Why Are Sinners Told to “Seek the Lord”?

[SavedByGrace]

Acts 13:48. "As many as were ordained to eternal life believed." John 6:37. John 6:39. "All those the Father gives to me". There are a lot of verses. But the best argument would be that obviously, not everyone gets saved and God is powerful enough to do so. Unless man is actually the supreme final authority in all this.

By the way, you have a habit of taking a quote and then changing it to suit your preconceived opinion. I said there are verses that say God did not choose to save everyone. You turned it around and said God doesn't WANT to save everyone. There is a difference which you could understand if you would read some Calvinist theology that is not of the "hyper" variety. But you won't because it's easier to just spew something over and over again.

firstly, the Greek paticiple τεταγμένοι, used here, in its context use, is in the middle and not passive voice.

In verse 46 it is clear from what we read, that it is the Jews who reject the Gospel, and consider themselves unworthy of eternal life. Not God. This means that the "action" is of "themselves", which is middle voice. This is exactly the same in verse 48, where the Gentiles heard the same Message, instead of rejecting it, as the Jews did, "they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord", and thereby had "ordered themselves", but accepting and believing the Gospel. There is no "ordained" in the meaning of τεταγμένοι, which has been added for theology!

Secondly, there is not a single verse in the 66 Books of the Bible, that says the Lord does not want to save the entire human race. In fact, Jesus' own words in Luke is clear that He also Died for Judas! Jesus Christ Shed His Blood for Judas

 

[Reformed1689]

Secondly, there is not a single verse in the 66 Books of the Bible, that says the Lord does not want to save the entire human race. In fact, Jesus' own words in Luke is clear that He also Died for Judas! Jesus Christ Shed His Blood for Judas

Vessels of wrath prepared for destruction is definitely in the Bible.

 

[tyndale1946]

Acts 13:48. "As many as were ordained to eternal life believed." John 6:37. John 6:39. "All those the Father gives to me". There are a lot of verses. But the best argument would be that obviously, not everyone gets saved and God is powerful enough to do so. Unless man is actually the supreme final authority in all this.

By the way, you have a habit of taking a quote and then changing it to suit your preconceived opinion. I said there are verses that say God did not choose to save everyone. You turned it around and said God doesn't WANT to save everyone. There is a difference which you could understand if you would read some Calvinist theology that is not of the "hyper" variety. But you won't because it's easier to just spew something over and over again.

If you can convince me that the following sought the Lord I will eat my Bible... In Matthew 25 when the Lord separates the sheep from the goats, the righteous, who are called by the Lord such and sheep also are commended by what they do for others... In doing so they show they have done to the Lord also... Shows not only has their heart been changed but also have the Love Of God abiding in them... Somewhere in our lifetime the Lord changes us, we don't change ourselves. although some on here think they birthed themselves... David says in Psalms 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.
That is how we ALL come into the world and unless the Lord intervenes, we leave the same way we came in... In our sins, which is our nature.

Romans 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

You care to address the above SBG?

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

I don't need to tell you about the goats, you know where they are going, and you brethren behave and play nice... Brother Glen

 

[SavedByGrace]

You care to address the above SBG?

then why not address this directly to me?

 

[DaveXR650]

SBG, you started the thread with the proposal that there is no reason for sinners to be told to repent if for many of them it is a predetermined impossibility. I know how threads you are involved in usually end up and my hope was that if you would listen I could point out to you that all Calvinists don't take that approach. You are now left with the position that God is not able to do what he wills, or that man is actually the one that is completely sovereign in his salvation.

 

[SavedByGrace]

If you can convince me that the following sought the Lord I will eat my Bible... In Matthew 25 when the Lord separates the sheep from the goats, the righteous, who are called by the Lord such and sheep also are commended by what they do for others... In doing so they show they have done to the Lord also... Shows not only has their heart been changed but also have the Love Of God abiding in them... Somewhere in our lifetime the Lord changes us, we don't change ourselves. although some on here think they birthed themselves... David says in Psalms 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.
That is how we ALL come into the world and unless the Lord intervenes, we leave the same way we came in... In our sins, which is our nature.

Romans 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

3:12 They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

You care to address the above SBG?

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

I don't need to tell you about the goats, you know where they are going, and you brethren behave and play nice... Brother Glen

how about this?

The Bible Way of Salvation

 

[SavedByGrace]

SBG, you started the thread with the proposal that there is no reason for sinners to be told to repent if for many of them it is a predetermined impossibility. I know how threads you are involved in usually end up and my hope was that if you would listen I could point out to you that all Calvinists don't take that approach. You are now left with the position that God is not able to do what he wills, or that man is actually the one that is completely sovereign in his salvation.

Which Calvinists do not believe that God enables the elect sinners to repent and believe? You?

The OP, if you read it carefully, is clear, that God would not Command the entire human race, which He does, to SEEK Him and Call on Him for their salvation, IF, as reformed theology teaches, they CANNOT, because of God not making this a possibility.

In 1 Thess 4:3, Paul writes, "For this is the will of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality"

Now, this is the WILL of God. IF, us believers do not live morally, and do not live lives that are sanctified, does this mean that God is not able to do what He WILLS, or that He has FAILED? Your reasoning is moot here!

Here is another, Ephesians 2:10, "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them"

It says that God has ORDAINED that we should live a life of good works after salvation. If a Christian does not do so, as there are some, does this mean that God has FAILED?

