Featured Lies About John Calvin Refuted

Calvin By Bruce Gordon

Read slowly and with comprehension. The above is the truth. Don't deny the truth.

 

Now focus and read carefully.

 

Are your eyes unaccustomed to the light?

 

Yes,it was "the business of the Genevan magistrates" and Calvin was not among their number.

 

Read,contemplate and absorb the truth.

 

"Serious Calvin -scholars" are the ones I have repeatedly cited. But there are some posters here who continually malign Calvin with their slurs. They desperately want to mischaracterize him as J.I. Packer has aptly pointed out.

 

Muller and Larson are not your allies --but mine!

Your remark is insubstantial in contradistinction to my truthful posts from scholar/historians.

As I said in my OP --I am combating lies about Calvin. There is no idolization going on. And your slur is typical of you and your posts. You have failed multiple times in several threads to undo truth. You've tried again and again and failed.

Sayonara.

 

You know the Facts --but deny them

All of the above is absolutely truthful --historically factual. Anyone who differs with it is fabricating. Calvin had no authority to "order" the death of Sevetus or anyone else. To insist on that junk is pure obstinacy despite very well knowing the truth. In other words --sinning.Calvin was not the religious dictator of Geneva. Stop imbibing fiction. Calvin was turned down by the council many times with his requests regarding excommunication and having the Lord's Supper every week. Since he was turned down he can't very well be some despot can he?

Schaff,whom you use to try and place blame as a killer, lavishes praise on Calvin. He calls him "the Christian Elijah" and speaks of "the sanctity of his character." Was Schaff schizophrenic? Was he calling Calvin a murderer at times and extolling his admirable virtues in the next breath? Of course not. Schaff never called Calvin a killer. You know that very well. You know very well that all of those incidents detailed in chapter eight of Schaff's volume never charge Calvin with murder. All capital punishments were dealt with by the State. The Consistory only had authority over ecclesiastical matters --not things in the civil realm. You know that.

You know that the Consistory was not a civil court.
You know that the Small Council alone had the power to execute anyone.
You know that the City Council prosecuted the case against Servetus.
You know that Calvin was not a member of any of the three Councils in Geneva.
You know that Schaff never charged Calvin with murder.
You know that the other Reformers of Calvin's time endorsed the state execution of Servetus.
You know that Calvin held no political office.
You know that from 1546 to 1555 Calvin and his friends and fellow pastors of the Consistory were in the minority.
You know that the Little Council was composed of a majority who resented Calvin --the Libertines.
You know that the Libertines had to follow the expressed wishes of the four Swiss Churches or Geneva would be considered ripe for the plucking.
You know that thousands of refugees flooded to Geneva during Calvin's time.
You know that those thousands would not have come there if Calvin was the tyrant you make him out to have been.
You know that no other city in Europe was considered as much of a safe haven as Geneva was.

You know all of these facts. Yet you still resist the truth at every turn. It's shameful. It really is. But my postings here are for the benefit of the lurkers --not even BB members. You and others here defame and demean John Calvin. But you (in the collective sense) will be met with the facts. Your efforts are futile.

 

Anyone who differs from the facts is fabricating history.

That sounds rather weasel-like.

1)False.

2)False.

3)False.

4)False.

5)True for the most part.

6)True.

7)False.

8)Surprisingly little. It is only from our 21st vantage point that we idealistically see a lot of baggage.

9)I already told you that was false.

10)Stupidly false.

11)Nonsensically false.

12)This is the third time I'm telling you in response to your post. He did not have a state-church.

13)Absolutely untrue. And you know it is untrue, so that's called lying. You know the truth and are intentionally rebelling against it.

14)False.
Hmm..12 out of 14 were false. You are really wrong.

You lose. You fail. You hang onto your fictitious Calvin despite everything factual to the contrary. I can't call you uninformed. You know the facts but wish to be contrary out of spite.

As representative of many quotes from a variety of sources which I have provided --I will offer Mark J. Larson's voice. (Thanks again TND.)

