All Israel Will be Saved. Romans 11:26

[Covenanter]

Morning good sir.

Why do the Jews get blessed first? On what grounds?

Why call me "good ...?"

Peter answered your question in the Scripture I quoted:

Acts 3:26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.’​

 

[Jope]

Why call me "good ...?"

Peter answered your question in the Scripture I quoted:

Acts 3:26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.’​

#Eisegesis

Why call me "good ...?"

Cuz you're bad?

 

[Yeshua1]

I thought by that you meant spiritual Israel comprises saved Jews together with saved Gentiles, so that spiritual Israel, aka the Israel of God, is the church. I was ready to agree with your post, until I saw the next two posts.


I didn't see Y was making a distinction. Now I see that you see he sees a distinction.



There has always been a spiritual Israel, that God calls my people expressed by the covenant relationship: I will be their God, and they will be my people.

God says of rebellious Israel:

Hos. 1:9 Then the Lord said, ‘Call him Lo-Ammi (which means “not my people”), for you are not my people, and I am not your God.
10 ‘Yet the Israelites will be like the sand on the seashore, which cannot be measured or counted. In the place where it was said to them, “You are not my people”, they will be called “children of the living God”.​

See Rom. 9:24-26
And he says of his redeemed, both Jew & Gentile:

Rom. 9:
24 even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles? 25 As he says in Hosea:
‘I will call them “my people” who are not my people;
and I will call her “my loved one” who is not my loved one,’
26 and,
‘In the very place where it was said to them,
“You are not my people,”
there they will be called “children of the living God.”’
​

Notice the fulfilment of the covenant of peace:

Eze. 37:26 I will make a covenant of peace with them; it will be an everlasting covenant. I will establish them and increase their numbers, and I will put my sanctuary among them for ever. 27 My dwelling-place will be with them; I will be their God, and they will be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I the Lord make Israel holy, when my sanctuary is among them for ever.”’

Rev. 21:1 Then I saw ‘a new heaven and a new earth,’ for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, ‘Look! God’s dwelling-place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.​

There is no distinction between redeemed Israel & the church. We are one redeemed people of God, :

Gal. 3:26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptised into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.​

Paul seems to contrast between lost and saved jews, as he calls those saved as now being spiritual israel, and the lost as israel after the flesh... Spiritual Israel is in the Church, as are saved Gentiles!

 

[Yeshua1]

Tell that to the world at large.:

Christian Zionism: Dispensationalism And The Roots Of Sectarian Theology
(an excellent read by the way)

"Karen Armstrong is not alone in tracing within dispensationalism evidence of the legacy of the Crusades. They have, she claims, 'returned to a classical and extreme religious crusading.'[[116]] Rosemary Radford Ruether also sees the danger of this kind of fundamentalism in its, 'dualistic, Manichaean view of global politics - America and Israel together against an evil world.'[[117]] Kenneth Cragg comments satirically,

It is so; God chose the Jews; the land is theirs by divine gift. These dicta cannot be questioned or resisted. They are final. Such verdicts come infallibly from Christian biblicists for whom Israel can do no wrong-thus fortified. But can such positivism, this unquestioning finality, be compatible with the integrity of the prophets themselves? It certainly cannot square with the open peoplehood under God which is the crux of New Testament faith. Nor can it well be reconciled with the ethical demands central to law and election alike... Chosenness cannot properly be either an ethnic exclusivism or a political facility.[[118]]

The Middle East Council of Churches which represents the indigenous and ancient Oriental and Eastern Churches, has also been highly critical of the activities of dispensationalists.

[They] ...force the Zionist model of theocratic and ethnocentric nationalism on the Middle East... [rejecting]... the movement of Christian unity and inter-religious understanding which is promoted by the churches in the region. The Christian Zionist programme, with its elevation of modern political Zionism, provides the Christian with a world view where the gospel is identified with the ideology of success and militarism. It places its emphasis on events leading up to the end of history rather than living Christ's love and justice today.[[119]]

Clarence Bass makes this assessment of dispensationalism.

No part of historic Christian doctrine supports this radical distinction between church and kingdom. To be sure they are not identical; but dispensationalism has added the idea that the kingdom was to be a restoration of Israel, not a consummation of the church... In the light of this principle, it is legitimate to ask whether dispensationalism is not orientated more from the Abrahamic Covenant than from the Cross. Is not its focus centred more on the Jewish kingdom than on the Body of Christ? Does it not interpret the New Testament in the light of Old Testament prophecies, instead of interpreting those prophecies in the light of the more complete revelation of the New Testament?[[120]]

Whether intentionally or otherwise, dispensationalism is being used today to give theological justification to what the United Nations regards as racism[[121]] and the denial of basic human rights; supporting the ethnic-cleansing of Palestinians from their historic lands; endorsing the building of Jewish settlements in the Occupied Territories; inciting religious fanaticism by supporting the rebuilding of a Jewish Temple on Mount Moriah; dismissing moderate Jewish opinion willing to negotiate land for peace; and advocating an apocalyptic eschatology likely to become a self-fulfilling prophecy."

