Who is Rick Warren, really?

[webdog]

I all seriousness dog, you should not even reply to my post if your not willing to watch the video which is the centerpiece of the OP. I had to go through 40 days of Purpose twice, so you should at least watch a 2 hour video to see if it is true..which I believe it is.

Like I said, if the rest is like the beginning, I'll pass. When you start with false presuppositions continued fallacies ensue.

You "had" to go through PDL...and twice!? Was someone holding you hostage for 80 days?!

Thanks for changing the avatar, btw. Satan's smiling Ken doll was hard to stomach.

 

[quantumfaith]

In all this discussion, I have not seen a single fact posted related to Saddleback or Rick Warren, not from any credible source.

Some Christians on this board appear to be unable to wrap their mind around the fact that someone can lead people to the Lord and build a church in a different way than the old timer, hard liners in their own group did it. And they don't even realize that their way is as much of a human invention as what they are criticizing.

:applause::applause::applause:

 

[SolaSaint]

Like I said, if the rest is like the beginning, I'll pass. When you start with false presuppositions continued fallacies ensue.

You "had" to go through PDL...and twice!? Was someone holding you hostage for 80 days?!

Thanks for changing the avatar, btw. Satan's smiling Ken doll was hard to stomach.

Can you enlighten us on the false presupposition?

 

[Alive in Christ]

Who has 2 hours of free time to watch an internet video? Could someone please summarize the highlights of the video or better yet point us to a printed version of the same material?

Hmmm

excuses, excuses.

Just about everyone on our side of this has been able to watch the video. We have jobs and responsibilities. We can squeez it in. But those on the other side...darn the luck...dont have time.

Interesting

 

[Van]

As you can see from the summary, I not only watched the video, I took notes.

Summary of thread:

Video presented which made several charges against Pastor Rick Warren

Charges were refuted by multiple people.

Thread deteriorated.

Lets consider the charges:

1) The purpose driven life omits the gospel. Rebuttal, the five purposes of God for our lives is a revamped presentation of the Gospel.

2) Pastor Warren's message is not convicting. Rebuttal, many more lives are being changed in many churches because of the use of revamped outreach efforts.

3) Pastor Rick does not preach repentance. Rebuttal, Biblical repentance based on careful study of scripture is preached by Pastor Rick.

4) Rick Warren points out salvation is not based on works such as sufficient doctrinal knowledge, and therefore rejects the old "stop smoking and memorize the Roman Road, then give yourself to Christ" heresy. No rebuttal necessary, see Matthew 7. Jesus does not ask if we are pre-trib.

5) Pastor Warren has destroyed the Evangelical Movement. Rebuttal, Rick has opened a new avenue to reach the world.

Note I did not address the vast amount of "guilt by association" arguments. Jesus said we are love our enemies and pray for them. Ring a bell?
It does not adorn the gospel to present xenophobic hate mongering twaddle.

 

[InTheLight]

Hmmm

excuses, excuses.

Just about everyone on our side of this has been able to watch the video. We have jobs and responsibilities. We can squeez it in. But those on the other side...darn the luck...dont have time.

Interesting

The last time I sat down and watched more than one-half hour of video at one time in any format was when I went to see the new James Bond movie, Skyfall, two weeks ago. I DO NOT have the time to slog through a 2 hour internet video. It's gotten to the point where if someone wants me to watch an online video that is longer than 5 minutes I don't do it. I literally don't have that sort of free time. Don't make assumptions about things you don't know about.

Furthermore, I can read much, much faster than I can watch a video. I bet I could read the transcript of the video in 1/2 the time it takes to watch it.

What is wrong with making a written summary of the video contents?

 

[Van]

Recently we had a thread concerning playing the Pharisee Card. In the Video, the case was made that Rick Warren associates and fellowships with reprobates and evil doers. I have a memory of another guy who met with publicans, tax collectors and all sorts of the worse kind of sinners. Something in the back of my memory sticks, something about not coming to the righteous, but to sinners. The Pharisees were very upset, even jealous.

 

[annsni]

The last time I sat down and watched more than one-half hour of video at one time in any format was when I went to see the new James Bond movie, Skyfall, two weeks ago. I DO NOT have the time to slog through a 2 hour internet video. It's gotten to the point where if someone wants me to watch an online video that is longer than 5 minutes I don't do it. I literally don't have that sort of free time. Don't make assumptions about things you don't know about.

Furthermore, I can read much, much faster than I can watch a video. I bet I could read the transcript of the video in 1/2 the time it takes to watch it.

What is wrong with making a written summary of the video contents?

I MIGHT spend a half hour watching a video that is edifying and one in which I'll grow as a believer - or an instructional video on how to get my horse to bend better at the travers but otherwise, I've got too much to do. My time on the computer is literally in spurts - a few minutes here, a few minutes there. I'm not spending 2 hours of my time to watch something that I see already has issues 5 minutes in. All it will do is tick me off. I hate when people misrepresent others.

 

[webdog]

Can you enlighten us on the false presupposition?

Already been touched on in this thread. False gospel, ministry with pagans, etc. The clown from GTY is plenty...can't believe someone like MacArthur would employ him, or if he agrees, I've lost a ton of respect for Johnny Mac.

 

[annsni]

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. ~John 3:16

What does this verse say that we must to to have eternal life?

If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way? ~Acts 11:17

What did they do to get the gift here?

And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” ~Acts 16:31

This was the answer to "What must I do to be saved?"

if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. ~Romans 10:9

Pretty clear - believe, receive. There are MANY other verses in Scripture that say this. So then, why does the video get all uptight that Warren teaches this just as Scripture says?

That was enough for me to say that it was not worth my time.

