What about Rom 10:9-10 ?

[savedbymercy]

dhk

Now you claim that "faith" is a work.

Yes, did you read post 227 ? There you will finf other men who studied God's Word who understands that Faith is Work.

 

[DHK]

God has not been without witness that a misunderstanding of Justification by Faith can be fatal when we consider Faith or Believing in Christ as a condition or requirement that man must perform to get saved ! Here is a piece by Samuel Richardson:

Samuel Richardson??????????
He was a novelist of the 17th and 18th centuries. He wrote novels not theology! His two most famous novels are Pamela and Clarissa. Clarissa has the dubious distinction of being one of the longest unread novels in the world, being composed of over one million words. And this is your theological source??

[FONT=&quot]http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=10656442[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]http://www.bookrags.com/biography/samuel-richardson/[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

Samuel Richardson??????????

Yes Samuel Richardson. This lets you know that God has not been without witness for a long time, in pointing out your type of error.

He was a novelist of the 17th and 18th centuries. He wrote novels not theology!

He may have wrote novelties, but he also wrote about Justification by Christ alone, have you read this ?

http://www.mountzionpbc.org/Index/index08.htm

Now i cannot endorse everything the man taught, but this piece of Justification by Christ alone is as sound theology wise as they come, and it is a witness against your salvation by works disguised as salvation by Grace through Faith !

 

[savedbymercy]

John 6:56

56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

This scripture, if properly understood, gives us to know that one before believing in Christ must first be in Union with Him, they in Him and He in them by New Birth, this believing here is equated as eating and drinking of His Body and Blood, Spiritually speaking; However anyone knows that before eating and drinking of such pleasant spiritual dainties, an appetite must first be created for it, which spiritual appetite comes by New Birth. Their will be a genuine spiritual appetite for the Bread of Life obtained, before we desire to feed upon it or Him. So Jesus says blessed already who what ? Matt 5:6

6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

That hunger for Righteousness is created by the Spirit of God at New Birth Jn 16:8-10

8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:

9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;

10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more;

Then He reveals Christ's as Our Righteousness to Faith from Faith by the Gospel Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

The Holy Spirit gives us to see and feel the need of Righteousness, then fulfills that need by making Christ known through the Gospel, and we begin to eat of His Body, Drink of His Blood !

 

[DHK]

dhk



Yes Samuel Richardson. This lets you know that God has not been without witness for a long time, in pointing out your type of error.



He may have wrote novelties, but he also wrote about Justification by Christ alone, have you read this ?

http://www.mountzionpbc.org/Index/index08.htm

Now i cannot endorse everything the man taught, but this piece of Justification by Christ alone is as sound theology wise as they come, and it is a witness against your salvation by works disguised as salvation by Grace through Faith !

He wrote for people. He wrote speeches for politicians, introductions to parliaments, etc. His forte was in novels. He was not a theologian. That piece was a simple piece of prose containing some opinion of his as well thought out as a poem to be published. He was a writer not a theologian. Your source is not credible at all.

Besides all of that, you are the one that believes salvation is by works.
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
Believe means have faith.
You declare that faith is a work, therefore you believe salvation is by works.

Why are you denying that this fact. Your faith says: "I (SBM) believe in salvation by works)."

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

He wrote for people

So.. He can have a secular life job. Do you ? Everyone who has a interest in spiritual things do not quit their regular jobs. I have a regular job, but love the things of God. What planet you live on ?

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

Besides all of that, you are the one that believes salvation is by works.

You believe salvation is by works, something man does. It is man that believes,an act of his. The word work is the greek word ergon:

business, employment, that which any one is occupied

a) that which one undertakes to do, enterprise, undertaking

2) any product whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or mind

3) an act, deed, thing done: the idea of working is emphasised in opp. to that which is less than work

You point to the Phillipian Jailor, what was his question ? Acts 16:30

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

This lets me know that you believe in salvation by what you do, thats a false salvation, one of works.

Paul would have told the the Jailor Titus 3:5

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

 

[DHK]

dhk



You believe salvation is by works, something man does. It is man that believes,an act of his. The word work is the greek word ergon:


3) an act, deed, thing done: the idea of working is emphasised in opp. to that which is less than work

You point to the Phillipian Jailor, what was his question ? Acts 16:30

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

This lets me know that you believe in salvation by what you do, thats a false salvation, one of works.

