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Featured Calvin: God is the Author of Sin

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Agent47, Jan 10, 2017.

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  1. Agent47

    Agent47 Active Member
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    It's a cue for you to drop insults and sideshows,and focus on the subject or ship out, before you go bald after plucking all your hair in angst:)

    One thing I have never understood are forum members who jump into a thread they are uncomfortable with only to end up throwing tantrums.

    How often do you need to be reminded of the OP?

    Calvin conception of God is of a moral monster. I just proved that
     
    #181 Agent47, Jan 14, 2017
  2. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    That's a double negative, you meant "...to save anyone, and he does not even attempt to [do so]"

    Certainly he is under no obligation to save anyone. With that I agree. But then you follow with the absurdity that he doesn't even attempt to save anyone. That's just plain crazy. The Bible is against that lunacy as well as Calvin.
    Calvinists don't believe in that inconsistency just as Calvin did not hold to it.
    God does not damn and then save. That is a crazy charge.
     
    #182 Rippon, Jan 14, 2017
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  3. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    You are calling the authority of God's word evil. Be careful where and how you tread.
     
    #183 Rippon, Jan 14, 2017
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  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I don't worry about the morality of Scripture because I am not it's author.
     
    #184 JonC, Jan 14, 2017
  5. Agent47

    Agent47 Active Member
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    I know it's double negation. What's your point?

    That lunacy of external call to ALL but internal call/drawing to the Elect explains it.

    Does God not know that the external/general call is hopelessly ineffectual? He does. So don't wave that as evidence of attempting to save. He is only concerned with the Elect. He does not care for the rest.

    So saying God wills that no man perish is nonsense.

    Look. If God really will that none perish, and He alone can save, then he should save all. Not saving all means He Wills that some perish.

    In short, it is a contradiction to claim God wills none perish, while maintaining He draws some of the perishing and not all, especially given they are perishing out of his eternal decree.

    Calvin doubted the implications of his theories. Sheer madness.

    Who decreed,ordained,rendered certain the Fall?
     
    #185 Agent47, Jan 14, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2017
  6. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    #186 JonC, Jan 14, 2017
  7. Agent47

    Agent47 Active Member
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    You can do better than conflate a hollow theory with scriptures.

    Calvin invented a divine monster who masterminds a catastrophe by decree, and then attempts to undo/salvage it by more decrees.

    Caught in between are billions who will burn in hell as part of the plan
     
    #187 Agent47, Jan 14, 2017
  8. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    Everyone deserves everlasting torment in Perdition. Do you deny that core biblical belief?
    Everyone is responsible for their sins. God does not make anyone sin. He doesn't even tempt them.
    Because all are accountable for their actions and thoughts they deserve condemnation. Out of his divine mercy he saves those of his choosing whom he elected before the foundation of the world.
     
    #188 Rippon, Jan 14, 2017
  9. Agent47

    Agent47 Active Member
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    Not everyone but sinners. Infants for instance don't deserve domination.


    Calvin agrees with you. He also adds that God authored Sin. For nothing happens except he decrees it.

    God wills ALL be saved. The Elect are those who receive God's gift.
     
    #189 Agent47, Jan 14, 2017
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Think tat our friend has just skimmed some theology books, already decided that he knows tey were wrong, we have reral free will, and are not so bad as sinners. Think that he needs to focus on the Bible for now, and really get into Gospel of John!
     
    #190 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
  11. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    He leaves them to what they reall want to do,to keep on rejecting Him and have their "own way"
     
    #191 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
  12. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    You realy need to stop mocking God, for unless He extended grace towards ay of us here, all would be lost!
     
    #192 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Our friend just need to stay in the Bible, and read it to get further understanding, as the Holy Spiri can show Him how God saved us.... Th man problem is tht he cannot read Hodge/Calvin/Berkhof until he gets groundedi n the scriptures.
     
    #193 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
  14. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    What is inteesting is tat we have one hre who denies that we choose to sin and get judged by God as being accountible, and another who posts hre that in Christ God saved all sinners...
     
    #194 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
  15. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    God did not create sin. Sin is a byproduct of the Law. We cannot have Law with out someone breaking the Law. Sin, is not following what the Law demands. The Law was created for man to live by and man fails by the Law.
    I'm thankful we are no longer under the Law.
    MB
     
    #195 MB, Jan 14, 2017
  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    What of Paul's explanation that sin exists apart from the Law and apart from a direct commandment from God, that men have in fact sinned apart from the Law, and that the Law was given to magnify sin, to show those to whom it was given their sin through trangression and to keep them locked up in sin until Christ?
     
    #196 JonC, Jan 14, 2017
  17. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Your problem is that you neither know God nor understand Calvin.
    Calvin is just this man who wrote a lot of stuff. That you do not understand what he wrote is not any problem to me. As I wrote at the start, there is a pile of stuff about which I disagree with him.

    But I know God well enough to know that the Lord Jesus Christ died for me- me personally. He did not die to make it possible for me to save myself; He Himself saved me. I know that you don't care what God says in His word, but He says that when I was dead- not just a bit poorly, but dead- in sin, God made me alive in Christ. I now know God as my Father and Christ as my co-heir and Saviour through the witness of the Spirit (Romans 8:14-17). So I care when you blaspheme Him whom I love.

    You too can come to know God, through Christ, for He promises not to turn away any who come to Him. But if you come, you will realise that you have only come because He has loved you with an everlasting love, and opened your heart to receive Him (2 Thessalonians 2:13; Acts 16:14, not that you care).
     
    #197 Martin Marprelate, Jan 14, 2017
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  18. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Could you show scripture for this please. Paul said;
    Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
    MB
     
    #198 MB, Jan 14, 2017
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  19. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    Mitchell is no friend to truth....this is just part of his thought process on display.
     
    #199 Iconoclast, Jan 14, 2017
  20. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Th sinner went to Hell because they chose to disobey God and to stay in their sins, so God decreed that Hell would be them getting their choices...
     
    #200 Yeshua1, Jan 14, 2017
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