Very sad commentary on the church today

[Revmitchell]

.............At the recent annual Beeson Pastors School, Selles led two workshops to discuss, “Whatever happened to hell?” He asked how many of the pastors had ever preached a sermon on hell. Nobody had, he said.

“I think it’s something people want to avoid,” he said. “I understand why. It’s a difficult topic.”

Fred Johns, pastor of Brookview Wesleyan Church in Irondale, Ala., said after a workshop discussion of hell that pastors do shy away from the topic of everlasting damnation.

“It’s out of fear we’ll not appear relevant,” he said. “It’s pressure from the culture to not speak anything negative. I think we’ve begun to deny hell. There’s an assumption that everybody’s going to make it to heaven somehow.”

The soft sell on hell reflects an increasingly market-conscious approach, Selles said.

“When you’re trying to market Jesus, sometimes there’s a tendency to mute traditional Christian symbols,” he said. “Difficult doctrines are left by the wayside. Hell is a morally repugnant doctrine. People wonder why God would send people to eternal punishment.”

Speakers said the seriousness of Jesus dying for man’s sins relates to the gravity of salvation versus damnation, according to Johns.

“If you don’t mention God’s judgment, you are missing a big part of the Christian gospel,” Selles said. “Without wrath, there’s no grace.”.

More Here

 

[grainofwheat]

It is my guess a lot of pastors are afraid of "offending" the faithful and losing numbers including the largest financial contributors.

It is a shame that the church in America has so many "professional" pastors that rely on the giving of the flock for their livelihood.
A pastor that provides his own financial support is less likely afraid to preach about hell and other social evils in the church and in the world.

Most "church going" Americans want a feel good sermon on Sunday and then go home and live their lives as they desire the rest of the week.

What in the "world" is wrong with the church in America ???

It closely resembles the world.

 

[Jim1999]

I know I have never preached a sermon on hell. There is no doubt, however, that hell has come up in many sermons. I don't see how one can avoid the topic of hell anymore than one can avoid the evils of this life when speaking of living for the Lord.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Revmitchell]

It is my guess a lot of pastors are afraid of "offending" the faithful and losing numbers including the largest financial contributors.

It is a shame that the church in America has so many "professional" pastors that rely on the giving of the flock for their livelihood.
A pastor that provides his own financial support is less likely afraid to preach about hell and other social evils in the church and in the world.

Most "church going" Americans want a feel good sermon on Sunday and then go home and live their lives as they desire the rest of the week.

What in the "world" is wrong with the church in America ???

It closely resembles the world.

"Professional Pastors" has nothing to do with it. In fact the pastor should be taken care of by the church per scripture (1 Tim 5:17). And any pastor that is afraid to lose his job is not worthy of the calling. The resolution to pastor not preaching on hell or pastors afraid to lose their "job" is not an outside job. The resolution is to rely on God for provisions rather than people and just do what you were called to do(2 Tim 4:1-4).

 

[Salty]

Hell is not politically correct. Also most people only know Matt 7:1 - "Judge not least ye be judge"

 

[BigBossman]

I've seemed to notice more preaching on salvation, but not about the consequences of refusing it. People don't like being told they are going to Hell if they don't accept Christ as their Savior, but regardless, I think it has to be mentioned. I think others see this as a scare tactic to get others to accept Christ, but I don't see it that way. I look at it as truth. The truth isn't always pleasant, but it has to be spoken.

 

[grainofwheat]

"Professional Pastors" has nothing to do with it. In fact the pastor should be taken care of by the church per scripture (1 Tim 5:17). And any pastor that is afraid to lose his job is not worthy of the calling. The resolution to pastor not preaching on hell or pastors afraid to lose their "job" is not an outside job. The resolution is to rely on God for provisions rather than people and just do what you were called to do(2 Tim 4:1-4).

With your statement then I guess Sunday School Teachers should be paid also.
A S/S teacher labors in the word and doctrine, especially if they are truly serving Jesus.
[ 1 TIM 5:17 ]

Apostle Paul WORKED as a tentmaker in Corinth with Aquila and Priscilla.
[Acts 18:1-3]
This is Biblical example of Missionaries/Pastors/Teachers WORKING for their keep.I think Paul set a good example for all who followed him.

 

[Crabtownboy]

You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

 

[Marcia]

You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

But it can't be all honey. The gospel is an offense - people do not want to hear about sin or that they are accountable to a righteous God. Who wants to hear that?

Jesus did not shy away from things like this.

 

[Allan]

With your statement then I guess Sunday School Teachers should be paid also.
A S/S teacher labors in the word and doctrine, especially if they are truly serving Jesus.
[ 1 TIM 5:17 ]

Apostle Paul WORKED as a tentmaker in Corinth with Aquila and Priscilla.
[Acts 18:1-3]
This is Biblical example of Missionaries/Pastors/Teachers WORKING for their keep.I think Paul set a good example for all who followed him.

