No person can come to Christ by their own freewill ! 2

[cjab]

@cjab



It iis foolish talk. Thats what the scriptures are for, to search them, from context to context and find truths that compliment one another. The Holy Spirit is author of the entire volume.

Here is one of the few places where many commentators agree with Calvin:

Calvin on 1 Cor 2:13 "Spiritual things with spiritual Sunkrinesthai (a philosophical term meaning "combination") is used here, I have no doubt, in the sense of adapt. This is sometimes the meaning of the word, [123] (as Budaeus shows by a quotation from Aristotle,)and hence sunkrima is used to mean what is knit together or glued together, and certainly it suits much better with Paul's context than compare or liken, as others have rendered it. He says then that he adapts spiritual things to spiritual, in accommodating the words to the subject; [124] that is, he tempers that heavenly wisdom of the Spirit with a simple style of speech, and of such a nature as carries in its front the native energy of the Spirit. In the meantime he reproves others, who, by an affected elegance of expression and show of refinement, endeavor to obtain the applause of men, as persons who are either devoid of solid truth, or, by unbecoming ornaments, corrupt the spiritual doctrine of God."

Still completely lost on what your point is.

 

[Brightfame52]

BF you seem to be moving in the right direction at least.

We are drawn by the power of God be it through His creation, conviction of sin, the gospel message etc.

But man being drawn does not mean saved. Many who are drawn will reject God. All you have to do is look around BF. How many have heard the gospel message and yet reject the salvation that He offers?

But you are correct when you say God in us is salvation. That is biblical. What is also biblical is that Christ is only in us when we have freely trusted in Him then He indwells us not before.

Maybe you can receive the truth, Drawing is Salvation work begun in a person. Drawing is regeneration. Everyone Christ died for and took away their sins and debt before God, they are given Life, and that is the drawing, and brings them to believe in Him. Once drawing starts, its a wrap, you saved

 

[Brightfame52]

Here is one of the few places where many commentators agree with Calvin:

Calvin on 1 Cor 2:13 "Spiritual things with spiritual Sunkrinesthai (a philosophical term meaning "combination") is used here, I have no doubt, in the sense of adapt. This is sometimes the meaning of the word, [123] (as Budaeus shows by a quotation from Aristotle,)and hence sunkrima is used to mean what is knit together or glued together, and certainly it suits much better with Paul's context than compare or liken, as others have rendered it. He says then that he adapts spiritual things to spiritual, in accommodating the words to the subject; [124] that is, he tempers that heavenly wisdom of the Spirit with a simple style of speech, and of such a nature as carries in its front the native energy of the Spirit. In the meantime he reproves others, who, by an affected elegance of expression and show of refinement, endeavor to obtain the applause of men, as persons who are either devoid of solid truth, or, by unbecoming ornaments, corrupt the spiritual doctrine of God."

Still completely lost on what your point is.

You not listening, when a person is provided scripture that refute their views, they always make context a excuse, then they will turn around later when they make a scripture point, they extract a scripture from another context. Its a debate tatic to win a debate.

 

[Silverhair]

Maybe you can receive the truth, Drawing is Salvation work begun in a person. Drawing is regeneration. Everyone Christ died for and took away their sins and debt before God, they are given Life, and that is the drawing, and brings them to believe in Him. Once drawing starts, its a wrap, you saved

BF you were starting in the right direction then you fell of the truck and said this "Once drawing starts, its a wrap, you saved"

Drawing does not save anyone BF. All are drawn by Christ but not all are saved. That should cause you to see the error of your position but you continue to post false claims that can only come from a man-made religion.

Since God desires all to be saved and Christ draws all then by your view all should be saved as for you drawing = salvation.

Are all saved BF or do many reject God?

You are trusting is a philosophy that came from pagan teachings which augustine brought into the church and calvin and others have carried forward to this day. What they taught and what calvinism still teaches is not biblical salvation.

 

[Dave...]

Yes the Gospel is definitely meant. The Gospel in 1 Cor 2 is the deep things of God, His purposes and counsels are Gospel Truths and hidden from the natural man.

Jesus told Peter that it was of special revelation from the Father that he could even acknowledge Him as the Christ the Son of God, it wasn't natural Matt 16:17

16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Now John Gill on 1 Cor 2 10

Bright

There is context to consider. If we interpret every passage on an island, then we must also conclude that Peter was not saved, since he denied Jesus three times and Jesus said that anyone who denies Him before man, He will deny that person before the Father. And we must also conclude that Peter is Satan, "step back Satan".

