Featured Election

We cross posted.....biblical foreknowledge is not about omniscience...
it is WHOM [the person].......not WHAT He did foreknow

 

Iconoclast...

Totally false, and you know it is.

You knew full well that I was directing my statememt at the flawed theology of calvinism, yet you chose to to engage in slander anyway

Congratulations.

 

No you didn't God could have chosen not to give us volition but He gave us volition. He didn't give the Angels the ability to be redeemed but He chose to redeem mankind.

 

No, it was you that said God was a "sadistic monster." Why don't you keep these kinds of comments out. There is no need of it. It is slanderous to say that Calvinist believe anything that makes God to be a "sadistic monster."

 

AIC

God of scripture= God of Calvinism
you attack the God of Calvinism....you attack the God of scripture.

Every calvinistic confession holds this...you do not care evidently...that is on you if you want to post such foolishness.

 

Not saying that at all I am saying since God knew us He knew our decision, we were and are still sinners, the difference we made a concious choice to recieve Christ and God foreknew that choice. We were elected because He foreknew and therefore predestinated us to be conformed to the image of His Son.

 

So your saying that God choose people that were good enough to make a better choice....

 

JBH...

Now YOU are slandering me. It is mind bogglingly clear that I was saying that THE THEOLOGY of calvinism turns God into a sadistic monster, and NOT that God is a sadistic monster.

Both or you... STOP THE SLANDER.

 

No Esau was not elected because Esau would reject God's plan. God hated Esau not because of who Esau was but because of the choices God knew He would make. Just as He chose Jacob to be Israel before he was born.

God allowed Job to be tried because He knew what choices Job would make, and Job passed the test even though satan threw everything at Job passed and God knew He would that is foreknowledge. God has that same Omnicient foreknowledge when it comes to us.

 

It is based on what God knew about them, before they were born.

 

I didn't slander you at all. Read my entire post. I said that's what you said. If you are going to quote me, don't take part of my quote out. You took the, "It is slanderous to say that Calvinist believe anything that makes God to be a "sadistic monster." How come? Because you couldn't attack me back if you did. Again, lets leave these types of comments out. Nothing a Calvinist believes makes God to be a "sadistic monster." To say such is to say slander to your brothers.

 

Doesn't say that. You are reading something into the text. No where in that text nor anywhere in Scripture does it ever say that. EVERY single time it has to be read it.

 

Nope I am saying God chose based on the knowledge He had about the choice they would make not because they were better than others. God Foreknew therefore He predestinated those who would make that choice.

 

So your saying that God choose people that were good enough to make a better choice....

 

...and the reason I an saying the calivinism turns our God of Grace and mercy into a monster is because the theology teaches that God determined, before anyone was even born, that these billions over here get to be saved and go to heaven because I determind that they will go there,


....while these billions over here will burn in hell because I didnt pick them.



It makes a mockery of our loving and gracious God who declares...

It is not my will that ANY perish, but that all will come to repentance.

 

THe bible never says this....this is a misquote

 

Originally Posted by Tom Butler
Both Cals and non-Cals accept God's foreknowledge with regard to individual election. The difference is that that Cals relate God's foreknowledge to his decrees. That is, God knows because that's what he decided.

Non-Cals relate foreknowledge to one's choice. That is God knows who will choose Him, so He chooses them.

The second view begs the question: God elected me based my foreseen faith, didn't I basically elect myself?

You are making my point for me. If God's election of me is based solely on the the foreseen faith He gave me, how can it not be that I elected myself?

Seems to me that my election is based on my choice. I choose, God sees it, and must elect me.

And if this is the case, why does God need to elect me in the first place? I have already determined my salvation.

 

As JBH has posted...that is the opposite of what the scripture says:

11(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth;


This verse is written to show exactly the opposite...it is not what anyone does...it is God's purpose according to election.....not man

 

And that makes God a monster? Looks more like a God of grace!

How is God a monster by sending people that are sinners and deserve hell to hell?

Same argument that the universalist uses. Obviously, if God has a desire for all to be saved, there is something else going on as not all are saved.

 

Oh really??

Here it is, a direct copy/paste from the scriptures...

Iconoclast, I think you need to put down your calvinism indoctrination books and spend more time feeding on Gods inerant scriptures.