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Why do people reject the gospel?
- Thread starter John Ellwood Taylor
- Start date
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Then give a valid explanation as to why some accept the Gospel and why some reject the Gospel.
Paul of Eugene
New Member
That is trivially easy when we consider the idea of work in context of being hired and working FOR SOMEONE ELSE. Because the employee is paid for his work WHEN HE IS ON THE CLOCK and is not paid for things he does WHEN HE IS OFF THE CLOCK.
For example, he takes his paycheck to the bank and endorses the paycheck. There is a trivial amount of "work" in the scientific sense when he signs the back of the check.
But suppose he went back to his boss and asked for overtime for that moment when he endorsed the check? The boss would say, don't be silly, YOU WEREN'T WORKING FOR ME when you did that . . . you were OFF THE CLOCK.
So the question comes, when Paul writes "not of works, lest any man should boast", is the "work" of which he speaks more like the work of an employee serving an employer, or simply the more general idea of exerting effort whatever kind?
I submit the case can be made that the work spoken of is work FOR THE EMPLOYER and hence the AGREEMENT TO ACCEPT THE OFFER is not PART OF THAT WORK.
Timtoolman
New Member
Scott, not going to answer your drivel from last post. It is kids stuff. If you have any new questions that I have not answered I will be glad too.
Just because you don't like'em and they don't fit into your manuel of calvnist stramen, does not mean it was not an answer. There is much more going on then you calvnist handbook addresses.
Tim
Just because you don't like'em and they don't fit into your manuel of calvnist stramen, does not mean it was not an answer. There is much more going on then you calvnist handbook addresses.
Tim
Timtoolman
New Member
That is trivially easy when we consider the idea of work in context of being hired and working FOR SOMEONE ELSE. Because the employee is paid for his work WHEN HE IS ON THE CLOCK and is not paid for things he does WHEN HE IS OFF THE CLOCK.
For example, he takes his paycheck to the bank and endorses the paycheck. There is a trivial amount of "work" in the scientific sense when he signs the back of the check.
But suppose he went back to his boss and asked for overtime for that moment when he endorsed the check? The boss would say, don't be silly, YOU WEREN'T WORKING FOR ME when you did that . . . you were OFF THE CLOCK.
So the question comes, when Paul writes "not of works, lest any man should boast", is the "work" of which he speaks more like the work of an employee serving an employer, or simply the more general idea of exerting effort whatever kind?
I submit the case can be made that the work spoken of is work FOR THE EMPLOYER and hence the AGREEMENT TO ACCEPT THE OFFER is not PART OF THAT WORK. </font>[/QUOTE]A work defined in the Bible is really a work that the person believes will give them, or keep them saved. Is it not?
Just like a person who may have walked an alseway in an invitation. Calvinist will mock this as a work yet the person being saved does not claim it as a work unto saivation. The twisted logic of calvinism is like a brain washing.
Timtoolman
New Member
Believe and live, don't and die that is the soveriegnty of God. Pick whom you will serve this day.
Quite trying to tell God how He is too be sovereign. It makes you look foolish.
Timtoolman
New Member
Brought that up Bapmom, but that was not the answer they are program to answer from the calvie manuel.
Is there a definitive answer to this found in Scripture? No. I know it is not "because God didn't allow them to believe" or "God kept them from believing" as this would go against His nature. Trust God, not your intellect. We'll find out these answers soon enough.
StraightAndNarrow
Active Member
I'm amazed nobody has said this. People reject the gospel because they're not willing to give up their sinful life. The rich young ruler wasn't willing to give up his money. People simple aren't willing to pay the price.
S&N, I think that's just one of many reasons people reject the Gospel.
The rich man example wasn't one of the man not turning from his sin, it was one of him not wanting to turn from his materialism. Which, I guess, is a form of sin. Okay, you have a point.
