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Refuse To Be Baptized?
- Thread starter Baptizo
- Start date
Where is here?
37818
Well-Known Member
Good point. I missed that passage.
How do you get from Peter telling people in the NT that they must be baptized, to saying that applies to all who believe, that they must decide to be baptized? There are many cases in the Bible where a man of God commands an individual or a group of people to do something (or not to), yet that command is not applicable to all believers. For example, Jesus told a young Jewish man to sell all he had (Matt. 19:21). Is that applicable to all? In Matthew 10, Jesus gave specific commands to the apostles: don't take money, or a change of clothing, etc., and do not rent a place to live. Should I have followed those directions when I took my family to serve God in Japan?
And do you agree with my point that the Great Commission in Matthew 28 commands the soul winner to disciple the new believer to baptism? This actually works just fine, unless you are one who does not believe in discipling a new believer. (There are people like that; I'm not saying you are one.)
In general you have a good point here. If someone refuses to be baptized because of laziness or giving other shallow excuses, the soul winner must do further work to determine if they are truly saved.
Having said that, I believe there are reasons why someone might not want to be baptized right away. For example, in Japan and other Buddhist countries, the new believer will often be kicked out of the family home if they publicly confess Christ through baptism. I know of several cases where this happened. So fear might be a factor in waiting to be baptized, and the new believer must be carefully and compassionately discipled until he or she is willing to be baptized. In a Muslim culture, the Quran commands that an "apostate," someone who becomes a Christian, must be killed. So in a Muslim culture it may be even tougher to get a new believer to be baptized! Fear is a powerful negative motivator.
KJB1611reader
Member
I
can't tell thee... just pray. The only Baptist church in this country is so far away.
KJB1611reader
Member
Also, the church is run by a woman...
Also, why do I need to be baptized to do communion and I heard they use wine?
Also, I don't want to be baptized in a false church. Still seeing if they are Lordship or not.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I think you missed what I was saying. All your arguments are from a human perspective.
It is a matter of what is in your heart that matters. The question is are you willing to make that public confession of faith in Christ Jesus. It is not by whom or how but if.
You do know that the first miracle that Christ performed was to turn water into wine?
Just attempting to tease out a deeper understanding if you have one.
Church membership means that I am a member of Christ in good standing with the other members of His body, and baptism is the rite given by God by which we formally enter into union or covenant with Him and His people. Baptism doesn't save, but we can't one as a member who won't humble himself to submit to it.
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How old are you?
37818
Well-Known Member
Another debate, was it made as fresh or fermented juice?
John 2:10, . . . but thou hast kept the good wine until now.
Because you haven't formally entered into union with Christ and His church.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
So your saying that being a member of a JW or Mormon church means you are "a member of Christ in good standing with the other members of His body"?
So now you are putting works {baptism} as a qualification for being a Christian. So salvation in your religion is actually works based.
37818
Well-Known Member
It is an argument upon which the written word of God is explicitly silent.
Heck of a leap there, brother,
. You can jump, and that's no joke.
In the church, the real church, everything must be done decently and in order. Baptism and The Lord's Supper are its two ordinances, and Christ requires that we observe them and maintain their significance.
This doesn't look silent to me.
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. - Romans 6:3-4 KJV
Why else are Christians preached to in Romans (6 especially) to not live in sin that they are dead to?
I’m not telling you to stop washing feet, but if you don’t serve the people whose feet you are washing you missed the point. I’m not saying that you missed the point unless the shoe fits. I personally don’t consider foot washing an ordinance. I do consider important to take care of the less pleasant needs of the brethren.
The Ethiopian was not in a church and Phillip didn’t refuse to baptize him if he wouldn’t join his church.
37818
Well-Known Member
I concur it to be a valid implication. That believers who were instructed to do the observance would have been baptized believers. My other argument would still be true.
Neither observances are matters in order to be saved.