Was The Reformation Sent By God?

[Yeshua1]

Well I said I was done with this discussion but there needs to be a correction here according to scripture... They were called neither... Brother Glen

Acts 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

I know, was jesting, but would you not agree the Church in Acts much closer to baptist theology than that of rome?

 

[tyndale1946]

I know, was jesting, but would you not agree the Church in Acts much closer to baptist theology than that of rome?

Again neither... I like to go with Christ Theology... And my guess is they did to!... Why call yourself a Christian if you didn't?... Would you put your life on the line to be called one?... They did!... Brother Glen

 

[HankD]

Those who support Rome are masters of double speak!

Not exactly,if you mean those of the laity who support Rome they are most likely the victims of double-think or newspeak (double-speak is not Orwell's word).

It is the hierarchy that understands what is going on and are the perpetrators, the laity are the victims.
We are the "separated brethren" and incur guilt in accord with our past relationship with the RCC (or so it seems).

 

[Walter]

The Catholic Church was NOT there in Acts. as that was the First baptist Church of jerusalem!

I wouldn't expect you would be Baptist if you really didn't believe this. We simply will not agree. The difference is, I don't accuse you of belonging to a cult or not being a Christian. And, with this, I will conclude my posting on this thread.

 

[HankD]

I wouldn't expect you would be Baptist if you really didn't believe this. We simply will not agree. The difference is, I don't accuse you of belonging to a cult or not being a Christian. And, with this, I will conclude my posting on this thread.

It would help to let him know you believe Jesus Christ, God incarnate, is your hope for forgiveness of sin and eternal life.I know you do.
I think he is a young Christian.

According to many "protestant" sources (and probably unbeknown to them) Catholics fully qualify as Christians:

FIVE FUNDAMENTALS OF THE FAITH

There are five fundamentals of the faith which are essential for Christianity, and upon which we agree:

1. The Deity of our Lord Jesus Christ (John 1:1; John 20:28; Hebrews 1:8-9).
2. The Virgin Birth (Isaiah 7:14; Matthew 1:23; Luke 1:27).
3. The Blood Atonement (Acts 20:28; Romans 3:25, 5:9; Ephesians 1:7; Hebrews 9:12-14).
4. The Bodily Resurrection (Luke 24:36-46; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, 15:14-15).
5. The inerrancy of the scriptures themselves (Psalms 12:6-7; Romans 15:4; 2 Timothy 3:16-17; 2 Peter 1:20). [1]

And those who disagree with any of the above doctrines are not Christians at all. Rather, they are the true heretics.
So disagreements are perfectly acceptable within the confines of Christianity, because our salvation does not hinge upon doctrines other than the above five.

Five Fundamentals of the Faith

 

[Walter]

It would help to let him know you believe Jesus Christ, God incarnate, is your hope for forgiveness of sin and eternal life.I know you do.
I think he is a young Christian.

According to many "protestant" sources (and probably unbeknown to them) Catholics fully qualify as Christians:



Five Fundamentals of the Faith

Hank, I have posted my personal testimony on the last thread he posted attacking Catholic Christians.
I have affirmed my faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. I trust is in His shed blood on the cross for my salvation.
I also affirmed my belief in all 5 fundamentals listed in various posts over the years. Yeshua1 is familiar with my profession of faith but continually insists I believe in a 'false gospel'.

 

[HankD]

Hank, I have posted my personal testimony on the last thread he posted attacking Catholic Christians
I have affirmed my faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. My hope for salvation is in His shed blood on the cross
I also affirmed my belief in all 5 fundamentals listed in various posts over the years. Yeshua1 is familiar with my profession of faith but continually insists I believe in a 'false gospel'.

Many Catholics do indeed believe in a false gospel but so do many Baptists, Methodist, Presbyterians, etc....

But by your profession you indeed are my brother in Christ.

Yeshua1 - For two years after my salvation I remained in the Catholic Church. So I was also a saved Catholic while in the RCC.

Not that Walter should leave his church - unless of course his conscience so dictates.

You will note Walter that my beef is with the hierarchy of the Church.

I think its good that true believers can fellowship at a distance provided by cyberspace.

 

[Wesley Briggman]

Does this teaching of the RCC meet the criteria of John 3:5?

[Jhn 3:5 KJV] 5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

PART TWO
THE CELEBRATION OF THE CHRISTIAN MYSTERY

SECTION TWO
THE SEVEN SACRAMENTS OF THE CHURCH

CHAPTER ONE
THE SACRAMENTS OF CHRISTIAN INITIATION

ARTICLE 1
THE SACRAMENT OF BAPTISM

1213 Holy Baptism is the basis of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit (vitae spiritualis ianua),4 and the door which gives access to the other sacraments. Through Baptism we are freed from sin and reborn as sons of God; we become members of Christ, are incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission: "Baptism is the sacrament of regeneration through water in the word."5

Reference: Catechism of the Catholic Church - The sacrament of Baptism

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Does this teaching of the RCC meet the criteria of John 3:5?

[Jhn 3:5 KJV] 5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and [of] the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Sure... that is the belief system of the RCC, Presbyterians, Anglican’s, Lutherans or any sacramental churches.

