What verses say that faith is a gift that God gives man?

[George Antonios]

I've already shown your error on this verse. It does not say every man. It says the world. World is referring to both Jews and Gentiles and not Jews in this context.

This does not prove your claim either. This does not say Christ paid for their sin. Rather, these people had claimed they were saved, and therefore their sins had been paid for, yet their apostasy shows that was never the case.

Both interpretations are external to elements in the verse. But fine.

 

[Reformed1689]

Both interpretations are external to elements in the verse. But fine.

What does that even mean???

 

[George Antonios]

You can't refuse a payment if the payment is not being made to you.

Precisely!

 

[Reformed1689]

Precisely!

So you agree with me now? My point is, if the sins are all paid for, which they are not, the payment is not being made to the sinner so the sinner cannot refuse the payment.

 

[George Antonios]

What does that even mean???

You redefined world.
Then your interpretation claims that they claimed they were bought. But the verse simply stated a fact.
You are forcing things into the verses.

 

[George Antonios]

So you agree with me now? My point is, if the sins are all paid for, which they are not, the payment is not being made to the sinner so the sinner cannot refuse the payment.

My point is that men are said to reject (John 12:48) therefore the payment was made for rejecters.

 

[Reformed1689]

You redefined world.

No, actually I didn't. Context matters.

Then your interpretation claims that they claimed they were bought. But the verse simply stated a fact.
You are forcing things into the verses.

You have to look at the whole of Scripture. It goes AGAINST Scripture to say they were bought when they were not. Can you lose your salvation? No. Therefore they were not bought.

 

[Reformed1689]

My point is that men are said to reject (John 12:48) therefore the payment was made for rejecters.

That verse does not say payment was made for their sin.

 

[George Antonios]

No, actually I didn't. Context matters.


You have to look at the whole of Scripture. It goes AGAINST Scripture to say they were bought when they were not. Can you lose your salvation? No. Therefore they were not bought.

If that's the only answer, I rest my case.

 

[Reformed1689]

If that's the only answer, I rest my case.

You haven't even made a case.

 

[George Antonios]

You haven't even made a case.

Ok

 

[Reformed1689]

Ok

Look at it this way, you say I redefined world right?

The World Series is coming up and during the playoff game tonight the announcer says, "The eyes of the whole world are watching this moment right now." Does that mean that literally every person on earth is watching the playoff game?

 

[InTheLight]

Ah...so some of Christ's sacrifice is wasted you say? Some of the blood was wasted?

#4

 

[Reformed1689]

#4

Nope not a number 4, I asked a question. Therefore I am not telling him what he believes but asking a question.

 

[InTheLight]

It depends what you mean when you say all men, but yes, agreed.

#1

By the way people try to use that verse to say it is for every person.

#3

 

[Reformed1689]

#1




#3

You are like an annoying gnat sometimes. I love you but good grief.

 

[InTheLight]

Nope not a number 4, I asked a question. Therefore I am not telling him what he believes but asking a question.

You wrote:
"Some of Christ's sacrifice is wasted, YOU SAY?"

No, he doesn't say that. You are putting words in his mouth. You are creating a strawman.

So far we've had argument #1, #3 and #4 applied to 1 John 2:2. The verse must really give Calvinists fits!

 

[InTheLight]

You are like an annoying gnat sometimes. I love you but good grief.

Hey, my shorthand saves me a lot of typing.

Love you to, my brother in Jesus.

 

[Reformed1689]

You wrote:
"Some of Christ's sacrifice is wasted, YOU SAY?"

Again, note the wonderful question mark at the end.

No, he doesn't say that. You are putting words in his mouth. You are creating a strawman.

Nope, asked a question.

So far we've had argument #1, #3 and #4 applied to 1 John 2:2. The verse must really give Calvinists fits!

Nope doesn't give us fits at all. We actually read it in context.

 

[George Antonios]

You are like an annoying gnat sometimes. I love you but good grief.

lol

 

[InTheLight]

Again, note the wonderful question mark at the end.


Nope, asked a question.


Nope doesn't give us fits at all. We actually read it in context.

#2.

C'mon, you can run the table with a #5 and a #6. <Waiting>