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Widows

rlvaughn

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
How's that working? What is the size of the congregation?
Well, as far as I know. We are small enough that everyone knows everyone -- and church and family are very much overlapping categories. We are also small enough that we currently have no widows that fit the qualifications of 1 Timothy 5. That doesn't mean that we can't or don't help when there is a specific need for someone, anyone, in the church, including a widow that wouldn't qualify to be taken under support of the church. We had a widow who would have qualified (for financial help) who recently passed, but her children were taking care of her so that there was no financial need.
 

MennoSota

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
It is the job of the family.
If the family is able.

Are you going to tell a widow with no family that she's out of luck because the Bible says your family must care for you?

Honestly, Reynolds, you are arguing for getting out of a biblical responsibility to our widows in the church.
 

MennoSota

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Count the local church wherein is my membership one of those who are very involved with the well being of each and every elderly/widow/widower and every church attendee but especially the elderly, widows, widowers.

Each one is known to the pastor and deacons with deacons assigned to the various needs as they arise both of monetary and work errand needs (fix a roof, etc).

We also have a Deacon's Benevolent Fund from which resource is taken to assist not only the elderly and widows/widowers but any in the church who are in need.

It works the other way BTW. Some of our widows who are well off are very generous givers.

I believe there are many local churches like my own where members are well looked after by the pastor and deacons.

HankD
This is fantastic, Hank. Very encouraging.
 

Jerome

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Yes, not all widows qualify for this benevolence according to I Timothy 5.

"Let a widow be enrolled if she is not less than sixty years of age,
having been the wife of one husband,
shown hospitality,
has washed the feet of the saints,
has cared for the afflicted,
and has devoted herself to every good work.
But refuse to enroll younger widows"

Yesterday John Piper pontificated on this very issue in the Ann Landers style feature on his website:

Ask Pastor John

"Are there verses in the Bible that encourage widows to remarry? And the answer is: Yes, there are, like I Timothy 5:11-16 where Paul wants younger widows to remarry instead of being on the special widow care ministry that existed, evidently, so that they wouldn’t be a burden on the church"
 

HankD

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Yes, not all widows qualify for this benevolence according to I Timothy 5.

"Let a widow be enrolled if she is not less than sixty years of age,
having been the wife of one husband,
shown hospitality,
has washed the feet of the saints,
has cared for the afflicted,
and has devoted herself to every good work.
But refuse to enroll younger widows"

Yesterday John Piper pontificated on this very issue in the Ann Landers style feature on his website:

Ask Pastor John

"Are there verses in the Bible that encourage widows to remarry? And the answer is: Yes, there are, like I Timothy 5:11-16 where Paul wants younger widows to remarry instead of being on the special widow care ministry that existed, evidently, so that they wouldn’t be a burden on the church"

And ... ?

Just curious. Do you have any comments concerning this Jerome?

Thanks
HankD
 

Reynolds

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The family not doing their part does not shift the burden to the church. If the children are too stingy with their time and money to help, maybe their parents should have reared them better. Distance is no excuse in this monetary society.
 

Scarlett O.

Moderator
Moderator
In my church, the widows - and we have a lot between the ages of 40 and 80 - are very, very active. They work in and out of the church, have ministries of their own, travel on their own across the country, and in groups. They are very, very faithful in attendance to church and the of work of the church and are a blessing to many.

We don't have any "little ladies" who need tending to.

However, we do have two elderly women who are widows who are winding down. Both still work in their yards, but that is coming to a halt quickly. The deacons of our church take turns in checking up on these ladies and so do a couple of Sunday School classes. If they miss church - it makes me personally worry and I check on them.

As far as nursing home widows and widowers, we have about 5 to 8. Various Sunday School classes check on them and we have several couples in our church who make those visits, too.
 

MennoSota

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The family not doing their part does not shift the burden to the church. If the children are too stingy with their time and money to help, maybe their parents should have reared them better. Distance is no excuse in this monetary society.
Biblical text for your opinion?

You are clearly childless.
 

Reynolds

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Biblical text for your opinion?

You are clearly childless.
I have given you the passage. I have kids. They will look after their mother. Given age difference, health differences, the fact that almost all males on my father's side of the family dies of heart attacks before 65, she will out live me by a long stretch. She will collect enough life insurance to not have to worry. Either way, the boys will look after her.
 
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MennoSota

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I have given you the passage. I have kids. They will look after their mother. Given age difference, health differences, the fact that almost all males on my father's side of the family dies of heart attacks before 65, she will out live me by a long stretch. She will collect enough life insurance to not have to worry. Either way, the boys will look after her.
The passage never tells the church to abandon widows as you proclaim. Your position is shameful.
 

Reynolds

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The passage never tells the church to abandon widows as you proclaim. Your position is shameful.
I did not say abandon widows. I said follow the instruction of the passage. The Church can do supplemental things, but the primary responsibility, in normal cases, rests with the family.
 

MennoSota

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I did not say abandon widows. I said follow the instruction of the passage. The Church can do supplemental things, but the primary responsibility, in normal cases, rests with the family.
No one disagrees with that. However, not all families are Christians. Not all widows have caring families. Not all widows have families. Not all families of a widow can move back home or move their mom to them.

At minimum, the church has a responsibility to be calling on widows and checking in on their well-being. I see churches dropping the ball on even the most minimal tasks when it comes to widows in the church.
You come across as not caring about widows in your church and demanding that families do it all. I disagree with that notion for reasons stated above.
 

HankD

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I did not say abandon widows. I said follow the instruction of the passage. The Church can do supplemental things, but the primary responsibility, in normal cases, rests with the family.
But that of course doesn't keep us as a church family to assure their (widows) well-being if there is any question at all including family neglect (its possible).

HankD
 

Earth Wind and Fire

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
What proactive plans does your church have in regard to caring for widows?

I notice many churches generally have no plan and often assume that family members are taking care of mom's who have had their husband die.

Are we, the church, failing in God's command that we care for widows and orphans?
could you describe the term,"Orphan"
 

Earth Wind and Fire

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I did not say abandon widows. I said follow the instruction of the passage. The Church can do supplemental things, but the primary responsibility, in normal cases, rests with the family.
If the Widow is part of the church body, Is she not part of the church family?
 

Earth Wind and Fire

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Persons whose parents have died and who are incapable of caring for themselves.

At least this is how I determine an orphan.

I ask because I was 12 YO when my father died, leaving my mom a widow with a Cerebral Palsy older sister & a 8 YO younger brother.....there was no visible means of support. Yes we had some family support & yes we had Christmas food baskets occasionally from the church, but no real outpouring from the community (we live in NJ...the ground zero of snooty self absorbed neighbors. We survived mostly by ourselves. I am just curious what other parts of the country think & if they are charitable.
 

HankD

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Really, the church should reach out to the whole community.

The church family first of course, widows, orphans (kids who have been bounced around different homes by CPS).

In my 20 years at the local church we attend , we have had "drives" - diapers for single moms, cookies for cops, socks and other items for inmates and church pot lucks (only members bring food) open to the public, once we had a 4th of July hamburger/hot dog BBQ open to the public, etc...

HankD
 
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