Paul would have told the the Jailor Titus 3:5

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

But Paul didn't point the jailer to Titus 3:5 did he? What is recorded is what is recorded.
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."
It goes straight across the grain of your theology.
In spite of what the Bible says you call it works salvation, but that is what the Bible teaches. You call salvation by faith works salvation. You are badly misled.

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

But Paul didn't point the jailer to Titus 3:5 did he?

He preached the Word of God to him Acts 16:32

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Is Titus 3:5 the word of the Lord ?

 

[DHK]

dhk



He preached the Word of God to him Acts 16:32

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Is Titus 3:5 the word of the Lord ?

NO! Titus was a pastoral epistle written well after Paul's encounter with the Philippian jailer.

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

NO!

Yes !

 

[savedbymercy]

Acts 16:30-32 -

Acts 16:30-32

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.


Yes Paul was correct in what he stated to the Jailor, for the Jailor under conviction of the Holy Ghost, cried out what must I do to be saved, which is but a reasonable request for anyone under Holy Conviction for sin, Just like the jews on the day of Pentecost, under Holy Ghost conviction cried out Acts 2:37

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

And Paul responded with the imperative, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved. For now was the opportune time by the providence of God for Paul to speak forth the word of the Lord, the Gospel of Christ to an inquiring Soul Acts 16:32

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

Now upon speaking the Gospel to the Jailor, Paul would explain the Person and Work of Jesus Christ from scripture, like Philip did here Acts 8:31-35

31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:

33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.

34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?

35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.

Preaching Jesus Christ means to explain who He is, what has He done or accomplished by His Work of the Cross, for whom He did it for, and Why !

Paul would not command a soul to believe on Christ without Preaching the Gospel according to scripture 1 Cor 15:3.

If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ, his obeying the command to believe was evidence of him being in a saved state, or else how could he had believed the preaching of the Cross, which to the unsaved perishing man is foolishness 1 Cor 1:18

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved or being saved it is the power of God.

So Acts 16:31 is not teaching a man gets saved by his doing or by his obeying a command, that is salvation by works and Law, only those who wrest scripture to their destruction preach such a false gospel !

For the Jailor no more got saved by his act of obedience to believe on Christ as the jews got saved by their act of obedience in getting baptized in Acts 2:37-38

 

[DHK]

Acts 16:30-32

30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?

31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.


Yes Paul was correct in what he stated to the Jailor, for the Jailor under conviction of the Holy Ghost, cried out what must I do to be saved, which is but a reasonable request for anyone under Holy Conviction for sin, Just like the jews on the day of Pentecost, under Holy Ghost conviction cried out Acts 2:37

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

Acts 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
--They received his word (believed), were saved and then baptized.

And Paul responded with the imperative, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved. For now was the opportune time by the providence of God for Paul to speak forth the word of the Lord, the Gospel of Christ to an inquiring Soul Acts 16:32

The imperative "believe"
He obeyed. He believed.
He was saved. What would make you think any different other than a pre-conceived theology?

32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.

You are making assumptions here, and reading into the Scriptures. Paul is preaching to the household of the jailor. There is nothing to say that the jailer did not trust Christ, believe on him, as Paul said or commanded in 16:31. He also heard the gospel there. I am sure that not everything recorded is all that was said (how much was said all the time they were in prison before that time; how much truth was put forth in what they were singing? etc. how much did he hear as they witnessed to other prisoners, etc.?)

Now upon speaking the Gospel to the Jailor, Paul would explain the Person and Work of Jesus Christ from scripture, like Philip did here Acts 8:31-35

31 And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.

32 The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:

33 In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.

34 And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?

35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.

Preaching Jesus Christ means to explain who He is, what has He done or accomplished by His Work of the Cross, for whom He did it for, and Why !

And the Ethiopian Eunuch did what you cannot do, or haven't done on this board. He confessed Christ.

Acts 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

He believed and was saved. Have you believed? If so when.

Paul would not command a soul to believe on Christ without Preaching the Gospel according to scripture 1 Cor 15:3.

Who said he would, and what makes you think any of us believes any different. The fact is that salvation is by faith in Christ.
Faith is not a work. We are commanded to believe.

