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You can be saved without the Gospel???

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PB Brother Tony

PB Brother Tony

Member
davidtaylorjr said:
No Romans 3.
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Romans 3 that’s right!

So you understand that:


Romans 3:10-12 KJV
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: [11] There is none that understandeth, there is ➡️none that seeketh after God⬅️. [12] They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Here we see that man is a God hater by nature and we don’t even seek Him before regeneration.


How do we seek Him?

The Gospel/Holy Bible.


Only the regenerated child of God will seek God.


1 Corinthians 2:14 KJV
[14] But the natural man receiveth ➡️not⬅️ the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


These are clear proves that anyone that seeks God and believes the Gospel has already passed from death to life.


There’s no way that the natural man will listen to the Gospel preaching for rebirth because 1) it’s foolishness to him and 2) he does NOT seek after God.


When a person accepts Jesus as Lord by the preaching of the Gospel is because regeneration has already taken place and he’s going through conversion. Two different steps.


The Gospel does save us because what took place in it and that’s Christ dying for the elect.


However we’re not saved because we hear the Gospel.


The blood of Christ redeemed us, not our faith.


Faith is the byproduct of our regeneration, not the means for it.


If the cross is foolishness to the natural man how can we think that they’ll ever sincerely believe the crucifixion account.


Christ’s calling quickens to eternal life but the Gospel message calls to conversion.


If the preaching causes regeneration then the preacher becomes a type of savior.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
PB Brother Tony said:
Romans 3 that’s right!

So you understand that:


Romans 3:10-12 KJV
[10] As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: [11] There is none that understandeth, there is ➡️none that seeketh after God⬅️. [12] They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Here we see that man is a God hater by nature and we don’t even seek Him before regeneration.


How do we seek Him?

The Gospel/Holy Bible.


Only the regenerated child of God will seek God.


1 Corinthians 2:14 KJV
[14] But the natural man receiveth ➡️not⬅️ the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


These are clear proves that anyone that seeks God and believes the Gospel has already passed from death to life.


There’s no way that the natural man will listen to the Gospel preaching for rebirth because 1) it’s foolishness to him and 2) he does NOT seek after God.


When a person accepts Jesus as Lord by the preaching of the Gospel is because regeneration has already taken place and he’s going through conversion. Two different steps.


The Gospel does save us because what took place in it and that’s Christ dying for the elect.


However we’re not saved because we hear the Gospel.


The blood of Christ redeemed us, not our faith.


Faith is the byproduct of our regeneration, not the means for it.


If the cross is foolishness to the natural man how can we think that they’ll ever sincerely believe the crucifixion account.


Christ’s calling quickens to eternal life but the Gospel message calls to conversion.


If the preaching causes regeneration then the preacher becomes a type of savior.
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Trust me, you are not teaching me anything. Yes there is regeneration and converstion. Two different things. Both required for salvation to be complete. Regeneration is the change of heart that allows us to belief/have faith. That is what initiates the faith or "activates" it. That is why it is of God and not a work. But Faith IS A REQUIREMENT of salvation. You can't just ignore the passages that state that explicitly.

You are so focused on nobody does good that you miss everything else.
 
PB Brother Tony

PB Brother Tony

Member
davidtaylorjr said:
Trust me, you are not teaching me anything. Yes there is regeneration and converstion. Two different things. Both required for salvation to be complete. Regeneration is the change of heart that allows us to belief/have faith. That is what initiates the faith or "activates" it. That is why it is of God and not a work. But Faith IS A REQUIREMENT of salvation. You can't just ignore the passages that state that explicitly.

You are so focused on nobody does good that you miss everything else.
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The Gospel gives us a temporal salvation on Earth. A peace of mind because it teaches us what Christ has done for us. We no longer have to be afraid Hell and damnation. We repent and become converted!


Christ’s sacrifice/blood is what gives us eternal justification and washed us clean!
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
PB Brother Tony said:
The Gospel gives us a temporal salvation on Earth. A peace of mind because it teaches us what Christ has done for us. We no longer have to be afraid Hell and damnation. We repent and become converted!


Christ’s sacrifice/blood is what gives us eternal justification and washed us clean!
Click to expand...
And where do you find this "temporal salvation" found in Scripture? We are not saved before conversion. The elect are not saved from birth.
 
Alan Gross

Alan Gross

Well-Known Member
davidtaylorjr said:
And where do you find this "temporal salvation" found in Scripture? We are not saved before conversion. The elect are not saved from birth.
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I believe he will say that he was 'saved' when he was Elected.

It is an 'election of grace' phenomenon, as an embellishment into something unheard of, in The Bible.

Let's see how many directions his horse rides off in. .
 
kyredneck

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
davidtaylorjr said:
I gave you my reply already.
Click to expand...

