Where in the Bible is youth ministry?

[ReformedBaptist]

WHAT??! :BangHead:

I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU JUST....just kidding.

I hope you don't think I was being argumentative, or not calm. :thumbs:

lol I don't know..why such an impassioned reply? Felt the sting of conviction brother? hahaha...

No my brother, you explained your meaning well.

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

First, I will say that I haven't thoroughly read all of the posts in this thread. Just wanted to add a thought that came to me.

What about Samuel and Eli?

We have various outreaches in our church and one of them is our youth ministry. We have a family oriented church and I think the youth ministry is great!

I don't think it is mentioned in the Bible, as such, but there are at least three instances of ministering to the youth that come to mind off the top of my head.

Plus, a youth ministry gives the kids places to go with other Christian kids and solid adult Christian chaperones.

 

[David Lamb]

First, I will say that I haven't thoroughly read all of the posts in this thread. Just wanted to add a thought that came to me.

What about Samuel and Eli?

We have various outreaches in our church and one of them is our youth ministry. We have a family oriented church and I think the youth ministry is great!

I don't think it is mentioned in the Bible, as such, but there are at least three instances of ministering to the youth that come to mind off the top of my head.

Plus, a youth ministry gives the kids places to go with other Christian kids and solid adult Christian chaperones.

Are we not confusing two things in this thread? Surely no one is saying that we should not reach out to young people with the glorious gospel, or that it is wrong for a church to run clubs for children and/or youth where the aim is to introduce them to the gospel, and enable them to enjoy themselves in a safe environment. But that is quite a different matter to the young Christians in a church having a separate pastor called a "Youth Pastor". (The same with a separate pastor for men, or one for women, or one for senior citizens ).

 

[just-want-peace]

Mar 9:40 For he that is not against us is for us.

Herein lies the answer. Which catagory fits any given "youth group"??

 

[rbell]

Allan,

I just normally think regulative principle. Glad to see someone can offer a calm reply. lol

Wait a minute.

You think "youth ministry" should go away, because it's not mentioned in Scripture.

Then, you justify it by invoking the "regulative principle"---also not mentioned in Scripture.

Inconsistencies, anyone?

 

[rbell]

*sigh*


Maybe if a person is a pastor, yet their focus is on the younger generation and their parents....is that a bad thing?

The hundreds of students we encounter whose parents offer no spiritual guidance...what about them?

Also....shouldn't a youth minister also strive to minister to the families of students?

Why the sigh? If the topic was a burdon to you, why did you reply?

I noticed you completely ignored my points.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Plus, a youth ministry gives the kids places to go with other Christian kids and solid adult Christian chaperones.

Not every youth ministry functions that way. Out of the 25-30 kids who come to ours only 6-8 are saved. Our kids actually mix with the lost at youth activities.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

I noticed you completely ignored my points.

Why shouldn't I? I am not trying to win an argument with you. I raised a subject for discussion, and your reply begins with a sigh.

Imagine how that would play out in real life. Let's say I walk into a pastor's office and raise this question or another. He then looks up from his study and let's out a big sigh. It communicates that I am bothering him, my question is stupid, et. et. It can mean a multitude of things.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Wait a minute.

You think "youth ministry" should go away, because it's not mentioned in Scripture.

Then, you justify it by invoking the "regulative principle"---also not mentioned in Scripture.

Inconsistencies, anyone?

What is your intention rbell? Are you tying to help me understand the Scriptures better? Point me in a more correct way? Consider my OP

Is then youth ministry strange fire on the altar of God? Does it do more harm than good in ministering to the family of God?

Those are questions. Now, I lean toward the idea that youth ministry is not needed in a NT Church. My friend, you rush to many conclusions and judgement about me that are not true. I have done that too, and still do it at times.

 

[dan e.]

Now, I lean toward the idea that youth ministry is not needed in a NT Church.

But if your basis is soley because you don't see a youth ministry in the Bible, then there would be a lot of things we wouldn't do today.

I don't think that is how Scripture should be used, or interpreted. It isn't a list of things we must do, and things we should assume to avoid just because it isn't mentioned.

 

[Pastor Larry]

The answer to the OP is found in the command to make disciples. Youth ministry is to be about making disciples, and therefore, a youth ministry that makes disciples is justified, and one that does not is not justified.

Most churches, even those who follow the RP, recognize that certain people are gifted in certain ways and employ them as such in the church.

