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NIV 2011 Revision…Thoughts?
- Thread starter StephenUSAFVet
- Start date
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Why not address the topic? And of course, humanities cast down refers to the Fall. All RR does is find fault and does not explain why the NIV does not present an accurate translation of verse after verse.
Rule #70!
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
I am addressing the topic. You need to explain yourself. You need to flesh out the meaning of those two passages because as it is, you are not making any sense.
The wording of "Humanities cast down" is pathetic. There is no rhyme or reason to it. There is no such thing as "humanities" unless you're taking a Liberal Arts course. Humanity is singular --the whole mass of people from Adam and Eve to the last person to be born in the future.. You get yourself so befuddled with your wresting of the Scripture. Just say The Fall. And as I noted before. There is no mention of The Fall in both verses.
RR is long on false claims and short on objective analysis. I explained every problem listed.
Humanity's cast down refers to the fall.
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
Ah, no you did not. Why use such strange and ungrammatical language? Even 'downfall' would be better than your odd construction. Historically it has been known as The Fall. Get used to it.
But again, The Fall is not mentioned in Revelation 13:8 and 17:8. You are bringing something foreign to the text that does not exist there.
It is as if RR does not even know how many times "cast down" is found in scripture, and also "struck down" and other choices. Humanity's cast down refers to the fall.
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
Alas Van. You haven't done your homework. I examined all the instances of 'cast down' and 'struck down' in the WEB translation. Absolutely no verse with those wordings refer to The Fall. You need to do your due diligence guy. You lose. Your proclivity toward oddities is fascinating. You need to stick with "The Fall" if you want to 'refer' to that historic event.
As it is, those two references in Revelation have absolutely nothing to do with The Fall. Maybe you should try another hobby other than translating. I recommend remedial English classes.
Material False Statements are posted by this falsifier.
He said something was wrong with the grammar, yet translation after translation uses that grammar.
He denies cast down, struck down, and thrown down are used to translate our word. Utter falsehood.
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
RR thinks personal incredulity is not fallacious.
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
Consolidated Potential Improvements in the NIV's Translation of the New Testament [Part 1 or 2]
1) Matthew 3:11 should read, ""As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize some of you with the Holy Spirit and others with fire.
2) Matthew 5:22, 5:29, 5:30, 10:28 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
3) Matthew 11:12 should read, ""Since the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of the heavens has been forcefully sought, and forceful people are laying hold of it."
4) Matthew 11:30 should read "My yoke is beneficial."
5) Matthew 18:19, 23:15, 23:33 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
6) Matthew 25:34 “since the creation” should read "since humanity's cast down"
7) Mark 1:41 Jesus was indignant should read, "moved with anger."
8) Mark 9:43, 9:45, 9:47 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
9) Luke 6:4 should read "lawful for Priests alone."
10) Luke 6:36 be merciful, just as your Father is merciful should read be compassionate, just as your Father is compassionate
11) Luke 9:18 "praying in private" should read "praying alone"
12) Luke 10:40 "doing the work by myself" should read "doing the work alone."
13) Luke 11:50 should read "since humanity's cast down."
14) Luke 12:5, hell should read Gehenna
15) Luke 15:7 reads do not need to repent (turning the noun into a verb) rather than who needs no repentance.
16) Luke 18:13, "be merciful" should read "be propitious"
17) John 1:16 should read, "...grace after grace."
18) John 6:29 should read "the work God requires of you."
19) John 21:5 friends should read, "children."
20) Acts of the Apostles 2:4, tongues should read foreign languages.
21) Acts of the Apostles 13:48: When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord and as many as accepted direction to eternal life believed.
22) Acts of the Apostles 13:50 "leaders" should be italicized to indicate an addition to the text.
23) Acts of the Apostles 28:2, unusual kindness should be "love for humankind."
24) Romans 1:6 - rather than "called to belong to" should read "positionally sanctified in."
25) Romans 1:7 called to be his holy people should read "positionally sanctified as saints."
26) Romans 3:22 “through faith in Jesus” should read “through the faithfulness of Jesus”
27) Romans 3:25 sacrifice of atonement should read, "propitiatory shelter."
28) Romans 8:15, "brought your adoption to sonship should read "brought God's pledge to your promised benefits as children of God.
29) Romans 8:28 called according to his purpose should read "positionally sanctified according to His purpose."
30) Romans 12:1, "...in view of God's mercies should read "in view of God's compassions..
