Church of rome MUST have other than scripture for a source of authority, for their hereticsal doctrines can be found only in either Church tradition or Aprocrapha, not the real scriptures!
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- Thread starter Davyboy
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Is there a bible verse that spells out PLAINLY and CLEARLY that Scripture is the Final and Only authority?
Yes or No.
Notice no one can answer a simple YES or NO. Because it is in their best interest to promote LIES than to tell the TRUTH. SATAN APPROVED.
Yes or No.
Notice no one can answer a simple YES or NO. Because it is in their best interest to promote LIES than to tell the TRUTH. SATAN APPROVED.
s there one that states was a perpetual Virgin, that there is a Pope, that there is a puegetory etc?
Most Importantly, ANY bible passage that denies the Pauline view on Justification for the view of Rome concerning Justification then?
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I believe it is the Testimony of the Spirit of God within a person that bears witness to the Authority of Scripture. We have given you verses that promote the Authority of Scripture, yet you deny them. Leave Rome, She is a harlot. Come be Free in Christ.
Still waiting for you to provide the bible verse that spells out PLAINLY and CLEARLY that The Church is the Final and Only authority.
No. You would be correct if when all the Apostles were dead that would have been the end of the institutional Church here on earth and the only surviving thing was a document called the NT Scriptures, but as we all know that is not the case.
The One Holy Christian Church continued on into time, with a leadership to make the needed decisions that the future would bring. True, it did this with the Scriptures as a guide, but it was real human beings making up this new Christian Church that decided the things that came up for the faithful to follow, with the authority from on high to do this no less.
Take the NT Canon for example. Was it he Scriptures themselves, or was it the leadership of the Church making the final decision as to what it would include, thus in essence becoming the final authority? To believe what you are peddling, one would have to discount some of what is actually written in the Scriptures and then the resulting historical reality of what happened concerning Christianity as a whole.
So for example, when Luther called them out for what he seen as false doctrine, these Leaders went to the Scriptures for guidance and decided God would want him hunted down and killed.
The Church is the authority by virtue of Jesus Christ being in charge of it.
To claim the Church has no authority is to say Jesus has no authority.
Jesus Christ himself plainly and clearly states the church is the final arbiter between disputes.
Matthew 18
If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector.
Again I want people to notice they cannot provide any bible verse to back up the unbiblical that scripture is the final and only authority. You can't even answer a simple yes that it does teach it.
UNBIBLICAL.
You pick out one incident when Jesus tells two Christians who have a person issue with each other and form a doctrine that the church is the final authority over the word of God????
So Jesus first says to take the issue before two or three other Christians. So before the church settles anything the other regular church goers get to decide doctrine? No, it's not about doctrine, it's about a trespass.
Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Of course not, that would be stupid. Your scripture support for the church having final authority over doctrine falls flat. The passage is about trespassing one against another. Nothing more. This is how flawed your belief is. By the mouth of two or three witnesses doctrine gets to be settled? So if they all agree Jesus was married then it is settled, Jesus was married. That is how silly this would be using this passage as your support for the RCC having any final authority over God
With this passage we don't even need the church at all. Two or three witnesses can settle doctrine.
No need to, Just two or three witnesses are the final authority.
Mat 18:15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother.
Mat 18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
Don't even need the two or three witnesses. I can settle doctrine with just my brother.
Oh you found the verse? great. where is it?
I wasn't aware that this was the case and all I know is that he was branded a heretic and that was that. A peaceful counter-reformation was subsequently commenced, but unfortunately at some point both sides then descended into killing each other.
Dave G
Well-Known Member
Yes, there is:
" All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
17 that the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works." ( 2 Timothy 3:16 )
I like how no one said anything or put up a rebuttal with all the verses says “BIBLE NOT ALONE”.(besides this weak statements of Jon’s) You can’t answer that post with all oral teaching tradition was written. First nowhere in scripture says every single teaching (tradition) is written in the Bible alone. Second, back when they wrote these individual books they didn’t have access to a computer or a notebook and pen. So it wasn’t so simple to say wait Paul, let me to the kitchen to grab a pen and notebook or better yet my laptop to write down every single word you say.
Speaking of Mt 23:2-3. The Jewish tradition including the extra-biblical Mishna, this describes “teaching succession” from Moses on down. Jesus acknowledges this tradition: Then said Jesus to the crowds and to his disciples, “The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat; so practice and observe whatever they tell you, but not what they do; for they preach, but do not practice.”
Here Jesus is sanctioning a tradition of pharisaical authority, and in so doing he is giving legitimacy to the concept of extra-biblical oral tradition. Some pharisaical traditions were corrupt (therefore Jesus condemned them, just as here he condemns their personal hypocrisy), he insists that the scribes and Pharisees hold a position of legitimate authority so that even Jesus commands obedience to them.
Look at the previous pages about the comments I wrote about 2 Timothy. In addition to what I wrote another point to think about is that the OT Paul encouraged Timothy to continue in what he learned from the Septuagint. (The Apocrypha- includes books that aren’t included in the Protestant Old Testament.) Timothy was a Greek and was most familiar with the Greek Septuagint and had been since his time from his youth. Paul was familiar it the Septuagint and it been said that 80-90% of Paul’s quotations of the OT in the New are from the Greek Septuagint (the books that Protestant exclude from their OT).
Your understanding is darkened.
1 Timothy 1
6 Some have departed from these and have turned to meaningless talk. 7 They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
There is no point engaging with a person who will not submit to the Authority of the Word of God. You elevate the Authority of man and diminish the Authority of God. You've relegated the Word of God to simply something that may "profit" you.
God DESTROYED the substitutionary priesthood and brought a BETTER covenant--one after the order of Melchizedek--something you know nothing about nor are you willing to learn.
2 Corthians 6:17
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