If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ, his obeying the command to believe was evidence of him being in a saved state, or else how could he had believed the preaching of the Cross, which to the unsaved perishing man is foolishness 1 Cor 1:18

For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved or being saved it is the power of God.

So Acts 16:31 is not teaching a man gets saved by his doing or by his obeying a command, that is salvation by works and Law, only those who wrest scripture to their destruction preach such a false gospel !

You are contradicting yourself. You just said:

"If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ,"

That is no different then what you just said above and called works. It is a contradiction.

For the Jailor no more got saved by his act of obedience to believe on Christ as the jews got saved by their act of obedience in getting baptized in Acts 2:37-38

Getting baptized didn't get them saved. Their belief in Christ did.
Do you believe in baptismal regeneration?
That indeed is works salvation!!

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

That indeed is works salvation!!

And that is what you believe in, that a man is saved by what he does, in this case, his act of believing, that is salvation by works, and I have showed you that is not what Paul taught in Acts 16 :31-32, Paul merely directed and instructed a spirtitally awakened sinner to Faith in Christ, who after New Birth needed spritual teaching as Jesus had instrcted. Matt 28:18-19

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Paul had been providentially put there by Christ to disciple that man whom Christ saved.

You believe in works salvation, and I am here to prove it !

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

You are contradicting yourself. You just said:

"If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ,"

Yes, thats no contradiction, but in your blatant dishonesty you ommitted the rest of the statement which said:

If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ, his obeying the command to believe was evidence of him being in a saved state, or else how could he had believed the preaching of the Cross, which to the unsaved perishing man is foolishness 1 Cor 1:18

So you are a very dishonest and deceitful man to get your point accross, that is not christian behaviour !

 

[DHK]

dhk



And that is what you believe in, that a man is saved by what he does, in this case, his act of believing, that is salvation by works, and I have showed you that is not what Paul taught in Acts 16 :31-32, Paul merely directed and instructed a spirtitally awakened sinner to Faith in Christ, who after New Birth needed spritual teaching as Jesus had instrcted. Matt 28:18-19

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

Paul had been providentially put there by Christ to disciple that man whom Christ saved.

You believe in works salvation, and I am here to prove it !

Christ saves every man who puts their faith and trust in him.
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
He believed and he was saved.

But you don't believe the Bible; you remain in a state of unbelief.

 

[DHK]

dhk

Yes, thats no contradiction, but in your blatant dishonesty you ommitted the rest of the statement which said:

So you are a very dishonest and deceitful man to get your point accross, that is not christian behaviour !

There is proof that you belief salvation is by works.
Either Christ saved him when he put his faith and trust in him or he didn't.
You say Christ saved him when he believed and was baptized and then when he obeyed, etc. Your belief is similar to the Church of Christ's and other cults.

He was saved by faith and faith alone--that faith being in Christ alone through grace alone.

The baptism and obedience via the Great Commission are what follows salvation, not a part of it.

 

[savedbymercy]

There is proof that you belief salvation is by works.

Yes, thats no contradiction, but in your blatant dishonesty you ommitted the rest of the statement which said:

So you are a very dishonest and deceitful man to get your point accross, that is not christian behaviour !

 

[DHK]

Yes, thats no contradiction, but in your blatant dishonesty you ommitted the rest of the statement which said:

So you are a very dishonest and deceitful man to get your point accross, that is not christian behaviour !

You admit:
YES THAT'S NO CONTRADICTION.

There is no dishonesty in omitting that which did not have to be repeated if my point was honestly made. Saving space by making posts shorter and thus easier to read ought to be one of our aims.

For example if you quote a passage of twenty verses don't expect me to repost them all. When something doesn't need to be re-posted it won't get my attention. There was nothing dishonest done.

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

You admit:
YES THAT'S NO CONTRADICTION.

Yes, thats no contradiction, but in your blatant dishonesty you ommitted the rest of the statement which said:

If after the preaching of the Gospel the Jailor did believe ,obey the command to believe on Christ, then he was saved by Christ, his obeying the command to believe was evidence of him being in a saved state, or else how could he had believed the preaching of the Cross, which to the unsaved perishing man is foolishness 1 Cor 1:18


So you are a very dishonest and deceitful man to get your point accross, that is not christian behaviour !