would continue to believe what it says even though you knew it was wrong?.
    MB
     
  16. Deacon

    Deacon Well-Known Member
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    It means I trust God.

    Though there are thngs that I don't understand,
    Though there might be things that could be percieved as err,

    I still hold God true.

    I don't need to be able to figure everything out (however hard I try).

    How's that song go...

    I am weak but thou art strong
    Jesus keep me from all harm
    I'll be satified as long
    as I walk, let me walk close to Thee.

    Rob

    For we know in part....
     
  17. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    A mistake in a translation we now have would say nothing about the steadfastness, faithfulness or anything else about God. It would only mean that someone made a mistake ... whether intentional or accidential I would not know. But it would do nothing to shake my faith in God.
     
  18. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Crabtownboy and Deacon;
    I wasn't speaking about believing in God, I was referring to the Bible. I can't deny what I know to be true about Him either. However there are some translations I do not trust because, they aren't all the same nor, do they all say the same things. There is only one truth not several. If every Bible were correct, then they would all say the same things at precisely the same point, and in the same way.
    MB
     
  19. Crabtownboy

    Crabtownboy Well-Known Member
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    I have no problem with your comment, but I do not know what you mean when you say, "There is only one truth." Can you expand on that for me. Thanks
     
  20. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    So then your faith does rest on words in a book?
     
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