But seriously, people reject the Gospel because they don't believe its sincerity, or because they don't feel God can forgive them, or because they don't think there's anything wrong with what they're doing, etc etc etc. Well, those are all forms of sin, I suppose. I should have listened to you in the first place.
The rich man example wasn't one of the man not turning from his sin, it was one of him not wanting to turn from his materialism. Which, I guess, is a form of sin. Okay, you have a point.
But seriously, people reject the Gospel because they don't believe its sincerity, or because they don't feel God can forgive them, or because they don't think there's anything wrong with what they're doing, etc etc etc. Well, those are all forms of sin, I suppose. I should have listened to you in the first place.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
It is not as foolish as believing that man is responsible for his own salvation. That has always been man's problem. That is the reason there are so many false religions. Scripture tells us:
Prverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Then consider why man accepts the Gospel:
John 5:21 [NKJV] For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.
John 6:37-40
37. All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39. And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:44, 45, 65
44. No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
45. It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
65. And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
Please note what the following Scripture teaches:
John 6:37 states: All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
John 6:65 states: Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.
So obviously God gives some men the ability to come to Jesus Christ. Those to whom the Father gives this ability will come to Jesus Christ. Those to whom the Father does not give this ability cannot come to Jesus Christ. Looking further:
John 10:26, 27
26. But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Philippians 1:29
29. For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;
Titus 3:3-6
3. For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.
4. But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
5. Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6. Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
Notice that in Titus 3:5 nothing is required of man for his Salvation. It is God the Holy Spirit who regenerates man and gives him the faith by which he believes.
Timtoolman
New Member
It is not as foolish as believing that man is responsible for his own salvation. That has always been man's problem. That is the reason there are so many false religions. Scripture tells us:
Prverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. </font>[/QUOTE]\\
Yada Yada Yada, same old tired calvinist unbibical response.
The only fool is one who will define recieving a gift is amount to working so they have earned that gift. No other bigger fool have I found in groups that believe such absurdity. Carry on though it is one blazingly clear reason people reject the teachings of calvin!
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
It is not as foolish as believing that man is responsible for his own salvation. That has always been man's problem. That is the reason there are so many false religions. Scripture tells us:
Prverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. </font>[/QUOTE]\\
Yada Yada Yada, same old tired calvinist unbibical response.
The only fool is one who will define recieving a gift is amount to working so they have earned that gift. No other bigger fool have I found in groups that believe such absurdity. Carry on though it is one blazingly clear reason people reject the teachings of calvin! </font>[/QUOTE]It is interesting to know that YOU reject Proverbs as unBiblical!
I know there have been some bad translations and paraphrases published but your quote is new to me, i., e.: The only fool is one who will define recieving a gift is amount to working so they have earned that gift. No other bigger fool have I found in groups that believe such absurdity.
Could you tell me which version carries this passage and where it is located?
Timtoolman
New Member
It is not as foolish as believing that man is responsible for his own salvation. That has always been man's problem. That is the reason there are so many false religions. Scripture tells us:
Prverbs 14:12 There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.
Proverbs 16:25 There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death. </font>[/QUOTE]\\
Yada Yada Yada, same old tired calvinist unbibical response.
The only fool is one who will define recieving a gift is amount to working so they have earned that gift. No other bigger fool have I found in groups that believe such absurdity. Carry on though it is one blazingly clear reason people reject the teachings of calvin! </font>[/QUOTE]It is interesting to know that YOU reject Proverbs as unBiblical!
I know there have been some bad translations and paraphrases published but your quote is new to me, i., e.: The only fool is one who will define recieving a gift is amount to working so they have earned that gift. No other bigger fool have I found in groups that believe such absurdity.
Could you tell me which version carries this passage and where it is located? </font>[/QUOTE]LOL, sorry Old Reg, that was for Calvbaptist. That is somewhat of the type of line he gave me for dealing with Adam and Eve. I do believe the proverbs to be bible and correct for living today.
The other line about glory given to the reciever of a gift is just fact in every world but the calvinist.