"Women's roles in the church"

[ChurchofChristguy]

Bible says what it says.

so do you only have 2, but no more than 3, prophesying each assembly?

 

[Reynolds]

so do you only have 2, but no more than 3, prophesying each assembly?

Never more than three.

 

[Alcott]

I believe this is the overriding principle:
[Gal 3:28 KJV] 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

If a man becomes a Christian then can he have a baby?

 

[agedman]

Just because Paul said to remain silent at that time does not make it a prescription for how it should always be. Their circumstances were chaotic in the services. Paul was just trying to have them do all things orderly.

So, are you suggesting that the principle should be that whatever Paul wrote about is up for change?

Or just whatever someone doesn't particularly like when it doesn't serve there own agenda?

If one takes your statement at face value, would it not lead to everyone doing what is right in their own eyes with no standards?

Perhaps it may be wise for a counsel to meet and decide how much more than what was displeasing to Thomas Jefferson should be cut out of the Scriptures.

 

[utilyan]

If a man becomes a Christian then can he have a baby?

He can have 8 billion babies.

I think folks get caught up with the title/power perceived . Like whether you pastor, priest, church this or that. If God is on your side you can run the whole church as a janitor.

I wish folks would embrace their underdog role.

 

[Reformed1689]

Just because Paul said to remain silent at that time does not make it a prescription for how it should always be. Their circumstances were chaotic in the services. Paul was just trying to have them do all things orderly.

Now this I disagree with. There is very clear principle that they are not supposed to teach men.

 

[ChurchofChristguy]

So, are you suggesting that the principle should be that whatever Paul wrote about is up for change?

Or just whatever someone doesn't particularly like when it doesn't serve there own agenda?

If one takes your statement at face value, would it not lead to everyone doing what is right in their own eyes with no standards?

Perhaps it may be wise for a counsel to meet and decide how much more than what was displeasing to Thomas Jefferson should be cut out of the Scriptures.

I wrestle with this all of the time. Are we all not at least a little guilty of cutting and pasting both Acts and the Pauline letters to fit our narrative? Each one of us brings, and applies, a certain preconceived set of rules, to the Holy Book as we read it. Because I've been Church of Christ all my life, I am going to naturally look at the scripture through that lens, and so forth.

If the truth was told, most of us quietly tend to think "our way" is the most correct, and that we have risen above the fray of denominationalism and our baked-in doctrines to the most correct path. I don't know that that is really possible, however, with the human condition. Our own experiences and influences leave fingerprints all over our "truth". Thankfully God understands this fully since He is our creator.

 

[Van]

"1 Corinthians 14:34 is explicit: "Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak..." Now if we claim "that is just intended for the church at Corinth", or "that was intended only for that culture", then what other parts of the NT do we then decide to disregard on the same basis?"

Everywhere we conclude the direction was a cultural accommodation. For example, the Bible addresses how to treat slaves or indentured servants. But now we believe Christians would treat others as they would like to be treated.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Now this I disagree with. There is very clear principle that they are not supposed to teach men.

I'm not going to disagree with you about the principle, but in all honesty and sincerity - what happens when a woman is drawn to the Bible to the degree that she knows more about it and the application of it than her male Sunday School teacher, or her husband, or men in her class.

Why should many countless women who know the scriptures and understand them deeply sit under a man who barely skims the surface on Saturday night before in preparation and it shows week after week.

What are they to do? Change churches? Stop studying? Just keep sitting there and silently smiling pretending that they are being fed?

Can they teach their husbands at home? I know women who do that as their husbands don't go to church and won't go to church and their husbands have consented to participate in the bible study at home. [And the wives are praying this will lead their husbands to Christ and to the church.]

I guess what I am trying to convey it that I understand what the Bible says and have been on the Baptistboard since 2002 and am fully aware that this topic has repeated itself ad nausem for almost two decades....

...but I just want you all to be aware that there are some very smart and spiritually discerning women out there who study the Bible as if it were a treasure trove and know it very, very well and they do this out of a great desire for spiritual growth.

There's more us out there than you can imagine.

 

[Reformed1689]

I'm not going to disagree with you about the principle, but in all honesty and sincerity - what happens when a woman is drawn to the Bible to the degree that she knows more about it and the application of it than her male Sunday School teacher, or her husband, or men in her class.

That doesn't change anything. The women are not to teach the men.

Can they teach their husbands at home?

Of course they can evangelize, however, there is a fine line to walk here.

...but I just want you all to be aware that there are some very smart and spiritually discerning women out there who study the Bible as if it were a treasure trove and know it very, very well and they do this out of a great desire for spiritual growth.

Nobody is questioning that.

 

[Scarlett O.]

That doesn't change anything. The women are not to teach the men.

I didn't say that women are to teach the men. I said that I understood the principle.

I asked what are we to do when we sit under men who aren't good teachers and who, well frankly, don't know the Bible like we do. Pray for them, I know, but is there anything that can be done.