Seeing that God still has a plan for national israel does not make one anythingother than agreeing with what the Bible states on this issue!

 

[Covenanter]

#Eisegesis

No. Inspired history. The Jews were blessed first - at Pentecost.

 

[Yeshua1]

I believe that the second covenant completely replaced the first and in replacement theology in which the promises made under the first covenant are now made to Christ's church. The Jews must be saved in the same way all the rest of us are saved, by grace through faith and following through with a lifelong personal relationship with Jesus. They have no special arrangement anymore. This is supported by the gospel but I won't get into the detail;s yet.

All jews are saved the same fashion as all Gentiles are, but the Bible does support that God will still deal with savign nationalm israel at His second coming!

 

[Yeshua1]

That would be hyper dispensationalism, quite different from dispensationalism.

Yes,as they would basically just have the pauline epistles as Inspired to us for today!

 

[Jope]

TYou might have quoted this to support your assertions:

Mat. 23: 39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, “Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.”’​

possibly implying that they would see him again in the future as a nation when they recognise he is indeed Messiah.
No. He has a Gospel that his Apostles will proclaim, and they must acknowledge Jesus as Lord for salvation - as Peter preached at Pentecost.
Many thousands of Jews did indeed recognise him for their salvation.

Acts 3:21 does not stand alone - it is a verse of a sermon. Peter warns the Jews by quoting Moses' warning. He is then very specific as he quotes the promise to Abraham:

Acts 3:24 ‘Indeed, beginning with Samuel, all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days. 25 And you are heirs of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers. He said to Abraham, “Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.” 26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.’​

Peter confirms that all the prophets have foretold these days. Dare they reject the wonderful promises now being fulfilled by the risen Lord Jesus through his Apostles?
All peoples on earth will be blessed, beginning with the Jews.

Romans 11 is the subject of the whole thread. It assures the salvation of all Israel on repentance, but that does not imply the salvation of the whole nation.

Hey there bad sir. I just had a question, when you're stating that all peoples on earth will be blessed, beginning with the Jews, do you mean to say that, in the future millennium (if you are postmillennial) the Jews will be blessed first? That is what I interpreted your position to be and that is what I was responding to. I see that your statement lends itself to many interpretations though, and I'm not sure if you're postmillennial or amillennial? Are you stating that the Jews were blessed first? Because that's different from saying that the Jews will, in the future, be blessed first.

 

[Covenanter]

Hey there bad sir. I just had a question, when you're stating that all peoples on earth will be blessed, beginning with the Jews, do you mean to say that, in the future millennium (if you are postmillennial) the Jews will be blessed first? That is what I interpreted your position to be and that is what I was responding to. I see that your statement lends itself to many interpretations though, and I'm not sure if you're postmillennial or amillennial? Are you stating that the Jews were blessed first? Because that's different from saying that the Jews will, in the future, be blessed first.

You could just call me Ian.

And you could try reading my post alongside the Scriptures I am quoting - or the Scriptures I base my post on.

The millennium, however postulated, doesn't com into Peter's sermon; he is very simply telling his hearers:

Acts 3:24 ‘Indeed, beginning with Samuel, all the prophets who have spoken have foretold these days. 25 And you are heirs of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers. He said to Abraham, “Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.” 26 When God raised up his servant, he sent him first to you to bless you by turning each of you from your wicked ways.’​

Peter uses the future tense because he is quoting the covenant with Abraham - “Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.” I used the future tense because I was quoting Peter.

These days refers to the days beginning with Pentecost. Thousands of Peter's hearers - Jews & proselytes - did respond & receive the promised blessing.

Dad,to son, "I will give you £10,000 for a deposit on a house."
Dad, "Here is £10,000."
Son, "Thanks Dad, BUT, that £10,000 is spent & forgotten, and you promised 'I will give ...' so I want that £10,000 you promised."
Dad, "You ARE enjoying my promised gift. What was a future tense promise is present reality. From where my bank balance stands, that 'I will' promise is history."

 

[Jope]

Peter uses the future tense because he is quoting the covenant with Abraham - “Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.” I used the future tense because I was quoting Peter.

These days refers to the days beginning with Pentecost. Thousands of Peter's hearers - Jews & proselytes - did respond & receive the promised blessing.

So you're amillennial? You still haven't made your position clear/explicit.


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[Covenanter]

So you're amillennial? You still haven't made your position clear/explicit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm (partial) Preterist, amil. Revelation was written before AD 70.

 

[Yeshua1]

Hey there bad sir. I just had a question, when you're stating that all peoples on earth will be blessed, beginning with the Jews, do you mean to say that, in the future millennium (if you are postmillennial) the Jews will be blessed first? That is what I interpreted your position to be and that is what I was responding to. I see that your statement lends itself to many interpretations though, and I'm not sure if you're postmillennial or amillennial? Are you stating that the Jews were blessed first? Because that's different from saying that the Jews will, in the future, be blessed first.

