-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Was there death already before Adam?
- Thread starter xdisciplex
- Start date
DHK,
You seem to be taking "heavens" in Genesis and Exodus as the spiritual realm Heaven (where God and the angels are), but "heaven/heavens" can also mean the physical sky and space. Those were discussion of the the creation of the physical universe, (the stars and sun are not in the spiritual Heaven), and if that was all it was meant to describe, then the "no two creations" issue is moot.
You seem to be taking "heavens" in Genesis and Exodus as the spiritual realm Heaven (where God and the angels are), but "heaven/heavens" can also mean the physical sky and space. Those were discussion of the the creation of the physical universe, (the stars and sun are not in the spiritual Heaven), and if that was all it was meant to describe, then the "no two creations" issue is moot.
BobRyan did you bother to read my entire post? Lucifier was the original ruler and when he fell God created Adam and Eve to rule in his place. However they fell prior to taking the reigns.
If they would have ruled then mankind would still be ruling today. And that is not the case Satan is the god of this world, the prince of the power of the air, etc.
Satan still rules because he got Adam and Eve to disqualify themselves. Christ met Satan and proved Himself worthy where Adam and Eve failed.
No it wasn't, but if you want to continue believing that so be it, but it also explains why you make so many other mistakes in handling Scripture, because you have destroyed the very foundation.
The six days was not six days of creation (although there is some creating going on in the animal world and man himself), but rather six days of restoration.
God was restorying that which Satan had defiled in his fall.
This is why so many people have a hard time with other parts of Scripture because they have destroyed the very foundation of Scripture.
There are a number of principals that are destroyed, but one of the main ones is the very first mention of salvation in Genesis 1:2, 3. It's no wonder people have twisted the easy message of the good news of eternal salvation, it's because its very foundation has been destroyed.
You destroy the foundation and you are going to come out with a lopsided final product and that is evident in this section of the BB.
Brother Bob
New Member
Lets keep this simple and see who will answer.
God said "thou shalt not steal"= not steal is "good".
When God made this good thing to not steal did at that very moment it become possible to steal and do evil?
BR, DHK please answer. peace
God said "thou shalt not steal"= not steal is "good".
When God made this good thing to not steal did at that very moment it become possible to steal and do evil?
BR, DHK please answer. peace
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
#1 God is the king of the Universe - not just one planet.
#2. God is just and always has been.
#3. God has always had LAW -- the Law of Love has always existed. God's character demands it.
#4. Lucifer was created sinless, perfect, holy, in harmony with God.
#5. Lucifer caused 1/3 of the angels to fall.
#6. THEN God Created "Earth" - along with our Sun and Moon (TWO great lights) from the standpoint of a viewer on earth.
#7. God restricted Satan to the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Satan did not appear as a fallen angel for that would have given him away. So he disquised himself as a serpent.
Think about how much worse it would have been for Adam if a sinless angel had stood before him and tempted him to fall as a command from God relayed through the angel??!! Better the serpent!
#8. Mankind fell - ONCE and the earth was plunged into sin.
#9. Then came the flood and the earth was "destroyed the FIRST time by water". But it will be destroyed a second time -- by fire. 2Peter 3.
#2. God is just and always has been.
#3. God has always had LAW -- the Law of Love has always existed. God's character demands it.
#4. Lucifer was created sinless, perfect, holy, in harmony with God.
#5. Lucifer caused 1/3 of the angels to fall.
#6. THEN God Created "Earth" - along with our Sun and Moon (TWO great lights) from the standpoint of a viewer on earth.
#7. God restricted Satan to the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Satan did not appear as a fallen angel for that would have given him away. So he disquised himself as a serpent.
Think about how much worse it would have been for Adam if a sinless angel had stood before him and tempted him to fall as a command from God relayed through the angel??!! Better the serpent!
#8. Mankind fell - ONCE and the earth was plunged into sin.
#9. Then came the flood and the earth was "destroyed the FIRST time by water". But it will be destroyed a second time -- by fire. 2Peter 3.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Brother Bob said:
It was always wrong to steal, always wrong to murder.
Notice that God said to Cain "SIN is at your door but you must master it" -- SIN was there (the sin of hate and murder) BEFORE codified in stone on Sinai.
Noah takes the CLEAN animals by 7's and the UNCLEAN by 2's BEFORE the Lev 11 codification "the distinction" for US to read - God's Law was known BEFORE the codification in books!
Abraham is said by God to be the man who kept My "Laws, Statutes and Commandments" -- when as yet we READ of none.
The OT is not an exhaustive account of all life for 1600 years before the flood -- as it turns out.
God is a God of justice. That means law existed for as long as God did.
J. Jump said:
Man still rules the physical to an extent. Satan only rules the spiritual to an extent which is why the best he can do is tempt you. In other words, man still has dominion.
Man's limitation is our inability to believe what is beyond our ability to reason. This is why Jesus said to men this might seem impossible, but to GOD. Though satan has influence on the spiritual and man has dominion of the physical GOD still has last word on everything.
Brother Bob
New Member
That is not what I really am asking.
Of course it was always wrong but only when God made man for God and His son was not going to steal.
So same question but when God imputed to not steal was good.
What in the world would the purpose of the Law to be in Heaven before the world began?
Of course it was always wrong but only when God made man for God and His son was not going to steal.
So same question but when God imputed to not steal was good.
What in the world would the purpose of the Law to be in Heaven before the world began?
Last edited by a moderator:
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Brother Bob said:
God created the universe, the Angels, the other Galaxies but none of that is mentioned in the 7 day week of Creation since that deals with just the earth and "the two great lights" (on day 4).
It was just as wrong for Angels to steal, murder and lie before God created man - as it was for man to do it after being created.
Brother Bob
New Member
You don't believe that God's angels stole, murdered and all those things do you Bob?
Is 45:7,
5: I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
6: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
8: Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
9
Is 45:7,
5: I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:
6: That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.
7: I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
8: Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
9
Last edited by a moderator:
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
LeBuick said:
according to 2Cor 4 and Eph 2:1-5 Satan is "the god of this world" and we are his slaves.
Satan offers this world to Christ in Matt 4 showing him all the cities of earth.
Satan goes before God in Job 1 and 2 representing the earth - when all the "sons of God" come before Him.
Believe it - we LOST this earth when Adam - our federal "head" gave the farm away!