The idea that fathers are responsible for their children's spiritual teaching is a false dichotomy.

First, we recognize that the church is the place of spiritual teaching in the NT as well as the home and the father should be regularly and consistently subjecting his children to the teaching of the senior pastor. Therefore, one cannot object in principle to having someone other than the father teach the children. To make such an objection would be ludicrous given the teaching of the NT.

Second, the youth ministry should be viewed as a supplement to the home, not a replacement for it.

So in the end, a youth pastor functions just as any other pastor--He is to make disciples of the people entrusted to his ministry.

 

[CubeX]

It's long... agian

First of all, although I already posted about the "youth minister", I will now touch on my personal experience with youth ministry because I apparently misread the topic although what I posted is helpful I believe.

From my experience from being in and leading youth groups (the largest one was 300 mid and high school students at EBC, Jackson, TN), I have noticed that - like others have mentioned - the modern youth ministry tends to lean towards a social gathering where teens can have fun and then, because they came and got to have fun, they then "have" to listen to a sermon or other presentation. By "have" I mean that they feel obligated to out of principle and this is the way a lot of youth ministers have set up youth groups.

The whole concept of modern youth groups comes from the thought process of the whole institutional church - unbelievers should come to one of the church's meetings and they will perhaps be convicted. Although Paul does write about the church, as a whole, conducting herself in a way that those who visit might be convicted - ie. 1 Cor - prophecy so that unbelievers might be brought under conviction.

However, the modern church is far from the first century church on this among many other issues. The gathering of the church was so each member could edify one another. It's central focus was not to evangelize, it was not to convict sinners - it was to build up the church. By build, this doesn't mean by numbers, it means by spiritual quality although numbers are not "wrong" in that sense.

The reason the modern church preaches and teaches and sings as it does today lays in the history of the last 3 centuries. The focus of the church went from the church corporately to the individual. It was with the Frontier-Revivalists that the church changed the focus of preaching to only one aim: to convert lost souls. George Whitefield planted this seed in his thinking in the 18th century and other things that I don't have room to speak on (such as the alter call, etc.) came from others like Charles Finney. Baptists are probably best known for this emphasis.

Please note that I'm not saying reaching the lost is wrong - that would be a bold-face lie to say! However, I am saying all of this to get to a certain point - the youth ministry is just a miniature version of "big church" as I'm sure a lot of us called it when we were young. If you question youth ministry, you better be ready to give answer for as to why the "big church" does everything it does. A lot of it doesn't have Scriptural backing although we try to read it back into the Bible. One can easily find a can of worms to open if one wishes...

Since the institutional church has a certain set way of doing things, such as youth ministry and regular ministry, we should probably ask this ourselves the following -
1) Is it helping believers reach the lost? and
2) Is it helping all believers including the new ones grow spiritually?

My answer to those is 1) Yes, it seems to - just not as effectively as one might wish. And 2) Not really, I have only seen kids come and have a good time but they don't seem to have any experience in Jesus Christ when they come because the focus isn't Christ - it's using fun as a trojan horse to convert the lost and that's the end of the line.

There are youth who grow up strong in the Lord, but out of that 300 I helped lead for a year, I could probably only count around 25 who even seemed to be believers. The rest acted just like the world and didn't change even after they claimed to be saved. I even caught one of them stealing at the place I worked AFTER they claimed that they had believed on Christ.

- Dave

 

[CubeX]

It's long... agian

[EDIT] It double-posted...

 

[ReformedBaptist]

But if your basis is soley because you don't see a youth ministry in the Bible, then there would be a lot of things we wouldn't do today.

I don't think that is how Scripture should be used, or interpreted. It isn't a list of things we must do, and things we should assume to avoid just because it isn't mentioned.

Which is why I think the subject of normative vs. regulative principles of worship arose..

 

[rbell]

What is your intention rbell? Are you tying to help me understand the Scriptures better? Point me in a more correct way? Consider my OP



Those are questions. Now, I lean toward the idea that youth ministry is not needed in a NT Church. My friend, you rush to many conclusions and judgement about me that are not true. I have done that too, and still do it at times.

My "intentions" were to show you that you call "youth ministry" a non-biblical concept...your reasoning: "It's not mentioned in the Bible." Then, you invoke a phrase that is also not mentioned in the Bible. That's an inconsistency...and I just wanted to point it out.