PART TWO
THE CELEBRATION OF THE CHRISTIAN MYSTERY

SECTION TWO
THE SEVEN SACRAMENTS OF THE CHURCH

CHAPTER ONE
THE SACRAMENTS OF CHRISTIAN INITIATION

ARTICLE 1
THE SACRAMENT OF BAPTISM

1213 Holy Baptism is the basis of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit (vitae spiritualis ianua),4 and the door which gives access to the other sacraments. Through Baptism we are freed from sin and reborn as sons of God; we become members of Christ, are incorporated into the Church and made sharers in her mission: "Baptism is the sacrament of regeneration through water in the word."5

Reference: Catechism of the Catholic Church - The sacrament of Baptism

 

[Yeshua1]

It would help to let him know you believe Jesus Christ, God incarnate, is your hope for forgiveness of sin and eternal life.I know you do.
I think he is a young Christian.

According to many "protestant" sources (and probably unbeknown to them) Catholics fully qualify as Christians:



Five Fundamentals of the Faith

I have been saved by Grace of God many yeras, and have NO problem with any Catholic who the Lord saved, its that the tenets and dogmas of His church are not from/of God, especially how they view salvation!

 

[Yeshua1]

Many Catholics do indeed believe in a false gospel but so do many Baptists, Methodist, Presbyterians, etc....

But by your profession you indeed are my brother in Christ.

Yeshua1 - For two years after my salvation I remained in the Catholic Church. So I was also a saved Catholic while in the RCC.

Not that Walter should leave his church - unless of course his conscience so dictates.

You will note Walter that my beef is with the hierarchy of the Church.

I think its good that true believers can fellowship at a distance provided by cyberspace.

Again there are many Catholics saved despite official cathoic doctrines, as any of us saved is due tothe Grace of God, but would younot agrre the Gospel of Rome is Not the biblical one?

 

[Yeshua1]

Hank, I have posted my personal testimony on the last thread he posted attacking Catholic Christians.
I have affirmed my faith in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. I trust is in His shed blood on the cross for my salvation.
I also affirmed my belief in all 5 fundamentals listed in various posts over the years. Yeshua1 is familiar with my profession of faith but continually insists I believe in a 'false gospel'.

No, i insist that offical catholic Gospel is the false one, as you would be saved by the real one, but for some strange reason wandered back intot he church that teaches falsely!

 

[Yeshua1]

I say that you would be a saved person whose Church itself tewaches many wrong doctrines, and worst of all, proclaims a false Gospel!

 

[HankD]

I have been saved by Grace of God many yeras, and have NO problem with any Catholic who the Lord saved, its that the tenets and dogmas of His church are not from/of God, especially how they view salvation!

Not all their tenets would be disagreeable to you.

We have complete agreement in many areas, The deity of Christ, the Hypostatic Union, The Trinity, and others.

 

[HankD]

Again there are many Catholics saved despite official cathoic doctrines, as any of us saved is due tothe Grace of God, but would younot agrre the Gospel of Rome is Not the biblical one?

Yes, I would agree with that statement.

 

[Yeshua1]

Not all their tenets would be disagreeable to you.

We have complete agreement in many areas, The deity of Christ, the Hypostatic Union, The Trinity, and others.

The foundationl one oh how a sinner hets justified before god is no agreement on though! Nor on Rome being true church, papacy, sacramwntalism etc. They are much same as Sda, have some doctrines in common, but hoild to others that make them no longer a real Christian church!

 

[HankD]

The gospel of Rome mixes works with grace. As a young person going to catechism class for my First Holy Communion and then later my Confirmation (2 "sacraments" of the Church) I was taught that my salvation via my baptism had to be restored/maintained via the sacraments.

Confession and absolution cleansed me of sin only so long as I stayed in the state of sanctifying grace, a mortal sin would cause the fall from said grace and hellfire as the consequence. Confession, penance and absolution restored me to the possibility of heaven.

Sometimes a mortal sin would be committed in my mind before even leaving the church after confession on Saturday.

Technically speaking I shouldn't take communion at Sunday mass but then what would my cousins think (who went to confession with me )?

And so it is/was day by day, year by year for Catholics. Never really sure

 

[HankD]

The foundationl one oh how a sinner hets justified before god is no agreement on though! Nor on Rome being true church, papacy, sacramwntalism etc. They are much same as Sda, have some doctrines in common, but hoild to others that make them no longer a real Christian church!

Yeshua1 IMO you need more wisdom to deal with the "rank and file" Catholics.

 

[HankD]

How to determine if a Catholic is saved?

Who are they trusting?

Once as a saved Catholic while in the military, I was having a conversation with a "GI" buddy (also Catholic) about sin and his personal eternal life.

My buddy said this with emotion "Hank, I am so evil that only Jesus Christ can save me - if He will have me".

I got a little emotional as well and assured him Jesus probably already had Him.

 

[Yeshua1]

Yeshua1 IMO you need more wisdom to deal with the "rank and file" Catholics.

In order to dal more effectively with them, they first have to realise and admit that theur Church teaches false doctrines and dogmas... Really, once saved, they should depart out from that church.