Where did evil come from?

[Major B]

Originally posted by littlewhitedove:
God created it all--everything.
If evil was not created by God,
then something else out there is capable of creating. And that scary.

Evil is not a thing, object, person, nor force that can be created. Evil is a state of deliberate negative reaction to good, because of the choices of thinking creatures (angels and men). God did not create evil because evil is not a created thing

 

[Marcia]

Posted by Jacob Webber:

The link you left would not work for me. But something I do not understand why couldn't the angels have done that all angels or Sons of God are Males and are able to take on human form as they did with Abraham, Lot and Mary and others.

Sorry, Jacob, that the link didn't work. Here it is again:
http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/hebrewstudies/507.html

Try copying that and pasting it into the URL. If that doesn't work, go to Google, type in "Enoch rejected canon" and it's the 7th link down, or look for the same URL as above. Then click on it.

There is no indication in scripture that fallen angels can take on human form. Only good angels did that. In fact, since man is made in the image of God, it makes sense that fallen angels would not be allowed to take on human form.

And since Christ said angels did not marry and the book of Enoch says they can, that's a contradiction.

 

[Craigbythesea]

It's interesting to see how many occult and metaphysical groups appeal to the book of Enoch.

Tens of thousands of books have been written by occult and metaphysical groups and individuals who appealed to the Bible. According to your logic, we should therefore burn our Bibles as being the source of occult and metaphysical teachings!

The article that you posted from the Internet was obviously not written by a scholar of the Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, but by some quack. If you want a scholar’s opinion, I suggest you consult the Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament by R. H. Charles, D.Litt., D.D., Fellow of Merton College, Oxford; Fellow of the British Academy. Volume II of this work, all 871 pages of it, is devoted to the Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament. In this volume you will learn that R. H. Charles wrote concerning the Book of Enoch, “The citations of Enoch by the Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs and by the Book of Jubilees shows that at the close of the second century B.C., and during the first century B.C., this book was regarded in certain circles as inspired. When we come down to the first century A.D., we find that it is recognized as Scripture by Jude.” It is also quoted as Scripture in the Epistle of Barnabas xvi. 5, and is quoted as Scripture by Athenagoras, Clement of Alexandria, Irenaeus, Tertullian, and Zosimus of Panopolis.

R. H. Charles also provides information concerning the 29 ancient manuscripts of the Book of Enoch with which he was familiar.

 

[Jacob Webber]

(There is no indication in scripture that fallen angels can take on human form. Only good angels did that. In fact, since man is made in the image of God, it makes sense that fallen angels would not be allowed to take on human form.)

Well we know Fallen Angels can take forms Satan in the gardern of eden. The fact still remains that it is possible for an angel to take human form. And when Jesus spoke of the angels an marriage wasn't He talking about Heaven, cause all of this was suppose to happen on Earth. Plus Christ may be refering to those Angels that were allowed to remain in Heaven instead of fallen. In Job thou we know Satan can go back to Heaven and talk with God.

 

[Marcia]

Posted by Craigbythesea:
Tens of thousands of books have been written by occult and metaphysical groups and individuals who appealed to the Bible. According to your logic, we should therefore burn our Bibles as being the source of occult and metaphysical teachings!

I wasn't saying that; I was just making an observation about the book of Enoch.

Thanks for the resource on Enoch.

I don't think quoting something means someone regards it as scripture. How does Jude consider Enoch scripture?

Also, many books not in the canon were quoted by early church fathers - that does not make them scripture.

Does Enoch teach that angels can marry or not?

Posted by Jacob:
Well we know Fallen Angels can take forms Satan in the gardern of eden. The fact still remains that it is possible for an angel to take human form. And when Jesus spoke of the angels an marriage wasn't He talking about Heaven, cause all of this was suppose to happen on Earth. Plus Christ may be refering to those Angels that were allowed to remain in Heaven instead of fallen. In Job thou we know Satan can go back to Heaven and talk with God.

Jacob, how do we know fallen angels take human form in the Garden? Remember, I said fallen angels nowhere in the Bible are shown to take human form -- not just form. I assume you are talking about Satan in the form of a serpent; that's not a human form. Also, the fact that Satan can talk with God does not prove he can be in human form.

As far as angels marrying, how can a spirit being have relations with a human? It's beyond reason and logic. If Jesus says angels in heaven cannot marry, we cannot assume fallen angels can, especially since there is not a shred of evidence they can or that they can take on human form. A belief like that needs a lot more evidence than mere supposition.

