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Featured Limited Spiritual Ability of the Fallen

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, Oct 6, 2020.

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  1. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Y1 posts obvious falsehoods non-stop. Some of the Apostles, before being chosen were looking for the Messiah, thus seeking God. See John 1:35-42
     
  2. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    What does “totally depraved” mean according to Calvinism. It means we are in a spiritually dead condition, with dead meaning having no ability to discern "spiritual milk. Only after being made alive are we enabled to understand and believe the gospel.

    1 Corinthians 2:14 says the natural man, which refers to a spiritually dead unregenerate man of flesh, does not accept the things of the Spirit of God.

    Ephesians 2:1 simply says we are dead in our sins before we are made alive together with Christ.

    God alone who transfers us from the domain of darkness into the kingdom of His Beloved Son.
     
  3. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Wrong: Romans 1:19 says the fallen are without excuse, thus they have sufficient spiritual ability to discern attributes of God from what He has made.

    they have sufficient ability BUT NO SPIRITUAL ABILITY to discern attributes of God from what He has made.

    Matthew 23:13 DOES NOT have unregenerate men entering heaven
     
  4. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Matthew 23:13 is not about, "Faith", or "Salvation", or 'Spiritual Position, as you know, it concerns discouragement and prevention, physically, from going where they might Hear The Gospel, be Granted Repentance and Faith in The New Birth, then, Enter the Real Kingdom of Heaven, in HEAVEN.

    Being EXPOSED to THE GOSPEL KINGDOM, or 'the kingdom of heaven' in this verse is making no reference to 'Heaven'.
     
  5. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Yes it does.

    No it doesn’t.

    No point explaining it again, since you didn’t listen the first time.
     
  6. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    We were discussing the Eunuch. There is nothing about Phillip and the Eunuch in Matthew 23:13, so your charge that I am sidestepping the issue is nonsense. The eunuch was attempting to learn about God, but was UNABLE TO UNDERSTAND ... just like Scripture says all natural men are unable to understand. Just like the Pharisees (as highly educated and well studied natural men) could not understand.

    The propensity of the Pharisees to place stumbling blocks to those wanting to seek God by placing additional burdens they added to the Law on men, while they made no effort to event attempt to carry those burdens because they claimed special loopholes has no bearing on the ability of any “natural man” to understand the spiritual matters of God without a special gift of GRACE from God that empowers men to understand. I am not sidestepping the issue, rather the issue is irrelevant.
     
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  7. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    I remember that Paul spoke to “brothers” (the saved) and not to “natural men” (the unsaved) when teaching with “spiritual milk”. That is probably because Paul knew that “natural men” cannot understand things of the spirit (after all, Paul was the one that told us that truth).
     
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  8. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    Do you mean “the Apostle Paul” and “God”?
    They are the ones that make that claim.

    [Romans 3:10-12 NASB] 10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; 11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; 12 ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."

    [Psalms 14:2-3 NASB] 2 The LORD has looked down from heaven upon the sons of men To see if there are any who understand, Who seek after God. 3 They have all turned aside, together they have become corrupt; There is no one who does good, not even one.
     
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  9. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    You have completely ignored the actual verse and jumped straight to your personal redefining summary of what God REALLY MEANT rather than wasting any time on what He actually said. Superlative eisigegis.
     
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  10. atpollard

    atpollard Well-Known Member

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    1 Corinthians 3:1.
    And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual men, but as to men of flesh, as to infants in Christ
    Since that verse says NOTHING about “spiritual milk”, you have not proven anything except an ability to match random scripture verses with random conclusions.
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    [QUOTE="Alan Gross, post: 2640741, member: 14358" Only after being made alive are we enabled to understand and believe the gospel.[/quote] False, verse after verse says the fallen are able to discern some spiritual things, such as the attributes of God. Romans 1:19
    The things of the Spirit refers to spiritual solid food, not spiritual milk, 1 Corinthians 3:1-3
     
  12. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Irrational nonsense.
     
  13. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another taint so post, but the fallen are entering the kingdom of heaven, so they have some spiritual ability.
    Note denier after denier is simply repeating the same denial to add to the length of the thread.
     
  14. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Here no one seeks after God is rewritten to say no one ever seeks God, despite more than a dozen verses, like Matthew 23:13 which describe people seeking God.
     
  15. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    On and on, Atpollard said Pharisees. Now denies it. What a waste. Utter nonsense is being posted to lengthen the thread.
     
  16. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    False, verse after verse says the fallen are able to discern some spiritual things, such as the attributes of God. Romans 1:19


    The things of the Spirit refers to spiritual solid food, not spiritual milk, 1 Corinthians 3:1-3[/QUOTE]

    the lost can not grasp either. nothing of God, Who is Spirit,
    unless He Touches them, first.
     
  17. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another straight up deletion of "as to men of flesh" from 1 Corinthians 3:1. They are just posting nonsense to lengthen the thread.
     
  18. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another claim scripture says what it does not say. Note how more than a dozen verses showing people seeking God are said not to mean what they say.
     
  19. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Yet another straight up denial of scripture. These posters are wasting this thread with nonsensical posts, one after another.
     
  20. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    turn that around, where it can do some good.

    You are making, 'the kingdom of heaven', mean, 'Heaven', and you don't consider that it could have more expressive a meaning than that, by indicating, "The Entire Gospel Administration of The One and Only, True, and Living God's Eternal Covenant of Salvation, by Grace" ( and not some future, or Present Heaven, Where God Lives.
    He Can let you see another meaning if HE Wants. He Runs Heaven and Wrote The Bible...)
     
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