How to Call for a Gospel Response Like a Calvinist

[Jerome]

my call for response is not, "Decide today to follow Christ!"

I was puzzled why you would reject this. So I posted an appeal from famous Calvinist Charles Spurgeon with similar language:

If God be God, serve him. Decide quick

To which you responded thumbs up, saying it would be the elect who would respond.



So why are you so opposed to you yourself using that appeal? Do you have some extra beliefs beyond what Spurgeon held that are motivating your quibble?

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Only after the enmity has been knocked out of your heart. Being forced into something is contradictory to obedience.

It is Grace & Mercy WAY BEYOND Mans Comprehension....that I will agree to! So much the better to the Glory of God that He actually would save anyone so entrenched in sin that cannot orientate themselves.... He in short saves the drowning man, the one who really deserves hell to prove His very Majesty.

Why would the sinner not stand in utter amazement and cry out , LORD SAVE OR ELSE I PERISH. Now thats a SAVIOR!:love2:

 

[JesusFan]

I believe Romans 1:16

what causes it to become the power of God. effective to save those who hear it though?

 

[webdog]

You left some key words out there...

the meaning doesn't change.

No, he was elect before he became president. He didn't become president elect when he became president.

he became president elect after the election. The calvinist understanding of election would have him being president elect before even deciding to run for office.

 

[webdog]

So are you saying that 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says we are chosen by Him because we first chose Him?

The Archangel

No, there is a condition though.

 

[webdog]

You have rather reinterpreted the Scriptures for your own use here.

Can we be sanctified without the presence of God? If not, then I guess that God comes first, which every soteriology that is not heretical stipulates.

I reinterpreted that passage?! :laugh: the passage says nothing of us being sanctified, it says sanctificatio OF the Spirit...i.e., the working of the Spirit. Get a clue before throwing around the "heretical" tag.

 

[The Archangel]

No, there is a condition though.

Please further explain what you mean.

The Archangel

 

[webdog]

You have rather reinterpreted the Scriptures for your own use here.

Can we be sanctified without the presence of God? If not, then I guess that God comes first, which every soteriology that is not heretical stipulates.

Where does the passage say WE are sanctified? You don't even understand the text in question which says sanctification OF the Spirit.

 

[webdog]

what causes it to become the power of God. effective to save those who hear it though?

God deciding it has power, which you denied in favor of stating only He has.

 

[webdog]

Please further explain what you mean.

The Archangel

The condition is the work of the Spirit and belief in the truth.

 

[JesusFan]

The condition is the work of the Spirit and belief in the truth.

Who would be the ones able to excercise their faith in jesus in order to get saved?

 

[webdog]

Who would be the ones able to excercise their faith in jesus in order to get saved?

Those in Romans 1 who do not exchange the truth for a lie. You know this already.

 

[jbh28]

the meaning doesn't change.

1. then why did you leave it out.
2. It changes everything. Salvation is through sanctification of the spirit and belief in the truth.

he became president elect after the election.

Right. After election, not after becoming president.

The calvinist understanding of election would have him being president elect before even deciding to run for office.

Don't take an analogy too far. He became elect when the election took place. We become elect when election takes place which took place before the foundation of the world. We are elected in Christ before the foundation of the world.

 

[webdog]

1. then why did you leave it out.
2. It changes everything. Salvation is through sanctification of the spirit and belief in the truth.

what did I say that was different in scope or meaning I said we were chosen (for salvation) through (by) sanctification of the spirit and belief in the truth.

Right. After election, not after becoming president.

I thought it would be from the foundation of the world (see below)

Don't take an analogy too far. He became elect when the election took place. We become elect when election takes place which took place before the foundation of the world. We are elected in Christ before the foundation of the world.

this is confusing. Since we didnt exist before creation we must be elect not from creation, but upon union with Christ as Scripture says.

 

[Iconoclast]

I'll ask you, Why did God elect these and not others?

By the way, when you laugh as someone and act like a fool, you really shouldn't expect a response.

God sets his love on those who he purposes for His own Holy reasons...as in Deut 7:1-10...

FYi....I was laughing at the simplicity with which he demonstrated the point...if we had a checkmate emoticon I would have used that.

 

[preacher4truth]

I'll ask you, Why did God elect these and not others?

By the way, when you laugh as someone and act like a fool, you really shouldn't expect a response.

Can God elect whom He wills to elect Robert? Is fault found with God in such Sovereignty, or shall there rather be faith placed in God in so doing?

Furthermore, let's leave out the name-calling and implications thereof in calling another a fool, and behave Christ-like? We know the Scriptures concerning alluding to others as such, do we not? I expect more Christ-like behavior stemming from a person as yourself saved years ago. I call into question and ponder upon such consistent behavior of an individual and will take it up in prayer.

- Peace

 

[Iconoclast]

Icon, I sense and believe that you have no "prideful arrogance" with regard to the doctrine of election and how those of the reformed persuasion view it, however, it does "appear" that the reformers position on election reduces down to a calculus of salvation. Keep in mind that those who do not share your soteriological conclusions also do not do so with human pride and vanity but with the same degree of humility that I assume you and others "opposing" me do as well. Many of those, similar to me in theology may not be comfortable being identified as synergists, I on the other hand have no qualms and remain convinced that salvation is synergistic.

QF....

I am glad you posted what you did. I do not share the writers view. I gave a simple reply why...if you or anyone wanted to study it out ...you can.
I do see synergism as error.God begins the work,and finishes the work in us.
I can only offer or react to what I see. QF....is someone mistakes a math problem or formula....do you point it out and offer correction? or do you say well you see it your way...i see it my way??
If you see what I post to be error...post why you see it that way...I will do the same:thumbsup:

 

[quantumfaith]

QF....

I am glad you posted what you did. I do not share the writers view. I gave a simple reply why...if you or anyone wanted to study it out ...you can.
I do see synergism as error.God begins the work,and finishes the work in us.
I can only offer or react to what I see. QF....is someone mistakes a math problem or formula....do you point it out and offer correction? or do you say well you see it your way...i see it my way??
If you see what I post to be error...post why you see it that way...I will do the same:thumbsup:

Yes, but mathematics and "metaphysics" are as we say....apples and oranges.

 

[preacher4truth]

QF....

I am glad you posted what you did. I do not share the writers view. I gave a simple reply why...if you or anyone wanted to study it out ...you can.
I do see synergism as error.God begins the work,and finishes the work in us.
I can only offer or react to what I see. QF....is someone mistakes a math problem or formula....do you point it out and offer correction? or do you say well you see it your way...i see it my way??
If you see what I post to be error...post why you see it that way...I will do the same:thumbsup:

Yes. For God is the Author and Finisher of our faith; Hebrews 12:2. We should meditate upon all this does mean. To do so magnifies God in His rightful place, that is, that He did it all, and none of it was us.

 

[quantumfaith]

Sounding the self humility horn is just a shallow as the implication that those who feel scripture indicates role (response) by man in salvation do so in some fashion of pride or self aggrandizement.