You chose a poor one. Mohler totally misapplied the type in this case:

"...One biblical text is particularly helpful at this point. After the children of Israel rebelled against God in the wilderness, God sentenced that generation to die in the wilderness after forty years of wandering. "Not one of these men, this evil generation, shall see the good land which I swore to give your fathers."(4) But this was not all. God specifically exempted young children and infants from this sentence, and even explained why He did so: "Moreover, your little ones who you said would become prey, and your sons, who this day have no knowledge of good and evil, shall enter there, and I will give it to them and they shall possess it."(5) The key issue here is that God specifically exempted from the judgment those who "have no knowledge of good or evil" because of their age. These "little ones" would inherit the Promised Land, and would not be judged on the basis of their fathers' sins.,,,"

The fact is that even after all the wickedness Israel had done in the wilderness after leaving Egypt (unbelief, disobedience, murmuring, idolatry, fornication, rebellion, etc.), and even with Balaam wanting so badly to curse Israel, God made Balaam to declare:

He hath not beheld iniquity in Jacob; Neither hath he seen perverseness in Israel: Jehovah his God is with him, And the shout of a king is among them. Nu 23:21
(Blessed is the man to whom, the Lord will not reckon sin. Ro 4:8)

AND, throughout all their wandering/chastening in the Wilderness He still yet gave them shade by day and light by night, He fed them manna, gave them water, their clothes never wore out, their feet didn't blister, etc., He was with them always even though He granted them no repentance to enter into His Rest. They wandered in the Wilderness for the rest of their lives when they could have spent it in the Land of Milk & Honey had they only believed and obeyed the gospel that it was their's for the taking.

The lesson here is not about infants going to heaven, it's about God's faithfulness (Romans 3:3; 2 Timothy 2:13) and the power of Christ's atonement (Exodus 12:13).

It's like I said, you all make up provisions for some to 'go to heaven' apart from the gospel, yet deny those same provisions for others.
 
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kyredneck

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Correct the paraphrase if I'm wrong:

"You can go to heaven without the Gospel???"

That's what you're really asking, right?
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
kyredneck said:
You chose a poor one. Mohler totally misapplied the type in this case:

"...One biblical text is particularly helpful at this point. After the children of Israel rebelled against God in the wilderness, God sentenced that generation to die in the wilderness after forty years of wandering. "Not one of these men, this evil generation, shall see the good land which I swore to give your fathers."(4) But this was not all. God specifically exempted young children and infants from this sentence, and even explained why He did so: "Moreover, your little ones who you said would become prey, and your sons, who this day have no knowledge of good and evil, shall enter there, and I will give it to them and they shall possess it."(5) The key issue here is that God specifically exempted from the judgment those who "have no knowledge of good or evil" because of their age. These "little ones" would inherit the Promised Land, and would not be judged on the basis of their fathers' sins.,,,"

The fact is that even after all the wickedness Israel had done in the wilderness after leaving Egypt (unbelief, disobedience, murmuring, idolatry, fornication, rebellion, etc.), and even with Balaam wanting so badly to curse Israel, God made Balaam to declare:

He hath not beheld iniquity in Jacob; Neither hath he seen perverseness in Israel: Jehovah his God is with him, And the shout of a king is among them. Nu 23:21
(Blessed is the man to whom, the Lord will not reckon sin. Ro 4:8)

AND, throughout all their wandering/chastening in the Wilderness He still yet gave them shade by day and light by night, He fed them manna, gave them water, their clothes never wore out, their feet didn't blister, etc., He was with them always even though He granted them no repentance to enter into His Rest. They wandered in the Wilderness for the rest of their lives when they could have spent it in the Land of Milk & Honey had they only believed and obeyed the gospel that it was their's for the taking.

The lesson here is not about infants going to heaven, it's about God's faithfulness (Romans 3:3; 2 Timothy 2:13) and the power of Christ's atonement (Exodus 12:13).

It's like I said, you all make up provisions for some to 'go to heaven' apart from the gospel, yet deny those same provisions for others.
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I think you missed the point. But if you want specific scripture that says infants are saved, you will not find one.
 
agedman

agedman

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I posted:

agedman said:
Who, on this thread, can post exactly what is mean by “gospel”?


Paul was a preacher of the “gospel” of Jesus Christ.

The Baptizer heralded the coming Messiah.

The preaching warning of judgment to come.

The work of ministering done by Christ.


It would be very good if what you posted was of that character.

It was not.
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You posted:

Alan Gross said:
Church Discipline protects The Churches Jesus Built from Heresy.

And insubordination and flesh-filled carnal devience to Fullfill The Great Commission Given to her, would be cause for some intervension and admonision to repent of that Heresy, or bring it before the body for a vote, to be loosed from that fellowship.

Outside of The Kind of churches that Jesus Built, there are innumerable false churches and other non- Christian religions.

They all preach one thing.

Deny The Gospel.

The Gospel is one of the best kept secrets on Earth.

You, religiously, tell me I'm this and that, but you don't indicate that you are at all familiar with what The Gospel is.
Click to expand...

Unless you can do better at answering the question, “Who, on this thread, can post exactly what is mean by “gospel”?” then why do you even respond?

I gave four examples of the use of “gospel” and your response is giving demeaning accusation of absolutely no value to you nor the thread.

Do you even know what “gospel” means and the uses in Scripture?

Please spend time contributing to the thread rather than proclaiming unfounded heresy.

Is it possible you do not know the definition and exampled use of “gospel” ?

We have yet to see.
 
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