What about Rom 10:9-10 ?

[savedbymercy]

The Bible states:
Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.

I didn't say that; the bible did!
If you deny the Bible, there is no more hope left.

Believing on the Lord Jesus Christ is doing something. The Jailor asked what must I do to be saved !

So, now are you admitting that you got saved by doing something ?

 

[Don]

Believing on the Lord Jesus Christ is doing something. The Jailor asked what must I do to be saved !

So, now are you admitting that you got saved by doing something ?

You know, that really qualifies as a "stupid question."

The jailer asked Paul, an apostle of Jesus, "what must I do to be saved?" And Paul told him, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved."

The reason your post qualifies as a "stupid question"? Because if you say that "believing on the Lord Jesus Christ doesn't save you," then you're calling Paul a liar, and you're saying that scripture lies.

 

[savedbymercy]

Believing the Gospel is a work, a doing, a deed !



James 1:25

25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Now what does James mean here by the Perfect Law of Liberty ? He is speaking of the Law of Moses, as it has been fulfilled by Christ, as explained in the Gospel. Gal 3:23-26; Rom 10:4. So the Perfect law of Liberty in James is also the Word of Truth [The Gospel] James 1:18

18Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

Eph 1:13

In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

This word of Truth of the Gospel does include Christ's fulfillment of the Law in behalf of all that He did die for Rom 10:4, it gives believers a sensible liberty of having been set free by Christ Isa 61:1

The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;

Jn 8:36;

36If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Gal 5:1

1Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

So now a look into this Perfect Law of Liberty, being a Look into the Gospel, and a continuing therein, a continuing in the Truth as indicated back in Jn 8:31-32

31Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;

32And ye shall know the truth, and the truth[word of Truth] shall make you free.

Then are ye blessed in your deed, or your doing, or the work , which can only mean or point back to the act or deed or work of believing or looking ! The word deed is the greek word poiēsis and means a doing or performing, a obedience to a law !

James actually calls this Look as being a doer of the work ! Yes, Believing is a doing of a work, a deed !

The word deed is also from the root poieō, and means do, of which the Jailor asked What must I Do to be saved ? Acts 16:30, and of course Paul commanded him to do something, which was to believe. The act or deed he must do to be saved was to believe. Now it cannot be denied that believing is not a deed that a person does, or how could James under inspiration of God call it a deed, a work ? So again, if anyone of us is claiming to get saved because they believed as in Acts 16:31-32, then we are claiming to get saved by our work, our deed. For the greek word for work in scripture is ergon and means:


business, employment, that which any one is occupied

a) that which one undertakes to do, enterprise, undertaking

2) any product whatever, any thing accomplished by hand, art, industry, or mind

3) an act, deed, thing done: the idea of working is emphasised in opp. to that which is less than work

Also translated deed Rom 3:20

I have by the Grace of God, proven from scripture once again that believing is a work, a deed, that man performs James 1:25 !

 

[AresMan]

Believing on the Lord Jesus Christ is doing something. The Jailor asked what must I do to be saved !

So, now are you admitting that you got saved by doing something ?

The "doing something" is the basis for which someone is justified before God. The means itself also comes from God so that no one can boast.
Election and justification are not the same exact thing, but all who are one are the other.
Election is unconditional--according to God's eternal choice.
Justification is "by/through faith."
Faith for justification is given by God because of election.

Act 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

Rom 3:24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
Rom 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.

Rom 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

We are justified "freely by His grace." This means that God is free to justify whom He will, as you would agree. However, The Scriptures clearly define the means by which God justifies according to His will. Those who God justifies, He does through the channel of faith.

1. We are elected according to God's eternal purpose, not our own will.
2. We are justified by God's grace through the means of faith apart from the Law.
3. We believe only because God gave us the faith, resulting in our belief in the gospel.
4. God justifies people for the purpose of having a people for Himself who desire Him to His own glory.

Those whom God saves He keeps. He draws a people to Himself to be His people, not just in an accounting sense, but in a real sense.

 

[AresMan]

Rom 5:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

You cannot divorce the means from the effect. We would both agree that an unregenerate does not "muster up" saving faith on his own, but that it is given to him from God. I do not see why you would have a problem with this.

 

[AresMan]

Believing the Gospel is a work, a doing, a deed !

Sure, but you have to take Paul's many statements contrasting "works" (often meant of the Law) and "faith" to understand that there is a difference between the "doing" of faith and the "doing" of "works" that Paul's readership would understand.

 

[savedbymercy]

arse

The "doing something" is the basis for which someone is justified before God.

That's works salvation, a false gospel !

 

[savedbymercy]

The Bible states:
Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.

I didn't say that; the bible did!
If you deny the Bible, there is no more hope left.

I believe Acts 16:30-31, but what you believe is that one is saved by their work, their act of believing, that is not stated in Acts 16:31-32 !