31) Romans 12:10, "love" should be translated "sibling love"
32) 1 Corinthians 1:2 "to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be his holy people," should read "to those positionally sanctified in Christ Jesus and set apart as His holy people.
33) 1 Corinthians 1:24 "to those who are the called" should read "to those positionally sanctified"
34) 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say all things that come from the Spirit, therefore the verse should read: The person without the Spirit does not accept some of the things of the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit,
35) 1 Corinthians 3:1: Siblings I could not speak to you as people with the Spirit, but as to people without the Spirit, as babes in Christ who have yet to learn from the Spirit.
36) 1 Corinthians 6:19 "your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you" should read "your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit in all of you.
37) 1 Corinthians 14:29 should read "Let two or three prophets speak, and the others evaluate." The NIV added "carefully" and "what is said."
38) 1 Corinthians 15:33 should read "beneficial character."
39) 1 Corinthians 16:13 "be courageous" should read, "act like men."[/QUOTE]
1) Matthew 3:11 should read, ""As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize some of you with the Holy Spirit and others with fire.
2) Matthew 5:22, 5:29, 5:30, 10:28 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
3) Matthew 11:12 should read, ""Since the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of the heavens has been forcefully sought, and forceful people are laying hold of it."
4) Matthew 11:30 should read "My yoke is beneficial."
5) Matthew 18:19, 23:15, 23:33 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
6) Matthew 25:34 “since the creation” should read "since humanity's cast down"
7) Mark 1:41 Jesus was indignant should read, "moved with anger."
8) Mark 9:43, 9:45, 9:47 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
9) Luke 6:4 should read "lawful for Priests alone."
10) Luke 6:36 be merciful, just as your Father is merciful should read be compassionate, just as your Father is compassionate
11) Luke 9:18 "praying in private" should read "praying alone"
12) Luke 10:40 "doing the work by myself" should read "doing the work alone."
13) Luke 11:50 should read "since humanity's cast down."
14) Luke 12:5, hell should read Gehenna
15) Luke 15:7 reads do not need to repent (turning the noun into a verb) rather than who needs no repentance.
16) Luke 18:13, "be merciful" should read "be propitious"
17) John 1:16 should read, "...grace after grace."
18) John 6:29 should read "the work God requires of you."
19) John 21:5 friends should read, "children."
20) Acts of the Apostles 2:4, tongues should read foreign languages.
21) Acts of the Apostles 13:48: When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord and as many as accepted direction to eternal life believed.
22) Acts of the Apostles 13:50 "leaders" should be italicized to indicate an addition to the text.
23) Acts of the Apostles 28:2, unusual kindness should be "love for humankind."
24) Romans 1:6 - rather than "called to belong to" should read "positionally sanctified in."
25) Romans 1:7 called to be his holy people should read "positionally sanctified as saints."
26) Romans 3:22 “through faith in Jesus” should read “through the faithfulness of Jesus”
27) Romans 3:25 sacrifice of atonement should read, "propitiatory shelter."
28) Romans 8:15, "brought your adoption to sonship should read "brought God's pledge to your promised benefits as children of God.
29) Romans 8:28 called according to his purpose should read "positionally sanctified according to His purpose."
30) Romans 12:1, "...in view of God's mercies should read "in view of God's compassions..
31) Romans 12:10, "love" should be translated "sibling love"
32) 1 Corinthians 1:2 "to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be his holy people," should read "to those positionally sanctified in Christ Jesus and set apart as His holy people.
33) 1 Corinthians 1:24 "to those who are the called" should read "to those positionally sanctified"
34) 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say all things that come from the Spirit, therefore the verse should read: The person without the Spirit does not accept some of the things of the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit,
35) 1 Corinthians 3:1: Siblings I could not speak to you as people with the Spirit, but as to people without the Spirit, as babes in Christ who have yet to learn from the Spirit.
36) 1 Corinthians 6:19 "your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you" should read "your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit in all of you.
37) 1 Corinthians 14:29 should read "Let two or three prophets speak, and the others evaluate." The NIV added "carefully" and "what is said."
38) 1 Corinthians 15:33 should read "beneficial character."
39) 1 Corinthians 16:13 "be courageous" should read, "act like men."[/QUOTE]
Improvements fro Consideration continued: [Part 2 or 2]
40) Galatians 2:16 should read, ""knowing that a person is not justified by the works of the Law, but by the faithfulness of Jesus Christ, we have put our faith in Christ Jesus so that we may be justified by the faithfulness of Christ, and not by the works of the Law, because by the works of the Law no one will be justified."