Paul was not always working. As a matter of fact Paul said in 1 Cor 9:6-12:

6. Are we the only ones who have to support ourselves by working at another job?
7. Do soldiers pay their own salaries? Don't people who raise grapes eat some of what they grow? Don't shepherds get milk from their own goats?
8. I am not saying this on my own authority.
9. The Law of Moses tells us not to muzzle an ox when it is grinding grain. But was God concerned only about an ox?
10. No, he wasn't! He was talking about us. This was written in the Scriptures so that all who plow and all who grind the grain will look forward to sharing in the harvest.
11. When we told the message to you, it was like planting spiritual seed. So we have the right to accept material things as our harvest from you.
12. If others have the right to do this, we have an even greater right. But we haven't used this right of ours. We are willing to put up with anything to keep from causing trouble for the message about Christ.

But Paul did not take from 'them' becasue of their spiritual immaturity in the matter and his care was not about his physical gain or prosperity but their spiritual growth. However let it be remembered that he did receive finacial aide from other churches to help in his finacial need out there and Paul does state this little bit of rebuke later on concerning this very matter 2 Cor 11:7-9:
2

7. Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely?
8. I robbed other churches, taking wages of them, to do you service
9. And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me the brethren which came from Macedonia supplied: and in all things I have kept myself from being burdensome unto you, and so will I keep myself.

So Paul's example is that he has the right to be paid but chose not to be for their spiritual benifit, BUT he received from other churches 'wages' to help him while he was there (he said 'robbing') till that particular church grew up enough spiritualy to willingly pay the minister of the gospel.

 

[matt wade]

You catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

A fly can drown in honey too. If you aren't preaching the consequences of sin, people don't know what they need saving from. Without knowing the consequence of sin there is no salvation.

 

[Jedi Knight]

Therefore knowing the TERROR OF THE LORD we PERSUADE men to be reconciled! raying:

 

[grainofwheat]

Paul was not always working. As a matter of fact Paul said in 1 Cor 9:6-12:

But Paul did not take from 'them' becasue of their spiritual immaturity in the matter and his care was not about his physical gain or prosperity but their spiritual growth. However let it be remembered that he did receive finacial aide from other churches to help in his finacial need out there and Paul does state this little bit of rebuke later on concerning this very matter 2 Cor 11:7-9:
2

So Paul's example is that he has the right to be paid but chose not to be for their spiritual benifit, BUT he received from other churches 'wages' to help him while he was there (he said 'robbing') till that particular church grew up enough spiritualy to willingly pay the minister of the gospel.

Notice verses 6/12/18 in 1 COR 9 :1-18.
Paul acknowledges the right to earn money from his labor in the gospel but STILL WORKS. He received money [support] from other churches but still WORKED in Corinth.[Acts 18:1-3]

We have rights and can choose not to exercise them to advance a cause and in this case advance the Gospel.
Sunday School teachers do this every week around the world when they present the gospel without charge.

 

[sag38]

It's not about honey or vinegar. The idea is preach the whole counsel of God's word. And, when it some will be offended, some want care, but some will be saved.

 

[sag38]

Hell isn't the only thing folks don't want to hear about in the church. People don't want to hear about giving. They don't want to hear about soul winning. They don't want to hear about service in the church. They don't want to hear about personal and cooperate responsibility.

 

[Bob Alkire]

I recall A.W. Tozer said, something to the effect, that it was a shame when the pew tell the pulpit what to preach and the pulpit is to afraid of losing his job, so he goes along.

A lot of members do not want to hear about hell.

My brother in law who lives around Murray, Ky. and he is around 58 years old and a deacon in his church and he never knew hell was foe ever. He has never heard much about hell in church and he has been in Baptist churches most of his life. He now has done a good study on it (about 8 years ago) and knows much about it.

 

[HankD]

I recall A.W. Tozer said, something to the effect, that it was a shame when the pew tell the pulpit what to preach and the pulpit is to afraid of losing his job, so he goes along.

A lot of members do not want to hear about hell.

My brother in law who lives around Murray, Ky. and he is around 58 years old and a deacon in his church and he never knew hell was foe ever. He has never heard much about hell in church and he has been in Baptist churches most of his life. He now has done a good study on it (about 8 years ago) and knows much about it.

Hmm, Kentucky and he is a deacon in a Baptist church?

Is it a Primitive Baptist church? There are many in the Appalachians.

There is a PBC group called the "no-hellers (which is a misnomer)" who, though they don't deny the reality of hell, do not believe it is forever:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primitive_Baptist_Universalist


HankD

 

[gb93433]

I recall A.W. Tozer said, something to the effect, that it was a shame when the pew tell the pulpit what to preach and the pulpit is to afraid of losing his job, so he goes along.

That is because he has a job called ministry and not Jesus as Lord.

 

[sag38]

What????????

 

[sag38]

It's not about honey or vinegar. The idea is preach the whole counsel of God's word. And, when it some will be offended, some want care, but some will be saved.

Allow me to correct post #15: It's not about honey or vinegar. The idea is to preach the whole counsel of God' word. When it is preached, some will be offended, some won't care, but most importantly, some will be saved.