IF You Hold Gospel is To ALL men: Interprete John 8:42-47!

Thanks for the laugh, after reading many of your postings, I needed it! :laugh:

 

There is no quantifiable reason in the Greek for this word to be translated as 'since' and it is for THAT reason you will not find, or RARELY find it so.

 

Right, and only you Reformed/Calvinists know what the proper word should be. :laugh:

These types of arguments are silly if you believe what the scriptures say, that all scripture is by inspiration of God.

2 Tim 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

If God had wanted to say since, he could easily have said since. This is similar to the argument when Calvinists say Jesus did not die for all men, but only the elect. Isn't God smart enough to say that? Couldn't God have simply said, "Jesus died for the elect only"? I am just an average guy, but I could easily figure out how to say Jesus died for the elect only without using misleading words like "all" or "every man" when I really meant "the elect only".

What is it? Do you think God is stupid and does not know how to properly express himself, or do you just think all non-Cals are idiots and are fooled by these ridiculous arguments? I get the impression that Ref/Cals believe both, they feel a great need to tell people "what God REALLY meant to say".

The word "since" occurs 70 times in the KJB. So, it isn't like the Holy Spirit doesn't know this word. If Jesus had wanted to say "since" in John 8:24, he could have easily done so. He used the word "if" because these men had choice. If they believed they would be saved, if they believed not they would die in their sins.

It seems Calvinists could come up with better arguments than this, the only persons convinced by these silly arguments are Calvinists themselves! So, who are the ones easily fooled?

 

This reminds me of some guys who were on the board a few years ago and have since (pun intended) been banned for their heretical beliefs. They insisted that the word "eternal" did not mean eternal or forever or everlasting, but instead meant "for a certain period of time". They were never able to prove this but were very critical of others for their lack of education in not knowing this. Sound familiar?

 

My point. :thumbsup:

 

The problem is that us non-Cals are uneducated. The first thing we need to be a true scholar is a good Calvinist dictionary. I found this one online.

We need to add the word "if" to this now.

If: Since

 

You just happen to be incorrect. It doesn't have to be from the Greek, but in the context.

In other words it (if) implies "since" since it also means "forasmuch" which is in the Greek definition of "if." Thus, if is used also as, not always calling into question, but supporting the flow of thought as "forasmuch." Colossians 3:1, for instance.

It's not that hard, really.

- Peace

 

It was decreed that we would be angry at Calvinists, didn't you know that?

 

If it is decreed, it will surely come to pass.

Edit- Oops! I almost forgot: SINCE it is decreed, it will surely come to pass.

I know those two statements mean exactly the same thing, because I have now been taught the proper meaning of the word "if".

 

:thumbsup:

Winman is angry, and will stay angry. :laugh:

That, and he doesn't know the Greek meaning of "if" as in, it means, "forasmuch."

Hey Winman, go look up the definition of if in the Greek, and study the context leading to Colossians 3:1 and see how "if" there could read "forasmuch" or "since." No need to get twisted as is your norm, just go look for yourself instead of practicing mocking and cynicism, and actually have something to back it up that is tangible.

I'll give you a hint: Strongs G1487; "ei." :wavey:

Some versions even render it this way, correctly.

 

No it's in there. Note Elijah's use of it on the priests of baal

 

Did you ever read what Elijah said to the prophets of Baal?

1 Kngs 18:26 And they took the bullock which was given them, and they dressed it, and called on the name of Baal from morning even until noon, saying, O Baal, hear us. But there was no voice, nor any that answered. And they leaped upon the altar which was made.
27 And it came to pass at noon, that Elijah mocked them, and said, Cry aloud: for he is a god; either he is talking, or he is pursuing, or he is in a journey, or peradventure he sleepeth, and must be awaked.

There is a place for sarcasm, even for Christians. When you are dealing with people who know they are in error, but persist to insist they are correct, a little sarcasm is good.
You can argue all day (and I'm sure you will) that the word "if" in John 8:24 means "since", doesn't make it so.

 

Sarcastic minds think alike.