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back to the basics
- Thread starter gekko
- Start date
Sgt. Fury said:
Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:
Ok, so John's baptism was unto repentance... Correct?
He that is coming after him is Christ.. Correct?
What then does John mean by, "he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost"?
If your answer fits this verse then I agree;
Ro 6:4 (KJV) Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Sgt. Fury said:
Can you show me anyone who needed more than faith to be saved?
Eph 2:7 (KJV) That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
LeBuick said:
Paul believed and had been praying and fasting for three days before Ananias came to him (Acts 9:6-9). Yet, when Ananias came, the only thing that Paul was commanded to do (9:6 - "...it shall be told the what thou must do."), was, "...Arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord" (Acts 22:16).
Unless one can be saved and still be in his sins, then Paul needed more than faith to be saved.
Regarding Mt 3:11, we need to realize that not all promises are universally applicable. For instance, God's promise to bless all nations through Abraham's seed (Gen 22:18). It did not apply to every child ever born to him, but went through Isaac, and then of his children, through Jacob, and on down the line through Judah.
The promise that Christ would baptize with the Holy Ghost was given in a broad sense by John, but specifically by Christ only to the apostles.
Act 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
The "all flesh" aspect of Joel's prophesy is fulfilled in Acts 10 when Cornelius & Co receive the "like gift" as the apostles did in Acts 2.
Holy Spirit baptism did not happen to every convert in the NT, and it does not occur today.
The promise that Christ would baptize with the Holy Ghost was given in a broad sense by John, but specifically by Christ only to the apostles.
Act 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
The "all flesh" aspect of Joel's prophesy is fulfilled in Acts 10 when Cornelius & Co receive the "like gift" as the apostles did in Acts 2.
Holy Spirit baptism did not happen to every convert in the NT, and it does not occur today.
Sgt. Fury said:
Would he have asked, "Lord, what would you have me to do" if he didn't have faith? Would Paul had been on the street called strait in the house of Judas praying if he didn't have faith? Would Paul of anxiously awaited the arrival of Ananias, a Christian if he didn't have faith?
Is this Paul's account from that same meeting, "1Co 15:8 (KJV) And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time."? I believe Paul had saving faith before he got up off the ground.
Sgt. Fury said:
Jesus came through this same lineage and IS the blessing to all the nations...
Ac 1:8 (KJV) But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
Sgt. Fury said:
I don't know about that, I thought we BELIEVED unto righteousness...
Ro 10:9 (KJV) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.
Sure worked for Abraham and the list of folks in Heb 11...
Exactly. Jesus came through a specific lineage from Abraham. The promise to bless all nations through the seed of Abraham did not apply to all of Abraham's descendants, but was specifically applied to a very small percentage of them.
Likewise, the promise that Jesus would baptize with the Holy Ghost did not apply to all people, but was fulfilled on a couple of small groups: the apostles and the household of Cornelius.
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