41) Ephesians 2:3 “deserving of wrath” should read, "children of wrath."
42) Colossians 1:28 the omission of "every man" (or every person) reduces the force of the teaching that the gospel is understandable to every person.
43) 1 Thessalonians 4:9, love for one another should read "sibling love."
44) 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to be saved should read, "for salvation."
45) 2 Thessalonians 3:6 who is idle should read, "who leads an undisciplined life"
46) 1 Timothy 3:16 appeared in the flesh should read, "revealed in the flesh."
47) Titus 2:11 "Offer" has been added which alters the message, the verse should read: For the grace of God, who provides salvation, has appeared to all people.
48) Titus 3:4 ”love” should read, "love for mankind."
49) Philemon 1:6 the verse should read as follows: "I pray that your participation in the faith may be effective in deepening your understanding of every blessing that belongs to all of you in Christ Jesus."
50) Hebrews 4:3 “since the creation should read “since humanity's cast down."
51) Hebrews 10:14 “sacrifice” should read, "offering."
52) Hebrews 10:28, "without mercy should read "without compassion"
53) Hebrews 12:17 "he could not change what he had done" should read "he could not find the occasion for repentance."
54) James 2:5 to be rich in faith should read, "yet rich in faith."
55) James 3:6, "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
56) James 5:11, "... The Lord is full of compassion and mercy" should read "The Lord is tenderhearted and full of compassion"
57) 1 Peter 2:3 should read "kindness of the Lord."
58) 1 Peter 4:6 those who are now dead should read, "those who are dead."
59) 2 Peter 2:4, "hell" should be translated "Tartarus."
60) 1 John 2:2 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
61) 1 John 4:10 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
62) Jude 1:1 "To those who have been called, who are loved in God the Father and kept for Jesus Christ" should read "To those who have been "positionally sanctified," who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ.
63) Revelation 13:8 and 17:8 "from the creation" should read, "since humanity's cast down"
40) Galatians 2:16 should read, ""knowing that a person is not justified by the works of the Law, but by the faithfulness of Jesus Christ, we have put our faith in Christ Jesus so that we may be justified by the faithfulness of Christ, and not by the works of the Law, because by the works of the Law no one will be justified."
41) Ephesians 2:3 “deserving of wrath” should read, "children of wrath."
42) Colossians 1:28 the omission of "every man" (or every person) reduces the force of the teaching that the gospel is understandable to every person.
43) 1 Thessalonians 4:9, love for one another should read "sibling love."
44) 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to be saved should read, "for salvation."
45) 2 Thessalonians 3:6 who is idle should read, "who leads an undisciplined life"
46) 1 Timothy 3:16 appeared in the flesh should read, "revealed in the flesh."
47) Titus 2:11 "Offer" has been added which alters the message, the verse should read: For the grace of God, who provides salvation, has appeared to all people.
48) Titus 3:4 ”love” should read, "love for mankind."
49) Philemon 1:6 the verse should read as follows: "I pray that your participation in the faith may be effective in deepening your understanding of every blessing that belongs to all of you in Christ Jesus."
50) Hebrews 4:3 “since the creation should read “since humanity's cast down."
51) Hebrews 10:14 “sacrifice” should read, "offering."
52) Hebrews 10:28, "without mercy should read "without compassion"
53) Hebrews 12:17 "he could not change what he had done" should read "he could not find the occasion for repentance."
54) James 2:5 to be rich in faith should read, "yet rich in faith."
55) James 3:6, "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
56) James 5:11, "... The Lord is full of compassion and mercy" should read "The Lord is tenderhearted and full of compassion"
57) 1 Peter 2:3 should read "kindness of the Lord."
58) 1 Peter 4:6 those who are now dead should read, "those who are dead."
59) 2 Peter 2:4, "hell" should be translated "Tartarus."
60) 1 John 2:2 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
61) 1 John 4:10 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
62) Jude 1:1 "To those who have been called, who are loved in God the Father and kept for Jesus Christ" should read "To those who have been "positionally sanctified," who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ.
63) Revelation 13:8 and 17:8 "from the creation" should read, "since humanity's cast down"
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
Hmmm... Let's review. Van likes to repeat himself for emphasis. Follow this. Here are his repetitious posts in this thread alone (he has done it numerous times on many threads in the past decade).