If one obeys as Paul commanded the Jailor in Acts 16 there, then they were saved !

The Believing after the command proved they had been given a New Heart. Ezk 36:26-27

26A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Remember the Jailer's question ? What must I DO to be saved ?

Well, Paul said believe in Christ and Thou shalt be saved, because that is the only way one can believe in Christ, is with the New Heart that God gives in New Birth, which Ezk 36:26-27 is describing.

So, you best take note of this post here, maybe you want to write it down , so you can refer to it later. And what makes it so bad, these are things I have already stated on this board, over and over again !

 

[DHK]

I believe Acts 16:30-31, but what you believe is that one is saved by their work, their act of believing, that is not stated in Acts 16:31-32 !

If one obeys as Paul commanded the Jailor in Acts 16 there, then they were saved !

The Believing after the command proved they had been given a New Heart. Ezk 36:26-27

26A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Remember the Jailer's question ? What must I DO to be saved ?

Well, Paul said believe in Christ and Thou shalt be saved, because that is the only way one can believe in Christ, is with the New Heart that God gives in New Birth, which Ezk 36:26-27 is describing.

So, you best take note of this post here, maybe you want to write it down , so you can refer to it later. And what makes it so bad, these are things I have already stated on this board, over and over again !

I don't have to write the heresy down.

The account goes this way:
"What must I do to be saved?
Paul did not say: "Well jailer, first you must turn to Ez.36:26,27 and learn about a new heart." He didn't say that. That is your corrupted theology.
He simply said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."
Faith is all that was required.
You deny the Scriptures.

 

[savedbymercy]

I don't have to write the heresy down.

The account goes this way:
"What must I do to be saved?
Paul did not say: "Well jailer, first you must turn to Ez.36:26,27 and learn about a new heart." He didn't say that. That is your corrupted theology.
He simply said, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."
Faith is all that was required.
You deny the Scriptures.

You calling the Truth of God heresy, you deny that Christ's Death in and of itself saved anyone, wow !

Si it is written Isa 5:20

Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

 

[The Biblicist]

If one obeys as Paul commanded the Jailor in Acts 16 there, then they were saved !

So you have no problem changing God's word? The text does not say "were" but "shalt be" saved!

However, that is what you must do to justify your false and heretical doctrine you must change God's Word.

Paul did not say "Beleive BECAUSE you are already saved" but "beleive on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou SHALT BE saved."

What good does it do to discuss with someone who intentionaly changes God's Word to suit themselves and distorts our words to suit themselves???

 

[savedbymercy]

the bib

The text does not say "were" but "shalt be" saved!

Correct, shalt be saved also means, being in saved state !

For example. A friend told me to look for the man in a red shirt, he shall be wearing a red shirt and black pants !

Another example from a writer that explains the word shall be in a soterilogical phrase :

Must One Believe to "Be Saved?"



In a word, YES, but not for the reasons most people think. However, those who believe in what is called High Calvinism or Unconditional Election and Predestination or Particular Redemption such as the Primitive Baptists, some times say, No, you don't have to believe in order to be saved. This difficulty arises from a misconception, sometimes in both Calvinists and Arminians, about what it means to be saved.

First, the Bible makes a distinction between being saved eternally (eternal life) and being saved in time (conversion). That does not mean that eternal salvation and salvation in time are mutually exclusive. The fact is one begets the other. Salvation is a broad term that encompasses both eternal life and conversion. Therefore, those who experience eternal life will likewise experience conversion. But confusion arises when a failure is made to distinguish the meaning of a small but significant word be.

Most modern Christians, because of false theology, think the scriptures teach that to be means the same thing as to get. However, there is an important difference between the two. If the Bible taught that one must believe in order to get saved, then salvation would be by our own effort. But the Bible teaches one must believe in order to be saved. The word be indicates a statement of fact. The word get indicates a condition to be met.

What's the difference? Mark 16:16 states, He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Clearly this scripture is talking about salvation in both its temporal and eternal aspect. Many Christians today have been taught that scriptures such as this one mean you must believe in order to get saved. But that is not at all what Christ said. The term "shall be saved" is translated from the Greek word sodzo. In this passage the verb sodzo is in the Future Tense, Passive Voice, Indicative Mood. The Online Bible says, "The indicative mood is a simple statement of fact." Because sodzo is written in the indicative mood, it means the salvation Christ has under consideration is not and cannot be a condition to be met. It means that belief is the evidence or assurance of salvation not the means to obtain salvation. It means that everyone who has been saved or will "be saved" will believe in Christ as a matter of fact. Thus, as this scripture demonstrates, belief is necessary because of salvation not to get salvation.

