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Reformed Salvation

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SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

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Most of the replies on this thread, have moved away from the OP, which is that REPENTING for salvation, is NOT a WORK, which I have been falsely accused of. The Reformed theologians that I have quoted from, and many others, AGREE with what I have been saying for many months here on BB, though those who claim to be "reformed", will still argue with their OWN theologians.
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
George Antonios said:
Really? Should I get circumcised? Should I avoid seafood? Should I avoid mixed clothing? Should I be under the law? Should I go worship in Jerusalem?
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dude, the OP is limited, and ONLY this should be discussed here! If you have something to say on the OP, then please do so.
 
Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
AustinC said:
Here's how I interpret your statement.
You think it odd that God's gracious choice to save me happened before I believed that he saved me.
Instead, you seem to think that a person who is dead in trespasses and sins must believe that Jesus saved him, before Jesus actually saves him.

To answer your second question.
I don't need faith for God to graciously save me. God gives me faith, once he has saved me, so that by faith I am justified through Christ's atoning payment for my sin.
The last statement tells you why Jesus went to the cross. He died to atone for my sin.

It is odd that you think a human must do something before God can do anything to save them. What you believe is not grace in any way, shape or form.
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You should read your bible without the Calvinist glasses it would help in your understanding of the text.
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit

"Regeneration" is from the Greek, παλιγγενεσία, which is litearlly BORN AGAIN

So, being SAVED is BORIN AGAIN (REGENERATION).
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Being born again--in John 3--is in the passive. So, it is done to you, not by you.

The Archangel
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
so, the ability to not obey, is the same as "to sin". so what you say in # 81 is moot!
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Hardly. There is a fundamental difference between the ability to obey and the ability to not obey before the fall and after the fall. After the fall, there is no longer the ability to obey and the ability to not obey. After the fall is no ability not to sin.

Your entire line of "reasoning" seems to view the Bible as jumping from Genesis 2 to Genesis 4, completely skipping what happens in Genesis 3.

The Archangel
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
where did I say otherwise? the sinner first must repent and believe, and then the Holy Spirit saves.
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Here:
SavedByGrace said:
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit

"Regeneration" is from the Greek, παλιγγενεσία, which is litearlly BORN AGAIN

So, being SAVED is BORIN AGAIN (REGENERATION).
Click to expand...

You are claiming that "regeneration" is something that is done by us. You make it more clear here:

SavedByGrace said:
where did I say otherwise? the sinner first must repent and believe, and then the Holy Spirit saves.
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The problem is--according to John 3--being born again is not something you do; it is something done to you. The use of the passive voice in John 3 makes this quite clear.

The Archangel
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
The Archangel said:
After the fall, there is no longer the ability to obey and the ability to not obey. After the fall is no ability not to si
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Really, and where in the Bible do do read this? "After the fall is no ability not to sin"?

Sounds like your theology, and not Scripture. After the fall, man can still OBEY and DISOBEY, there is not a single verse in the Bible that agrees with what you say. If there is, post this here
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
The Archangel said:
Here:


You are claiming that "regeneration" is something that is done by us. You make it more clear here:



The problem is--according to John 3--being born again is not something you do; it is something done to you. The use of the passive voice in John 3 makes this quite clear.

The Archangel
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Wrong again! I am pointing out, that the English word "regeneration" in Titus 3:5, literally means "born-again". Paul here speaks of being "saved" the same as being "born-again".

I don't know where you get me saying, ""regeneration" is something that is done by us?
 
I

Iconoclast

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The Archangel said:
Here:


You are claiming that "regeneration" is something that is done by us. You make it more clear here:



The problem is--according to John 3--being born again is not something you do; it is something done to you. The use of the passive voice in John 3 makes this quite clear.

The Archangel
Click to expand...
yes he is posting that and thinks he is not by rewording it.
Thanks for clarifying it.
 
DaveXR650

DaveXR650

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
I might KNOW that my best friend will kill someone, this does not mean that I CAUSED him to do it!
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If you had created you, your friend, and the victim and they all lived moment by moment only because you allowed them to, and if you could foresee and change a host of things at any time to prevent it then yes - you did ordain it in the way the reformers meant it. You did not directly cause it but that is not what they said. Some people try to have a coherent theology but you don't so in a way you have an advantage. The only way to truly vindicate God in the way you set things up is to say he didn't know what was going to happen. You will just deny that and you can because you sling random ideas around while claiming some higher knowledge. You are proving the need for some type of systemic theology, some kind of organized teaching, and you are showing the dangers of private interpretation.
 
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