There's always context. That was a unique point in time. In fact, one might ask, was Peter saved when that happened? He already believed. He followed Jesus to make him a fisher of men, remember? In Fact, all the evidence in Scripture points to the fact that Peter was already a devout OT believer. The Gospel was being veiled to those who were perishing. It was a judicial hardening, yet they could still believe. Jesus spoke in parables so no one would understand. That was judicial also. Yet they could still believe. Even the Disciples needed Jesus to explain the parables, including Peter. Pentecost was when they received the Spirit of God, thus they could spiritually discern the deeper truths per 1 Cor. 2:10.

Remember, the Gospel is foolishness to those who are perishing. One must understand the Gospel message to perceive it as foolishness.

Dave

 

[Brightfame52]

BF you were starting in the right direction then you fell of the truck and said this "Once drawing starts, its a wrap, you saved"

Drawing does not save anyone BF. All are drawn by Christ but not all are saved. That should cause you to see the error of your position but you continue to post false claims that can only come from a man-made religion.

Since God desires all to be saved and Christ draws all then by your view all should be saved as for you drawing = salvation.

Are all saved BF or do many reject God?

You are trusting is a philosophy that came from pagan teachings which augustine brought into the church and calvin and others have carried forward to this day. What they taught and what calvinism still teaches is not biblical salvation.

Everyone Christ died for, He gives them eternal life, when its imparted in them by new birth, the drawing begins. Your not being drawed and dont have eternal life in you.

Now all dont have eternal life, so all have not been drawn by Christ having been lifted up for them.

Drawing does not save anyone BF

The drawing is the application of salvation of all Christ saves.

 

[Brightfame52]

@Dave...

Bright

There is context to consider

It has been, its all about the Gospel, the Cross and its mysteries of 1 Cor 2:1-2

And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.

2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

 

[Silverhair]

Everyone Christ died for, He gives them eternal life, when its imparted in them by new birth, the drawing begins. Your not being drawed and dont have eternal life in you.

Now all dont have eternal life, so all have not been drawn by Christ having been lifted up for them.


The drawing is the application of salvation of all Christ saves.

You are trying to prove a pagan philosophy is biblical.

 

[Brightfame52]

You are trying to prove a pagan philosophy is biblical.

Is that what you call Gods Truth ?

 

[cjab]

You not listening, when a person is provided scripture that refute their views, they always make context a excuse, then they will turn around later when they make a scripture point, they extract a scripture from another context. Its a debate tatic to win a debate.

Thank you for showing to me that you are not a serious debater. At least I will refrain from wasting any more of my time with you.

 

[Brightfame52]

Thank you for showing to me that you are not a serious debater. At least I will refrain from wasting any more of my time with you.

Everything I have shown you , you cry about it. So take care

 

[Silverhair]

Is that what you call Gods Truth ?

That is what I call the false religion that you are trying to say is God's truth.

Do some research for yourself and see what the foundations of the calvinist philosophy is BF.

Augustine brought what became calvinism into the church from pagan teachings in the 4 century and calvin and others just carried it forward to today.

 

[Silverhair]

You not listening, when a person is provided scripture that refute their views, they always make context a excuse, then they will turn around later when they make a scripture point, they extract a scripture from another context. Its a debate tatic to win a debate.

BF you really do not understand what is meant by looking at the context do you.

When you, BF, post a verse that is not supported by the surrounding verses in which it is found then you are ignoring the context.

If I post a verse that is supported by the surrounding verses in which it is found then I am in agreement with the context.

It is not necessary to post a chapter or paragraph to make a point but the verses that you post need to be supported by the contextual verses in which it is found. This is something that you do not do.

 

[Van]

When someone claims the "context" rewrites the meaning of a verse, they are just using a meaningless word to justify nullifying the verse.

Nearly all of the "context, context, context claimers do not seem to even know how to study a passage and determine the immediate context.

One poster claimed the context of Romans requires the interpretation that Esau and Jacob (Romans 9) were chosen unconditionally for salvation. But this is absurd, as they were chosen to lead two nations, and additionally they were conditionally chosen so the older would serve the younger, demonstrating the traditions of people do not necessarily reflect God's purpose and plan.