Another thing a Calvinist has never done.

I have no idea, why not ask them?

Speaking for myself, I hate no man...and even though I understand that salvation is entirely of God's grace, my sincere desire, like Paul's was, is to see sinners saved.
I just happen to understand that it isn't my choice or my actions or my belief in His Son that determines who God decides to be gracious towards.

It's His grace and mercy alone ( Titus 3:5-7 ) that saved me, apart from any action of mine.

He saves and He damns, and we are all guilty before Him.
He can choose to save one, ten, 100, 144 thousand, or countless millions ( Revelation 7:9 )....

I have no say in the matter.

 

All sinners or only a few

 

Again, ( and I'm sorry sir to have to tell you this, but I feel that I must or it will remain unsaid ):

Apparently you see Him extending His gracious hand towards all sinners and leaving the choice to be saved up to us, while I see Him extending His sure hand of grace to those He has decided to do so from before the world began ( Ephesians 1:4-6, Romans 8:28-30, 2 Thessalonians 2:13-14, Psalms 65:4, Acts of the Apostles 13:48, 2 Timothy 1:9, and many others ).

He casts into Hell those He has not loved and who hate Him and will never love Him as He is and as He has revealed to us in His word,
while He reserves His own to Himself through their belief and obedience to His Gospel.
He chooses who to be gracious towards, we do not ( Exodus 33:19, Romans 9:14-24 ).


Yet again my question stands...
If He loves everyone indiscriminately, why does He limit His love in His actions, to only those that believe?

Why does He only give eternal life to as many as believe on Christ?

If you are unable to answer that, then that tells me that you really haven't understood what the Scriptures have to say regarding election, predestination, calling and justification;
And haven't thought the entire thing through according to His word...
All of it, not just John 3:16 and a few others.



This is my final reply in this thread, sir.
As always, I wish you well and may God be gracious and merciful to all that read this by granting them His favor and gifts through the knowledge of His Son, Jesus Christ.

 

Thank you very much for your detailed response. While I've been leaning toward the Reformed view, I've been having trouble understanding it. Your response clears up some of the questions I've struggled with. I still have some questions, but this really helps settle my views more firmly. I've recently started reading "What is Reformed Theology?" by R.C. Sproul. This is truly a revelation. Bless you.

 

Orthodox Calvinists can. We should not confuse hyper-Calvinism with orthodox Calvinism.

 

believe that "repentance" is a "work", and therefore not a requirement for a sinner to get saved. This is plainly against the Teachings of Jesus and the Apostles

 

Bottom line: Whomever God wants to spend eternity with Him will do so!!

[Rom 9:18 KJV] 18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.

Mankind has no roll in his eternal state. It is only the arrogance of the human will, starting with Lucifer, that thinks he can control his destiny.

 

This verse does not teach what you suggest

 

New King James Version Romans 11:30-32 For as you were once disobedient to God, yet have now obtained mercy through their disobedience, even so these also have now been disobedient, that through the mercy shown you they also may obtain mercy. For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all.

 

I disagree. That being said, what about: "Bottom line: Whomever God wants to spend eternity with Him will do so!!" and "Mankind has no roll in his eternal state. It is only the arrogance of the human will, starting with Lucifer, that thinks he can control his destiny."

 

No but this one does!

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

I also agree with Wesley, if we were not chosen in eternity then Jesus Christ could not echo his final words

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, "IT IS FINISHED": and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

If Gods love sought, grace wrought, blood bought are not contained in the work of Jesus Christ alone, then it is not finished!... Stamp that on the front of your Bible!... Salvation is 100% Jesus Christ!... Brother Glen

 

Man controls NOTHING it is ONLY because of the Mercy Grace Love etc of the Good Lord that any human can ever be saved. In and of ourselves we CANNOT repent or desire to come to the Lord. It is the inner working of the Holy Spirit through the preaching of the Gospel and His convicting that points the sinner to Jesus for salvation. From start to finish salvation is of the Lord so that He ALONE gets ALL of the glory

 

One must return to John 3.16 which is the words of the Lord Jesus offering salvation to the whole human race and inviting all to come to Him for salvation. But sadly most will not come because most want it their way

 

Nothing like scriptural common sense to clear up the pseudo-intellectualism of Calvinism.

 

Common sense should tell you if there are no elected Gentiles in scripture then Gentiles are not elect.
MB

 

[1Ti 6:20 ESV] 20 O Timothy, guard the deposit entrusted to you. Avoid the irreverent babble and contradictions of what is falsely called "knowledge,"
[2Ti 2:16 ESV] 16 But avoid irreverent babble, for it will lead people into more and more ungodliness,

 

Your irreverent babble has not proven that you are elect.. Put your sword away before you cut your self.
MB

 

You now consider scripture verses to be irreverent babble.
What tangible proof do you have that you are or not among the elect?

 

I've never claimed to be elect. I'm not a Jew and I suspect that you aren't either You use scripture but you never prove a thing. I'm not elect because scripture never says Gentiles are elect. I do not assume what I believe there has to be proof in scripture. You and Calvinist like you claim you have to be elect to be saved which is not in scripture. You claim what I believe is false. Just because you ignore the truth. You falsely elaborate what you believe. Your not a Jew yet you claim to be elect. It's called replacement theology and it is false. This is why you can't prove it that you elect.
MB

 

You say: "I've never claimed to be elect."

Consider these verses:

[Rom 8:33 KJV] 33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? [It is] God that justifieth.
[Col 3:12 KJV] 12 Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
[1Pe 1:2 KJV] 2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Are you excluded because of your claim?

[Gal 3:28 KJV] 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.