 

[Duckie]

do you believe that Jesus Christ came into this world to offer salvation to every single human being without exception (not universal salvation); or only for the "elect"?

Everyone.

There are many who have.lived and died and never heard the gospel preached.

I believe it is after a person hears that they are accountable.

That is just my assumption, but if I remember correctly, there is a verse that a person who sins without knowing he is sinning, is not held accountable. Will need to find it.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Everyone.

Indeed. We are in the MINORITY on BB!

 

[DaveXR650]

The OP, if you read it carefully, is clear, that God would not Command the entire human race, which He does, to SEEK Him and Call on Him for their salvation, IF, as reformed theology teaches, they CANNOT, because of God not making this a possibility.

The Free Offer of The Gospel « Sermons « Bible Sermons Online - Bible-Sermons.org.uk

This is discussed by someone other than me in the above link. If you will bother to read it it explains my position very well using scripture, the WCF, and older Calvinist theological writings. You won't find it satisfactory, and it doesn't even try to do anything more than say that some things as humans are hard to understand.

Also, you posted this while I was typing - the link from the Bible Way of Salvation. I have no problem with any of that just the way it is written.

 

[SavedByGrace]

The Free Offer of The Gospel « Sermons « Bible Sermons Online - Bible-Sermons.org.uk

This is discussed by someone other than me in the above link. If you will bother to read it it explains my position very well using scripture, the WCF, and older Calvinist theological writings. You won't find it satisfactory, and it doesn't even try to do anything more than say that some things as humans are hard to understand.

Also, you posted this while I was typing - the link from the Bible Way of Salvation. I have no problem with any of that just the way it is written.

I will comment on one line in this link, "The 'Offer' made is for all who hear it, whether they be elect or not"

This is ABSURD, because reformed/clavinistic theology says, that ONLY the elect can HEAR, the rest are DEAF to the actual Call in the Gospel Message, as it is God Who MAKES the elect HEAR.

The passage quoted is

"And He said, Go, and tell this people, You hear indeed, but do not understand; and seeing you see, but do not know. Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their hearts, and turn back, and be healed" (Isaiah 6:9-10)

 

[DaveXR650]

Everyone.


I believe it is after a person hears that they are accountable.

That is just my assumption, but if I remember correctly, there is a verse that a person who sins without knowing he is sinning, is not held accountable. Will need to find it.

Well, there's Romans 2:12, but that doesn't help much. There are certainly verses showing that unintentional sins are less of a problem in God's eyes. Anyway, looks like you joined recently. Welcome. By the way, a universal atonement is the majority view, maybe not on the BB, but in Christianity in general. I'm afraid even the view of Christ actually having to die for your sins at all is under fire in many circles nowadays.

 

[Reformed1689]

I will comment on one line in this link, "The 'Offer' made is for all who hear it, whether they be elect or not"

This is ABSURD, because reformed/clavinistic theology says, that ONLY the elect can HEAR, the rest are DEAF to the actual Call in the Gospel Message, as it is God Who MAKES the elect HEAR.

The passage quoted is

"And He said, Go, and tell this people, You hear indeed, but do not understand; and seeing you see, but do not know. Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their hearts, and turn back, and be healed" (Isaiah 6:9-10)

So do you deny that not everyone has ears to hear?

 

[SavedByGrace]

Well, there's Romans 2:12, but that doesn't help much. There are certainly verses showing that unintentional sins are less of a problem in God's eyes. Anyway, looks like you joined recently. Welcome. By the way, a universal atonement is the majority view, maybe not on the BB, but in Christianity in general. I'm afraid even the view of Christ actually having to die for your sins at all is under fire in many circles nowadays.

Universal Atonement is not the majority view among Bible believing Christians. Universal Death is

 

[DaveXR650]

This is ABSURD, because reformed/clavinistic theology says, that ONLY the elect can HEAR, the rest are DEAF to the actual Call in the Gospel Message, as it is God Who MAKES the elect HEAR.

The sermon (article) is written by a Calvinist. You show tremendous, needless animosity towards Calvinism. You shut yourself out of much beneficial and rich literature written by Calvinists which can be of great help in your Christian walk. That's your loss.

 

[DaveXR650]

Universal Atonement is not the majority view among Bible believing Christians. Universal Death is

You're gonna scare Duckie off here before she even gets started. She probably already has figured out that we're crazy.

 

[SavedByGrace]

The sermon (article) is written by a Calvinist. You show tremendous, needless animosity towards Calvinism. You shut yourself out of much beneficial and rich literature written by Calvinists which can be of great help in your Christian walk. That's your loss.

Please don't say silly things

Almost all of my books on theology are by Calvinists

bottner, hodge, orr, Machen, dabney, Berkoff. I also have commentaries by Calvin, Jaimeson Fausset and Brown. John Gill, John Trapp. Etc etc

I am not limited or narrow minded

 

[SavedByGrace]

You're gonna scare Duckie off here before she even gets started. She probably already has figured out that we're crazy.

I am sure that the Lord will guide her and keep her safe on BB from the hardliners

 

[Reformed1689]

Universal Atonement is not the majority view among Bible believing Christians. Universal Death is

Wait, are you not advocating for Universal Atonement?

 

[DaveXR650]

Almost all of my books on theology are by Calvinists

Well don't read 'em or you'll blow a gasket.