IF You Hold Gospel is To ALL men: Interprete John 8:42-47!

Angry? I'm having fun. :laugh:

 

You're angry at calvinists. I find that humorous.

Go look up the word and find out for yourself that you are incorrect. Maybe you'll actually learn something.

 

I already know what the word "if" means.

And I'm really having fun. Talking with some of you guys is like this interview on Youtube. You will enjoy it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-QNAwUdHUQ

 

Unlike you, I prefer to read the scriptures.

 

Then he'd really learn some truth. :thumbsup:

I find it humorous, 1) he's angry at Calvinists, 2) mocks a word he hasn't defined, nor looked at, which would prove him incorrect, 3) yet, he knows everything, 4) refuses to study it out for himself.

Most of the time he goes on a rant upon false assumptions and subject matter that no one has even mentioned, thinking they have. Now that is hilarious! :laugh:

It's a waste of time when dealing with imprudent ones who refuse to have tangible support other than a cynical mocking in total ignorance of facts.

Unfortunately this is not rare in churches either.

Then sarcasm a fruit of the Spirit? That's blasphemous.

- Peace

 

If I wanted to know about God and how to be saved and go to heaven, why would I prefer a man's theory and doctrine over scripture?

Is reading John Calvin better than reading scripture? Is it more important to read John Calvin than scripture?

Should I throw my Bible away and read John Calvin's Institutes?

 

No, you definitely don't know what the Greek word "ei" means.

No need for your foolish video link that lends to your personal attacks. Is that another fruit, too?

 

First of all, there is no rancor on my part towards you. If you want to see rancor, be on the receiving end of one of Luke's rebukes. (Hey, I'm a poet and didn't know it....oh my I did it again! :laugh

You are trying to make the word "if" mean something else in order for it to fit your theology. The clear, simple reading is "if", meaning that man has a choice. When the plain sense makes perfect sense, seek no other sense, lest it be nonsense.

 

Well, "ei" is not the word "if" in John 8:24, the word "if" in John 8:24 is "ean me", and not once in the scriptures is this word translated "since".

It is translated "except" 33 times, "if not" 16 times, "but" 3 times, "if no" once, "not" once, and "before" once. It is not translated "since".

We are talking about the word "if" as used in John 8:24. In this verse, the Greek word used is never translated "since".

This word is used 18 times in the book of John, and in almost every case is translated "except" which means unless, or provided that, or contingent upon. It does not mean "sinse".

By the way, I looked up "ei" in a Greek Lexicon, it did not mention the word "since" as a definition. Here is the definition it gave.

According to this Greek Lexicon, the word "ei" is never translated "since" in the scriptures. Here are the other translations given for this word.

Source:

http://www.studylight.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=1487

So, this Greek Lexicon does not support your defintion, but it does support mine. But you are deflecting to begin with, we are discussing "if" in John 8:24 which is the word Ean me.

Edit- Here is what this Lexicon showed for Ean me.

I don't see the word "since" here, do you?

 

Bingo!:thumbsup:

 

Why? Does he explain how the word "if" really means "since"?

Not one bible version uses the word "since". Did all those translators get it wrong and you guys got it right?

 

Just who are these Arms?

 

We are not attacking Cals. I do not attack people. What we are debating is the Calvinist theology. That is what we disagree with. You seem to be a very nice person. I have no reason to attack you. Please don't be so sensitive. I can tell you from nearly 7 years on this board that you need to have really thick skin to stay around here. :1_grouphug:

 

Not one Bible version uses the word "since" in place of "if" at any verse?

 

I know, it's pathetic. If my pastor preached like this, I would get up and walk out of church. And he KNOWS it.

 

I don't know. We're not talking about any verse. Just one. John 8:24

 

That's not the issue and you know it. We are addressing the word "if" in John 8:24.

Jn 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

We are not discussing "if" used elsewhere in scripture, we are discussing "if" as used in John 8:24. The word "if" here is Ean me and is never translated "since" in the scriptures.

You KNOW this. Is this what you have to do to make your doctrine work? I wouldn't give you ten cents for doctrine like this.