If Christ had rendered sodzo in the imperative mood, then one would be correct in saying you must believe in order to get saved. The Online Bible defines the imperative mood as that which, "expresses a command to the hearer to perform a certain action by the order and authority of the one commanding." A good example of a scripture with an imperative command is found in the Great Commission. Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, Mathew 28:19. "Teach" is from the Greek word matheteuo. This verb is written in the imperative mood and expresses a clear command to the disciples to teach the nations Christ's doctrine.

Another example of sodzo is found in Ro 10:9, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. And again in Ro 10:13, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. In both of these scriptures sodzo is rendered in the indicative mood. Therefore it is a statement of fact that anyone who confesses belief in Jesus and His resurrection, calling upon His name from the heart, will be saved. Because the mood is indicative, it is not the belief, confession or sincerity that results in the saving, either in time or in eternity. Jesus Christ is the Saviour. He saves with the power of his shed blood and by grace alone delivers the sinner from death. Belief, confession and sincerity from the heart are all the result of Christ's saving work not the cause or means to obtain that saving work.

The recipients of this sovereign saving work of Christ are referred to in the scriptures as my sheep, His People, my people, the chosen, the elect and Israel (spiritual). John 10:27, Mathew 1:21, II Corinthians 6:16, Ephesians 1:4, II Timothy 2:10, Romans 9:6-24.

It is true that one doesn't have to believe in order to get saved but the Bible teaches a person must believe to be saved.

http://www.oldschoolbaptist.org/Articles/MustOneBelieveToBeSaved.htm

If you still do not understand, that is too bad !

 

[The Biblicist]

the bib



Correct, shalt be saved also means, being in saved state !

For example. A friend told me to look for the man in a red shirt, he shall be wearing a red shirt and black pants!

What utter nonsense and what a utter rediculous illustration! Believe is the condition set forth by Paul and Silas in answer to the question "what shall I do".

The question is framed in a continuous present "what must I keep on doing and doing" while the answer is framed in a puntilliar complete act - "believe" and thou "shalt be saved."

You missed your calling, you should be a majician because they use slight of hand and deception.

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

What utter nonsense

The truth is nonesense to those who are perishing. Now I have explained to you what Shall be saved means, and you reject the wisdom of it, you have no cloak now for your sin !

 

[Yeshua1]

dhk



The truth is nonesense to those who are perishing. Now I have explained to you what Shall be saved means, and you reject the wisdom of it, you have no cloak now for your sin !

Jesus/paul both were asked"What MUST we do to be saved?"

BOTH answered"believe on him who God sent, belive in jesus as YOUR messiah/lord,and you shall be saved!"

Person was NOT saved, per both of them, until they do one thing God requires!

NOT saved before that act, need to believe in Him!

 

[savedbymercy]

Jesus/paul both were asked"What MUST we do to be saved?"

BOTH answered"believe on him who God sent, belive in jesus as YOUR messiah/lord,and you shall be saved!"

Person was NOT saved, per both of them, until they do one thing God requires!

NOT saved before that act, need to believe in Him!

You believe nothing like Paul or Jesus Christ, you deny the Cross of Christ as the only basis of Salvation, and promote Salvation by works, by what a man does !

See post 32 !

 

[The Biblicist]

You believe nothing like Paul or Jesus Christ, you deny the Cross of Christ as the only basis of Salvation, and promote Salvation by works, by what a man does !

See post 32 !

You blaspheme the scripture, distort the nature of God, reject the TRIUNE eternal covenant of salvation and then pretend you are God by judging others and you think you have any grounds to condemn others?????? What a joke! What you teach is neither Biblical, rational or true.

 

[savedbymercy]

You blaspheme the scripture, distort the nature of God, reject the TRIUNE eternal covenant of salvation and then pretend you are God by judging others and you think you have any grounds to condemn others?????? What a joke! What you teach is neither Biblical, rational or true.

You promote false doctrine, deny the saving death of Christ alone ! Jn 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Do you know who Jesus is alluding to as the corn of wheat ? Do you know what He is alluding to when He says " If it die" ?

Do you know what He means , as a result of it dying, it brings forth much fruit ! What is the Fruit here ?

 

[Yeshua1]

You promote false doctrine, deny the saving death of Christ alone ! Jn 12:24

Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.

Do you know who Jesus is alluding to as the corn of wheat ? Do you know what He is alluding to when He says " If it die" ?

Do you know what He means , as a result of it dying, it brings forth much fruit ! What is the Fruit here ?

What does God require of us in order to have Him apply effectually the atoneing grace of the Cross towards us?

Belief/faith in the name of His only Son, the name by which we MUST be saved!

IF you do not place faith in jesus, God Himself cannot and will not save you!

 

[savedbymercy]

What does God require of us in order to have Him apply effectually the atoneing grace of the Cross towards us?

Belief/faith in the name of His only Son, the name by which we MUST be saved!

IF you do not place faith in jesus, God Himself cannot and will not save you!

You deny that Christ's Death bears Fruit ! Work Salvation !