Those are questions. Now, I lean toward the idea that youth ministry is not needed in a NT Church. My friend, you rush to many conclusions and judgement about me that are not true. I have done that too, and still do it at times.

So very interesting you would say that....since I don't see any post in which I've made untrue conclusions or judgements about you. Perhaps if you wish to accuse me of such, you could show examples.

Why are you so defensive?

 

[rbell]

Gotta run, but I will ask this:

God called me to work with junior high and high school students and their families. As sure as I sit here, that's my calling. Confirmed over and over. Fruit-bearing ministry. Kids are growing and serving...here and all around the world.


ReformedBaptist.......is my calling a mistake? Yes or no.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

The answer to the OP is found in the command to make disciples. Youth ministry is to be about making disciples, and therefore, a youth ministry that makes disciples is justified, and one that does not is not justified.

Most churches, even those who follow the RP, recognize that certain people are gifted in certain ways and employ them as such in the church.

The idea that fathers are responsible for their children's spiritual teaching is a false dichotomy.

First, we recognize that the church is the place of spiritual teaching in the NT as well as the home and the father should be regularly and consistently subjecting his children to the teaching of the senior pastor. Therefore, one cannot object in principle to having someone other than the father teach the children. To make such an objection would be ludicrous given the teaching of the NT.

Second, the youth ministry should be viewed as a supplement to the home, not a replacement for it.

So in the end, a youth pastor functions just as any other pastor--He is to make disciples of the people entrusted to his ministry.

Perhaps I was misunderstood. I never meant to give the impression that a father's teaching is to the exclusion a an elders teaching. Both are valid. I will say to you that any elder in my church as it regards my children and wife is subject to me as the head of my house. (and, as an ad-on, I am subject to the elders of the church) No elder is the over my wife to the exclusion of me.

And so it is with my children. And we all are under the Scripture. My conscience is free in regard to the Word of God.

The idea that fathers are responsible for their children's spiritual teaching is a false dichotomy.

Now, I am really trying to understand this in context. Fathers ARE responibile, primarily, for their children's spiritual teaching, but not to the exclusion of the ministry of the body of Christ. Mothers are responsible for their children's spiritual teaching. While I may have no shepherding authority in the congregation, I most certainly do in my home. I am to teach, lead, guide, correct, rebuke and instruct my house.

I will disagree with you that a youth ministry is good for a supplement to the home. If fathers and mothers were doing their jobs as Christian parents in their home, any supplement would be completely irrelavent.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Gotta run, but I will ask this:

God called me to work with junior high and high school students and their families. As sure as I sit here, that's my calling. Confirmed over and over. Fruit-bearing ministry. Kids are growing and serving...here and all around the world.


ReformedBaptist.......is my calling a mistake? Yes or no.

Your inviting me to make a personal judgment about you and your "calling" and I am not willing to do so at this time. My best answer to you my friend is not to ask whether what you do is consistent with how you feel (your calling) or what others have said, or the fruit you percieve in the work you have done.

But the question is whether or not what you believe is your calling, what others are saying, et. are biblical. Does it conform to the Word of God or not. And knowing so little about you I wouldn't even presume to answer that for you.

 

[dan e.]

I will disagree with you that a youth ministry is good for a supplement to the home. If fathers and mothers were doing their jobs as Christian parents in their home, any supplement would be completely irrelavent.

Now this is just starting to sound like preference.

You wish parents were better at spiritual guiding so there wouldn't be any excuse for a youth pastor in a church. Although I'd still say that youth pastors would be needed even if parents were perfect in their parenting.

You prefer no youth pastor....but just because you don't prefer one doesn't mean it isn't a biblical method of the great commission.

 

[Pastor Larry]

I never meant to give the impression that a father's teaching is to the exclusion a an elders teaching. Both are valid.

Then what is your problem with a youth pastor?

I will disagree with you that a youth ministry is good for a supplement to the home. If fathers and mothers were doing their jobs as Christian parents in their home, any supplement would be completely irrelavent.

How so? Using your argument, if fathers and mothers were doing their jobs as Christian parents, any supplement by the senior pastor on Sunday moorning would be irrelevant. You see, you can't make that dichotomy stand up. The Bible commands the that local church be the repository for the truth and be constantly teaching and discipling people. In that context, youth ministry is completely warranted as a teaching and discipling function of the local church.