#4) 1-43
#6) 1-39
#7) 40-63
#41) 1-39
#42) 40-63
#67) 1-39
#68) 40-63
#93) 1-39
#94) 40-63
Post. Rinse. Repeat.
#4) 1-43
#6) 1-39
#7) 40-63
#41) 1-39
#42) 40-63
#67) 1-39
#68) 40-63
#93) 1-39
#94) 40-63
Post. Rinse. Repeat.
As I see it, while the posts are on the same topic, they are just multipart posts. They are not repeats of a previous post. if you don't like them skip over them or put Van on ignore.
RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
You have not been paying attention. Of course they are repeats of prior posts of his.
I don't read all the threads. Please point out the location of these other threads. Van isn't the only member with a bete noir on a given topic. I see them all the time in the C/A forum and dealing with the KJVO debate.
Thanks, plus the charge is a material false statement, as the posts reflect updates.
Consolidated Potential Improvements in the NIV's Translation of the New Testament [Part 1 or 2]
1) Matthew 3:11 should read, ""As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize some of you with the Holy Spirit and others with fire.
2) Matthew 5:22, 5:29, 5:30, 10:28 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
3) Matthew 11:12 should read, ""Since the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of the heavens has been forcefully sought, and forceful people are laying hold of it."
4) Matthew 11:30 should read "My yoke is beneficial."
5) Matthew 18:19, 23:15, 23:33 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
6) Matthew 25:34 “since the creation” should read "since humanity's subjugation"
7) Mark 1:41 Jesus was indignant should read, "moved with anger."
8) Mark 9:43, 9:45, 9:47 "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
9) Luke 6:4 should read "lawful for Priests alone."
10) Luke 6:36 be merciful, just as your Father is merciful should read be compassionate, just as your Father is compassionate
11) Luke 9:18 "praying in private" should read "praying alone"
12) Luke 10:40 "doing the work by myself" should read "doing the work alone."
13) Luke 11:50 should read "since humanity's subjugation."
14) Luke 12:5, hell should read Gehenna
15) Luke 15:7 reads do not need to repent (turning the noun into a verb) rather than who needs no repentance.
16) Luke 18:13, "be merciful" should read "be propitious"
17) John 1:16 should read, "...grace after grace."
18) John 6:29 should read "the work God requires of you."
19) John 21:5 friends should read, "children."
20) Acts of the Apostles 2:4, tongues should read foreign languages.
21) Acts of the Apostles 13:48: When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord and as many as accepted direction to eternal life believed.
22) Acts of the Apostles 13:50 "leaders" should be italicized to indicate an addition to the text.
23) Acts of the Apostles 28:2, unusual kindness should be "love for humankind."
24) Romans 1:6 - rather than "called to belong to" should read "positionally sanctified in."
25) Romans 1:7 called to be his holy people should read "positionally sanctified as saints."
26) Romans 3:22 “through faith in Jesus” should read “through the faithfulness of Jesus”
27) Romans 3:25 sacrifice of atonement should read, "propitiatory shelter."
28) Romans 8:15, "brought your adoption to sonship should read "brought God's pledge to your promised benefits as children of God.
29) Romans 8:28 called according to his purpose should read "positionally sanctified according to His purpose."
30) Romans 12:1, "...in view of God's mercies should read "in view of God's compassions..
31) Romans 12:10, "love" should be translated "sibling love"
32) 1 Corinthians 1:2 "to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be his holy people," should read "to those positionally sanctified in Christ Jesus and set apart as His holy people.
33) 1 Corinthians 1:24 "to those who are the called" should read "to those positionally sanctified"
34) 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say all things that come from the Spirit, therefore the verse should read: The person without the Spirit does not accept some of the things of the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit,
35) 1 Corinthians 3:1: Siblings I could not speak to you as people with the Spirit, but as to people without the Spirit, as babes in Christ who have yet to learn from the Spirit.
36) 1 Corinthians 6:19 "your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you" should read "your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit in all of you.
37) 1 Corinthians 14:29 should read "Let two or three prophets speak, and the others evaluate." The NIV added "carefully" and "what is said."
38) 1 Corinthians 15:33 should read "beneficial character."
39) 1 Corinthians 16:13 "be courageous" should read, "act like men."
Improvements fro Consideration continued: [Part 2 or 2]
40) Galatians 2:16 should read, ""knowing that a person is not justified by the works of the Law, but by the faithfulness of Jesus Christ, we have put our faith in Christ Jesus so that we may be justified by the faithfulness of Christ, and not by the works of the Law, because by the works of the Law no one will be justified."