 

[Jacob Webber]

Marcia
I did not say Fallen Angels can take human form. I stated that it is fact that angels have taken human form. we know for fact that angels have taken human form it is biblical Abrham and Lot are two who witnessed it. So there is evidence that angels maybe even fallen angels can take form. Also Joshia I think had a convo with an angel. The statement about Satan is to show that a Fallen Angel did take a form thou it was not Human. My personal opnion is that Satan would never take on Human form as he seems to hate us and would most likely despise being in Human form. My guess is that he took the serpent because it was considered bodiful and wise.

 

[Marcia]

If Satan does not take on human form, then it is good to assume no fallen angel takes on human form. Since the Bible does not have a single clear instance of fallen angels taking on human form, then we should not assume they can do it. Personally, I do not think God would allow it as it would be a mar to the image of God in man.

But thanks for clarifying your remarks, Jacob.

 

[Jacob Webber]

God allows many things to prove His creation. We know thru the Bible that Angels have taken Human form so the possiblity is there for the Fallen Angels to take Human form. We know God allows things to happen for reasons unknown to us maybe to teach us that such an alliace between man and fallen angels will only bring about destruction. It seems that Noah and His family were spared because God knew that some of Noah's desedants would follow Him so for the few He saved all 8 people.

we have proof of the Following:

Angels can take on Human form and others

Angels are reffered to as the Sons of God.

Jesus said we would be like the angels

Matt 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.

So the Angels in heaven did not marry or have sex. This may not apply to the Fallen Angels on Earth. who knows?

 

[Marcia]

Well, Jacob, we could speculate all day, but the evidence is that only good angels have taken on human form and I'm going with that. I am not much one to speculate on things with no evidence. It is more reasonable to conclude that since angels in heaven do not marry that God would not allow evil angels to take human form and impregnate human women. This is very myth-like to me and reminds me of Greek and Roman beliefs about gods coming down to impregnate humans.

Also, when good angels did take human form, it was temporary. What DNA would a fallen angel have? I don't think they have DNA. DNA is a trait of human life. Angels are spirits, as Hebrews clearly tells us. They do not have bodies.

 

[Jacob Webber]

Marcia
I agree we could speculate all day and never find the answers. As far as God allowing it that is up to God.

(What DNA would fallen Angels have) well I would assume corrupt DNA hence the possible thyroid gland problem causing Gaints to be born. As a result of the evil and really corrupt DNA introduced into the Human population God could have desided to wipout the life on Earth except those 8 who were fully Human and obeyed God. But again speculation. No way to prove

 

[amixedupmom]

humm . -butts in a second-

How about evil was created by free will. God gave us all free will wether or not to embrace and love him or to turn our backs on him. He did not want mindless people to love him (he could have) but he didn't . He wanted us to choose it on our own accord. So in a sense. Free will is where evil came from . Lucifer had a choice. He could have not given into his Green Eyes. But, it was his CHOICE to do so and then when he did, to turn his back and not ask for forgiveness. All he had to do was admit that he had been jealous, that he was not almighty, that he was not powerful. Did he? No, thus evil was born ...

Just my two cents

 

[amixedupmom]

woah I killed the topic

go me hehehe

 

[Ben W]

That is o.k, I know that angels can take human form, I have seen it on "Highway to Heaven".

 

[littlewhitedove]

Originally posted by Major B:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by littlewhitedove:
God created it all--everything.
If evil was not created by God,
then something else out there is capable of creating. And that scary.

Evil is not a thing, object, person, nor force that can be created. Evil is a state of deliberate negative reaction to good, because of the choices of thinking creatures (angels and men). God did not create evil because evil is not a created thing </font>[/QUOTE]But I tell you this;
God created wicked man for the day of evil.
If evil is not a thing or force then how is He (God) going to destroy it?

 

[Marcia]

If evil is not a thing or force then how is He (God) going to destroy it?

It says that Jesus came to destroy the work of the devil (1 John 3.8), that the devil and the unredeemed will be in the lake of fire (Rev 20), and that sinful men who trust Christ will be redeemed (throughout NT). Thus, Satan and man's sins (which comprise evil acts) will be banished.

How did God purge evil in the OT? He had the Israelites go in and kill the pagans and tear down idols. He commanded them to abstain from certain acts that God said was sinful. Purging evil always has to do with sin.

 

[Jacob Webber]

But I tell you this;
God created wicked man for the day of evil.
If evil is not a thing or force then how is He (God) going to destroy it?

By changing the Heart. But God will never completly destroy all of those who are evil. He has prepared a place for them and there they will be forever.