 

[Reynolds]

I'm not going to disagree with you about the principle, but in all honesty and sincerity - what happens when a woman is drawn to the Bible to the degree that she knows more about it and the application of it than her male Sunday School teacher, or her husband, or men in her class.

Why should many countless women who know the scriptures and understand them deeply sit under a man who barely skims the surface on Saturday night before in preparation and it shows week after week.

What are they to do? Change churches? Stop studying? Just keep sitting there and silently smiling pretending that they are being fed?

Can they teach their husbands at home? I know women who do that as their husbands don't go to church and won't go to church and their husbands have consented to participate in the bible study at home. [And the wives are praying this will lead their husbands to Christ and to the church.]

I guess what I am trying to convey it that I understand what the Bible says and have been on the Baptistboard since 2002 and am fully aware that this topic has repeated itself ad nausem for almost two decades....

...but I just want you all to be aware that there are some very smart and spiritually discerning women out there who study the Bible as if it were a treasure trove and know it very, very well and they do this out of a great desire for spiritual growth.

There's more us out there than you can imagine.

Why should a man who loves having sex with another man, is committed to that man, and desires to live his life with him not do so? BECAUSE the Bible says not to! You can make a pile of excuses as high as the steeple, but it does not change The Word of God.

 

[Reynolds]

I didn't say that women are to teach the men. I said that I understood the principle.

I asked what are we to do when we sit under men who aren't good teachers and who, well frankly, don't know the Bible like we do. Pray for them, I know, but is there anything that can be done.

Teach a Womens class.

 

[Reynolds]

I'm not going to disagree with you about the principle, but in all honesty and sincerity - what happens when a woman is drawn to the Bible to the degree that she knows more about it and the application of it than her male Sunday School teacher, or her husband, or men in her class.

Why should many countless women who know the scriptures and understand them deeply sit under a man who barely skims the surface on Saturday night before in preparation and it shows week after week.

What are they to do? Change churches? Stop studying? Just keep sitting there and silently smiling pretending that they are being fed?

Can they teach their husbands at home? I know women who do that as their husbands don't go to church and won't go to church and their husbands have consented to participate in the bible study at home. [And the wives are praying this will lead their husbands to Christ and to the church.]

I guess what I am trying to convey it that I understand what the Bible says and have been on the Baptistboard since 2002 and am fully aware that this topic has repeated itself ad nausem for almost two decades....

...but I just want you all to be aware that there are some very smart and spiritually discerning women out there who study the Bible as if it were a treasure trove and know it very, very well and they do this out of a great desire for spiritual growth.

There's more us out there than you can imagine.

All the major church problems I have ever dealt with were caused by Women. Paul knew that and headed it off. Women pick sides and bicker about trivial crap. My wife is always getting her feathers ruffled about things that are 100% meaningless in the big scheme.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Why should a man who loves having sex with another man, is committed to that man, and desires to live his life with him not do so? BECAUSE the Bible says not to! You can make a pile of excuses as high as the steeple, but it does not change The Word of God.

I have no idea what you are talking about. I was not desiring for a woman to teach a man.

I was asking for the countless women out there who are not being fed …… what are we to do?

I don't know what homosexuality has to do with my question nor excuses.

I've said twice and now this is the third time this morning that I am not disagreeing with the biblical principal.

I'm done. I don't need any further counsel.

 

[Scarlett O.]

All the major church problems I have ever dealt with were caused by Women. Paul knew that and headed it off. Women pick sides and bicker about trivial crap. My wife is always getting her feathers ruffled about things that are 100% meaningless in the big scheme.

I guess I am going to have to disagree with this. And by they way....it's hurtful to read stull like this. C'est la vie.

 

[Reynolds]

I guess I am going to have to disagree with this. And by they way....it's hurtful to read stull like this. C'est la vie.

If the truth hurts.........

 

[ChurchofChristguy]

All the major church problems I have ever dealt with were caused by Women. Paul knew that and headed it off. Women pick sides and bicker about trivial crap.

Wow.

 

[Reynolds]

Wow.

Yep. It's amazing how emotions cause church fights.

 

[ChurchofChristguy]

In the first century, women were considered completely subservient to men. Today in the Middle East and Far East, it hasn’t changed much. Paul’s words were reflective of that culture and still are.

If Christ felt that a woman wasn’t up to the task of telling the good news that Christ has risen, then why did he assign that very task specifically to a woman n the first place, immediately after he has risen? Or was that just a coincidence?

We have forever had this cockeyed view that man is superior to woman by distorting a lot of scripture. “Woman was made from man so that means man is superior.”

OK, which is more valuable: A being that was formed from dirt, or a being that was formed from a being?

The woman was created to help the man and as a bonus she was intended to attract man so that he would draw near her. That’s important stuff right there! Ever notice that women are far more beautiful than men? Or is that just a coincidence?