41) Ephesians 2:3 “deserving of wrath” should read, "children of wrath."
42) Colossians 1:28 the omission of "every man" (or every person) reduces the force of the teaching that the gospel is understandable to every person.
43) 1 Thessalonians 4:9, love for one another should read "sibling love."
44) 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to be saved should read, "for salvation."
45) 2 Thessalonians 3:6 who is idle should read, "who leads an undisciplined life"
46) 1 Timothy 3:16 appeared in the flesh should read, "revealed in the flesh."
47) Titus 2:11 "Offer" has been added which alters the message, the verse should read: For the grace of God, who provides salvation, has appeared to all people.
48) Titus 3:4 ”love” should read, "love for mankind."
49) Philemon 1:6 the verse should read as follows: "I pray that your participation in the faith may be effective in deepening your understanding of every blessing that belongs to all of you in Christ Jesus."
50) Hebrews 4:3 “since the creation should read “since humanity's subjugation."
51) Hebrews 10:14 “sacrifice” should read, "offering."
52) Hebrews 10:28, "without mercy should read "without compassion"
53) Hebrews 12:17 "he could not change what he had done" should read "he could not find the occasion for repentance."
54) James 2:5 to be rich in faith should read, "yet rich in faith."
55) James 3:6, "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
56) James 5:11, "... The Lord is full of compassion and mercy" should read "The Lord is tenderhearted and full of compassion"
57) 1 Peter 2:3 should read "kindness of the Lord."
58) 1 Peter 4:6 those who are now dead should read, "those who are dead."
59) 2 Peter 2:4, "hell" should be translated "Tartarus."
60) 1 John 2:2 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
61) 1 John 4:10 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
62) Jude 1:1 "To those who have been called, who are loved in God the Father and kept for Jesus Christ" should read "To those who have been "positionally sanctified," who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ.
63) Revelation 13:8 and 17:8 "from the creation" should read, "since humanity's subjugation."
40) Galatians 2:16 should read, ""knowing that a person is not justified by the works of the Law, but by the faithfulness of Jesus Christ, we have put our faith in Christ Jesus so that we may be justified by the faithfulness of Christ, and not by the works of the Law, because by the works of the Law no one will be justified."
41) Ephesians 2:3 “deserving of wrath” should read, "children of wrath."
42) Colossians 1:28 the omission of "every man" (or every person) reduces the force of the teaching that the gospel is understandable to every person.
43) 1 Thessalonians 4:9, love for one another should read "sibling love."
44) 2 Thessalonians 2:13 to be saved should read, "for salvation."
45) 2 Thessalonians 3:6 who is idle should read, "who leads an undisciplined life"
46) 1 Timothy 3:16 appeared in the flesh should read, "revealed in the flesh."
47) Titus 2:11 "Offer" has been added which alters the message, the verse should read: For the grace of God, who provides salvation, has appeared to all people.
48) Titus 3:4 ”love” should read, "love for mankind."
49) Philemon 1:6 the verse should read as follows: "I pray that your participation in the faith may be effective in deepening your understanding of every blessing that belongs to all of you in Christ Jesus."
50) Hebrews 4:3 “since the creation should read “since humanity's subjugation."
51) Hebrews 10:14 “sacrifice” should read, "offering."
52) Hebrews 10:28, "without mercy should read "without compassion"
53) Hebrews 12:17 "he could not change what he had done" should read "he could not find the occasion for repentance."
54) James 2:5 to be rich in faith should read, "yet rich in faith."
55) James 3:6, "hell" should be translated as "Gehenna."
56) James 5:11, "... The Lord is full of compassion and mercy" should read "The Lord is tenderhearted and full of compassion"
57) 1 Peter 2:3 should read "kindness of the Lord."
58) 1 Peter 4:6 those who are now dead should read, "those who are dead."
59) 2 Peter 2:4, "hell" should be translated "Tartarus."
60) 1 John 2:2 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
61) 1 John 4:10 atoning sacrifice should read, "propitiation."
62) Jude 1:1 "To those who have been called, who are loved in God the Father and kept for Jesus Christ" should read "To those who have been "positionally sanctified," who are loved by God the Father and kept by Jesus Christ.
63) Revelation 13:8 and 17:8 "from the creation" should read, "since humanity's subjugation."
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