Peter stated in Acts that when Israek returns to God and accepts Yeshua, how much greater will that be for the world, correct?
The time of restoration!

 

[Yeshua1]

I'm (partial) Preterist, amil. Revelation was written before AD 70.

Most see it written in 90's, does your theology need the earlier date?

 

[Covenanter]

Most see it written in 90's, does your theology need the earlier date?

No. The text requires the earlier date - it was written for its immediate readers. Try reading Rev. 1 to see to whom it was written.

 

[Yeshua1]

No. The text requires the earlier date - it was written for its immediate readers. Try reading Rev. 1 to see to whom it was written.

It was written to encourage all Christians until the Second Coming, which has yet to happen!

 

[Covenanter]

No. The text requires the earlier date - it was written for its immediate readers. Try reading Rev. 1 to see to whom it was written.

It was written to encourage all Christians until the Second Coming, which has yet to happen!

All Christian can certainly take encouragement from Revelation, as we can from all Scripture - encouragement & warnings, however:

Rev. 1:1 The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2 who testifies to everything he saw – that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.​

Those highlighted sentences indicate that the events prophesied must soon take place because the time is near.

Certainly we too can claim the blessings promised, but what must soon take place because the time is near must be long past.

Note also that John was your brother and companion in the suffering and kingdom and patient endurance that are ours in Jesus.

Revelation was not primarily general prophecy for general encouragement but specific prophecy because the time is near.

 

[Yeshua1]

All Christian can certainly take encouragement from Revelation, as we can from all Scripture - encouragement & warnings, however:

Rev. 1:1 The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2 who testifies to everything he saw – that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.​

Those highlighted sentences indicate that the events prophesied must soon take place because the time is near.

Certainly we too can claim the blessings promised, but what must soon take place because the time is near must be long past.

Note also that John was your brother and companion in the suffering and kingdom and patient endurance that are ours in Jesus.

Revelation was not primarily general prophecy for general encouragement but specific prophecy because the time is near.

The second coming and the eternal state yet to happen!

 

[Covenanter]

The second coming and the eternal state yet to happen!

Jesus' coming for general resurrection & judgment, & the new heaven & new earth, have yet to happen, but that has nothing to do with understanding Revelation.

 

[Jope]

what must soon take place because the time is near must be long past.

Afternoon Ian. Every time I encounter this argument I think about how people who make this argument need to re-study bible prophecy. Have you ever read Ezekiel 12? People were complaining back then that "near" must have meant a lot sooner than they thought!

Ezekiel 12:21-28 NET
21The word of the LORD came to me: 22“Son of man, what is this proverb you have in the land of Israel, ‘The days pass slowly, and every vision fails’? 23Therefore tell them, ‘This is what the sovereign LORD says: I hereby end this proverb; they will not recite it in Israel any longer.’ But say to them, ‘The days are at hand when every vision will be fulfilled. 24For there will no longer be any false visions or flattering omens amidst the house of Israel. 25For I, the LORD, will speak. Whatever word I speak will be accomplished. It will not be delayed any longer. Indeed in your days, O rebellious house, I will speak the word and accomplish it, declares the sovereign LORD.’” 26The word of the LORD came to me: 27“Take note, son of man, the house of Israel is saying, ‘The vision that he sees is for distant days; he is prophesying about the far future.’ 28Therefore say to them, ‘This is what the sovereign LORD says: None of my words will be delayed any longer! The word I speak will come to pass, declares the sovereign LORD.’”​

Verses 15-16 were fulfilled in AD70!

Ezekiel 12:15-16 NET
15“Then they will know that I am the LORD when I disperse them among the nations and scatter them among foreign countries. 16But I will let a small number of them survive the sword, famine, and pestilence, so that they can confess all their abominable practices to the nations where they go. Then they will know that I am the LORD.”
​

These arguments are just like those made by the enemies of Isaiah:

Isaiah 5:19 NET
They say, “Let him hurry, let him act quickly, so we can see; let the plan of the Holy One of Israel take shape and come to pass, then we will know it!”
​

Not to mention 2 Peter 3:3-4!

 

[John of Japan]

All Christian can certainly take encouragement from Revelation, as we can from all Scripture - encouragement & warnings, however:

Rev. 1:1 The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2 who testifies to everything he saw – that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.​

Those highlighted sentences indicate that the events prophesied must soon take place because the time is near.

Certainly we too can claim the blessings promised, but what must soon take place because the time is near must be long past.

Note also that John was your brother and companion in the suffering and kingdom and patient endurance that are ours in Jesus.

Revelation was not primarily general prophecy for general encouragement but specific prophecy because the time is near.

The word translated "soon" is the Greek prepositional phrase en taxei, which in this passage doesn't refer to elapsed time but to the actual speed of an action. John is not saying, "These events will happen very soon" (eg, AD 70), but, "They will happen speedily." Compare the same phrase in Acts 12:7 and 22:18, where time until the action is not in view, but the speed of the action required.