Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
I'm defending the Gospel, the Cross and saving efficacy of Hs Cross, which you oppose strongly.
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They deny the Saving Efficacy of the Death of Christ !
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Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
@Charlie24
Yes it is. The Peace Christ accomplished on the Cross is Salvation Peace Isa 53:5
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
The Peace is Healing/Salvation, you deny it as well ?
Yes it is. The Peace Christ accomplished on the Cross is Salvation Peace Isa 53:5
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.
The Peace is Healing/Salvation, you deny it as well ?
I certainly do deny the mere fact of Christ dying on the Cross saves everyone!
2 Thes. 2:10
"And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved."
Do you understand what this means?
BF, Christ dying on the the Cross will profit you nothing if you don't repent and believe!
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
So you deny His Death saved them He died for, and secured their peace/healing/salvation, that's terrible. And nobody said His death saved everyone, but everyone He died for. If a person isn't saved, its because He wasn't bruised for them, chastised for them.
Men of understanding wrote concerning Isa 53:5
The reason anyone is not saved is because they would not receive the truth, as Paul said.
This junk of God choosing some for heaven and some for Hell with man having no choice is a ball-faced lie!
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
False, when Christ didn't die for one, they aren't healed in order to believe and they have no peace with God. Christs healing death brings about all the converting graces as faith and repentance. See receiving the truth is a spiritual activity. Natural men cannot receive the things of the Spirit of God 1 Cor 2:14 in fact his mind is enmity against God and so the things of God Rom 8:7
Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
That enmity must be healed first! Thats provided in the Death of Christ Isa 53:5
"With His stripes we are healed" means we are healed from the results of sin.
But no one can be healed from the results of sin without repenting and believing.
If you can't believe Paul, that those who perish will perish because they would not receive the truth, then there's nothing I can say.
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Being lost in sin is the result of sin, so healing heals from being lost in sin. Duh
With no repentance, no believing? Where does this come into your theology?
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
You say Jesus death on the Cross saved no one. Why does Paul say his boast is in the cross Gal 6 14
But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I said no one was saved at the cross BF, that is biblical. We have our sins covered at the cross {1Jn 2:2} but we are saved by His life, {Rom 5:10} which is also biblical.
Have you read this before BF. I am sure you have as I have posted it, but here it is again. Perhaps this time you will actually believe it.
1Co 15:16 For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen.
1Co 15:17 And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins!
Rom_5:10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life.
Christ's death on the cross made it possible for the whole world to be saved but only those that freely trust in Him will be saved.
Actually I believe the gospel of our salvation.
1Co 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand,
1Co 15:2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you; unless you believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
1Co 15:4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures,
Note what it says BF. "BY WHICH YOU ARE SAVED"
1] He died
2] He was buried
3] He rose again
You hold to point one and ignore 2 & 3 as they do not fit your man-made religion.
Odd that you point to Rom 10:15 but ignore
Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
There it is again faith in the risen Christ saves.
You ask how can we have peace with God without being saved and point to Eph 2:17. BF we have been told how to have peace with God.
Eph 1:13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 1:14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
So you see all you have to do is read things in context and it will clear up any number of your errors that you have because or the man-made religion you follow.
You just dodge everything that gets to the point!
Going right back to Scripture that doesn't apply to anything in conversation
Just a waste of time.
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
Brightfame52
Well-Known Member
You say Jesus death on the Cross saved no one. Why does Paul say his boast is in the cross Gal 6 14
But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
So, all Scripture is profitable, except Leviticus?
I am a Jew inwardly, and my circumcision is of the heart. I am a child of Abraham by faith. That is the real kind of Jew, according Paul. Not only that, but I am part of a holy priesthood, serving in the true tabernacle, offering up spiritual sacrifices.
Moses' work was a testimony and pattern of the work Christ would do. How can you claim to know anything about the Atonement of Christ, if you refuse to be instructed by the model of it?
Unwilling to compromise about the Word of God indeed...
Because you can't show me Egypt's stone on the breastplate of the high priest, you can't say that anyone but the elect, however you define them, have their sins removed by the Atonement of Christ.
You're getting there.
So your still under the old covenant from what you say as you keep point back to the OT.
The law was our tutor but it could never save. You should know that but it appears that you do not.
I am unwilling to compromise the word of God, that is why I am not of the C/R religion.
This has got to be the most illogical thing I have seen you post "Because you can't show me Egypt's stone on the breastplate of the high priest, you can't say that anyone but the elect, however you define them, have their sins removed by the Atonement of Christ."
Actually no one had their sins removed at the cross, but all had their sins covered and thus could be saved by God through faith in His son. Those that have trusted in Jesus are then in Christ the "Elect One" and then are elect. You make the error of thinking one is elect before they are in Christ, but that is just another of the errors of that man-made religion from the 4th century.
But then again you do believe a number of unfounded things.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Why do you continue to deny the word of God BF?
Can't reason with someone who doesn't want to see the truth.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
BF when will you ever learn to read things in context. It will save you from making so many mistakes.
Gal 6:13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
Gal 6:14 But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.
Paul was making a comparison between boast in ones own ability to gain salvation through the law and one trusting in Christ for their salvation.
Trusting in the cross is trusting in the whole gospel not just part of it BF. Christ covered our sins at the cross and we can be saved by trusting in the risen Christ.
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference;
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed,
Rom 3:26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
No BF what you are defending is a religion that started in the 4th century with Augustine bringing pagan philosophy into the church.
You continue to deny clear scripture and keep posting out of context verses in the attempt to support your religion.
I am sorry if the truth offends you BF. Quite frankly I do pray that God will open your eyes to the truth of His word.
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