 

[SolaSaint]

Already been touched on in this thread. False gospel, ministry with pagans, etc. The clown from GTY is plenty...can't believe someone like MacArthur would employ him, or if he agrees, I've lost a ton of respect for Johnny Mac.

WOW!! dog..

You scold me and say I'm demonizing Warren when I have not done anything of the sort. All I do is present a video and ask a question. Now you come along and discredit this video after watching 5 min. then you call a brother in Christ a clown.

If Warren has enriched your walk with Christ I think that is wonderful. I truly believe he does do some good to a lot of people. I do believe he is misguided in presenting the gospel and not vey discerning with whom he associates. I think it is OK to question this about him and present facts about what he has done in the past. This is to better know who you are following. If it wasn't for apolgetic ministries many would blindly follow false teachers (not saying Warren is one)..but I think he is flurting...

Remember calling people names is resorting to discrediting your opponent when the facts are not on your side, we saw this in the last election.

 

[Alive in Christ]

Sola...

WOW!! dog..

You scold me and say I'm demonizing Warren when I have not done anything of the sort. All I do is present a video and ask a question. Now you come along and discredit this video after watching 5 min. then you call a brother in Christ a clown.

All I do is present a video and ask a question

Its rather sad, isnt it?

This, plus the excuse that they dont...darn the luck...have the time to watch the video, suggest that a bunch of people are in full blown denial regarding RW and his agenda.

 

[InTheLight]

Its rather sad, isnt it?

This, plus the excuse that they dont...darn the luck...have the time to watch the video, suggest that a bunch of people are in full blown denial regarding RW and his agenda.

I don't know what RW is about or his agenda. About the only thing I know is that he pastors a megachurch, has written a couple of books, hosted a Q&A with Obama and McCain in 2008, and gave a prayer at Obama's inaugural. I've begged for someone to post info about their objections to him in written form, but I guess they don't have the time to do that.

 

[Mexdeaf]

Seriously, threads like this must make God want to make a whale puke someplace. I mean if people have to make (and watch) two-hour long videos full of lies and innuendo to supposedly protect the "truth" we have bigger problems than Obama.

Just saying.

 

[Alive in Christ]

Mexdef

I mean if people have to make (and watch) two-hour long videos full of lies and innuendo...

The more acurate statement....

two-hour long videos full of truth and evidence, regarding Rick Warenn and his agenda

................

 

[annsni]

Mexdef



The more acurate statement....






................

Not once you get past the first 3 minutes. At least they got the very beginning bio on him right.

 

[webdog]

Sola...



Its rather sad, isnt it?

This, plus the excuse that they dont...darn the luck...have the time to watch the video, suggest that a bunch of people are in full blown denial regarding RW and his agenda.

oh, I have the time... I just refuse to watch a 2 hour lie-fest. Funny you all have no problem watching false witness bearing...yet cannot summarize truthfully IN YOUR OWN SUMMARY his faults.

 

[SolaSaint]

You want a summary:

Rick Warren wants to reach the unchurched so he sends out surveys to the unchurched only and asks them what they want in a church. He gets replies of casual wear, flip flops, shorts, heavy metal music or Hip Hop, Starbucks and a cookie in the pews, rid the sanctuary of anything offensive like crosses and hymnals, don't talk about my sin and how it offends God. Then once you have them in your church, preach to them easy messages that use various translations to fit your non offensive message because you promised them what they want and you don't want to scare them away now. I've seen him use 2 translations in one verse, the Message and NIV I believe, so he can twist scripture. Demonize anything fundamental and even make fun of it in your seminars to other church leaders. Tell other churches that are inticed by your program to tell their leaders to get on board or leave. Warren even
tells how to get rid of dissenters. This is just a short summary, I could go on.

 

[webdog]

You want a summary:

Rick Warren wants to reach the unchurched so he sends out surveys to the unchurched only and asks them what they want in a church. He gets replies of casual wear, flip flops, shorts, heavy metal music or Hip Hop, Starbucks and a cookie in the pews, rid the sanctuary of anything offensive like crosses and hymnals, don't talk about my sin and how it offends God. Then once you have them in your church, preach to them easy messages that use various translations to fit your non offensive message because you promised them what they want and you don't want to scare them away now. I've seen him use 2 translations in one verse, the Message and NIV I believe, so he can twist scripture. Demonize anything fundamental and even make fun of it in your seminars to other church leaders. Tell other churches that are inticed by your program to tell their leaders to get on board or leave. Warren even
tells how to get rid of dissenters. This is just a short summary, I could go on.

...and you prove my point on this video, heavy on slander and untruthfulness...light on actual facts supporting this.

 

[InTheLight]

You want a summary:

Rick Warren wants to reach the unchurched so he sends out surveys to the unchurched only and asks them what they want in a church. He gets replies of casual wear, flip flops, shorts, heavy metal music or Hip Hop, Starbucks and a cookie in the pews, rid the sanctuary of anything offensive like crosses and hymnals, don't talk about my sin and how it offends God. Then once you have them in your church, preach to them easy messages that use various translations to fit your non offensive message because you promised them what they want and you don't want to scare them away now. I've seen him use 2 translations in one verse, the Message and NIV I believe, so he can twist scripture. Demonize anything fundamental and even make fun of it in your seminars to other church leaders. Tell other churches that are inticed by your program to tell their leaders to get on board or leave. Warren even
tells how to get rid of dissenters. This is just a short summary, I could go on.

OK, he uses marketing methods to tailor the message to the unchurched community. He uses modern translations. His preaching is non-judgmental and light on doctrine. He thinks the traditional methods of building a church are out-dated.

You're doing great, keep going. Of particular interest to me would be how he "twists scripture." Can you give examples?