"This specified limitation upon the power of the consistory --this separation between the jurisdiction of the ministers, on the one hand, and the jurisdiction of the magistrates, on the other was in sharp contrast to the previous history of Geneva when it was ruled by a prince-bishop,who possessed both civil and ecclesiastical authority." ( John Calvin and Geneva Presbyterianism,p.68)

 

They were not classmates. I see no evidence that they had ever met. Perhaps you can give me some insight on that.Servetus had scheduled a meeting once but he was a no-show exposing Calvin to great danger.

Servetus certainly did not want to reconcile with Calvin! You need to read more about his behavior. His deportment left a lot to be desired shall we say?!

Is Servetus a Deity to you?

Your history is skewed. Read the abstract of a paper by E.S. Ra on "The Question of Calvin's Involvement in the Trial of Servetus at Vienne (1553). It should clear things up for you. The bottom line is a snip from his conclusion where he states that Calvin "was unwilling to give evidence against Servetus to de Trie. Thus, Calvin had no involvement in the trial of Vienne." (p.179)

Calvin was responsible. I don't know if he was the first person to identify him though. Calvin's secretary,Nicholas de la Fontaine brought him to trial with a long list of complaints.

Capital crime. He was a wanted criminal --and considered a danger to the State.

Yes,he was merciful in that regard. The Council overruled him (as they did on many other occasions) and had him burnt to death.

No, it was not.

Bravo to him. He also entertained some bizarre beliefs to --including the idea that stars have an impact on our health. And of course his blasphemy of God with his works which ridiculed the biblical doctrine of the Trinity.

Many books have been written and shall be written detailing how greatly God gifted the Church with the person of John Calvin.

In the words of his older friend and mentor, Martin Bucer of Straussburg :"Now he comes at last, Calvin, that elect and incomparable instrument of God, to whom no other in our age may be compared, if at all there can be the question of another alongside him."

 

Michael Servetus was quickly recognized by visitors from Lyons who who told Calvin about it.

 

Some Snips...

from a paper :"The Perfect Storm :A Survey of Influences Affecting the Fate of Michael Servetus" by Ernest W. Durbin 11.
The Life and Thought of the Christian Church :1500A.D. to Present.
HCUS 5020
Walter Froese,Ph.D. April 4,2005.

"Servetus is seen as the quintessential example of John Calvin's intolerance towards divergent belief. It is presumed by many that sans John Calvin, Servetus would not have been executed in Geneva; as if Calvin's denunciation of the heretic was sufficient in and of itself to seal his fate. While Calvin's contributions in the matter were significant,in all actuality Servetus' untimely demise was nearly inevitable; resultant of cultural, religious, and political influences converging in his adult life,staged in the sixteenth century."(p.5)

"Actually, the city state was governed by a Council consisting of 24 male citizens of Geneva,including four syndics. Virtually every area of public life was subject to their scruitiny, and they intended no aspect to slip beyond their control. The trial, condemnation and execution (including mode) of Michael Servetus were entirely the responsibility of this corporate body. The primary body in Geneva for the purpose of maintaining ecclesiastical discipline was the Consistory. Formed in 1542, it was composed of twelve lay elders and all members of the Venerable Company of Pastors. Calvin conceived of this body primarily as an instrument for policing religious orthodoxy. In the Servetus incident this ecclesiastical body was bypassed altogether, possibly to marginalize Calvin in the affair." (p.11)

 

Are you in need of ESL? You and TND have huge reading comprehension problems. Calvin brought the Consistory into existence --not the Little Council. Can't you manage to distinguish the meanings of different words?

 

It was not murder on Calvin's behalf. It was a state sponsored execution. The death of Sevetus was going to happen no matter what. Calvin's request that Servetus be given the less painful death by beheading was rejected by the Council. Calvin was not in charge. He was subject to the authority of the Council.

I agree. But back then, by the actions of Servetus --he warranted execution by the State.