Featured Be On Guard against false doctrine.....False Ideas on PSA considered

Jesus experienced exactly the same we all were due to have experienced, the wrath, being forsaken, and being judged!

 

Still waiting on JonC answer to that very question!

 

And this presents that God HAS to pour wrath out upon the Son in what manner?

In FACT it shows just the opposite.

Moses as YOU stated is a type of Christ - He turned the wrath AWAY yet HE did not suffer the wrath.

There is no lack of supporting the Gospel in what @JonC and I have been presenting.

Such a conflict is occurring only because those who hold to PSA are being confronted with the lack of Scripture support for that thinking.

 

And this is supposed to be negative toward what @JonC and I have posted?

I see absolutely no conflict other than what you posted does NOT support PSA thinking.

It ACTUALLY supports what @JonC and I have been presenting.

Do you not see that?

Why?

Is it that you cling to PSA and that error is preventing you from seeing that even what you present supports what @JonC and I have posted and not PSA.

Reminds me of the statement of our Lord when in the treasury of the temple.

 

Certainly, God does and will pour out wrath upon the rebellious.

Do you sin? John says we do. Is God's wrath poured out upon you?

How much less is God's wrath then poured out upon the "Son of Righteousness."

You are only proving what @JonC and I have been posting is even more accurate.

Wrath is poured out upon the UNGODLY and our Lord was NEVER ungodly.

 

And this disproves what @JonC and I have been posting?

We have posted more concerning Scriptures and more Scriptures then any one else on these threads.

We hold Scriptures as the final authority. Do you? You have in the past.

So when we show that the Scriptures have not and do not support PSA, and we show why they do not, and quote others who have proclaimed that very claim - who do yo believe? We who have shown from Scriptures or those who would ply the scriptures with philosophical arguments that pervert God's Holy Word?

 

Again, this post does not disprove anything @JonC and I have posted!

In fact it again supports exactly what we have been presenting.

For example: Did we not already share that God's wrath is always toward the ungodly rebellious, who mock, and make images?
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,...

The PSA would present the very Fullness of God - the Son as "ungodly and unrighteous."

That is error of heretical proportions and I rarely ever use the word heretic.

 

The Scriptures, please.

Such a statement is helpless, useless, without foundation, and a lie without Scripture support.

 

Ok, think through what you just wrote.

The elect were elect from the foundation of the world. You and I would agree.

Christ was slain at the foundation of the world. You and I would agree.

Then if Christ in human time bore OUR sins, took upon Himself OUR sins, then in what manner was there a reason for the Wrath of God?

WE were already in the care of God, from the foundations of the world.

We were already HIS from the foundation of the world.

There was no wrath for us, no condemnation for us, for we are in Christ when He died for US.

The PSA is in error, Iconoclast.

It is direct conflict with the principles of Calvinistic thinking! The error has blinded some, hindering them from the truth.

 

Again,

Without Scripture support this can only be taken as opinion, error, foolishness, or whatever.

You need to support your statements by referencing the Scriptures, not just spouting like old faithful.

 

According to what you said, the preaching of the Gospel is a waste of time

 

@JonC and I have answered that question countless times in the threads.

If you didn't believe us the first times, why keep repeating ourselves.

Both @Jon and I support the view of Scriptures. We have used Scriptures throughout these threads. Neither of us are strangers to Scriptures.

We both taught and presented PSA until we became aware by the work of God that it is error.

We have shown you the error.

What you do with that information is between you and the Scriptures.

God had no need to pour the wrath upon the Son.
The OT sacrifice and offerings prove that statement as true - we have spent time in the OT showing as much.
The NT does not present such but places the pouring of wrath upon the ungodly - we have spent time in the NT showing as much.

We have explored the Scriptures on this topic, and yet some desire that our Lord suffer wrath from God.

Not a single verse has been produced to support such thinking. Rather, verses concerning wrath, the evidence of God's wrath, and to WHOM the wrath is intended have been repositioned to include the very member of the Trinity, the very Fullness of God, the very God. This is not good.

Christ said, "I came to do the will of the Father."
The will of the Father did not include the Son having wrath by the Father poured on HIM.

That would violate the parable of the owner of the field who sent many servants (prophets) to collect from the caretakers. They abused and killed them (prophets) all. Finally the owner sent his own son (Christ) saying they will honor him (Christ). But they (the caretakers) abused and killed the son to claim the ground as their own. What will that owner then do to those caretakers when he returns? (This is from Matthew 21)

The owner didn't dump on the son. Neither did God dump on His Son. The owner's wrath will dump on those ungodly - REV 16.

The Scriptures in statement and type does most certainly present the truth.

PSA presents error.

 

Nope.

For it is by the preaching of the gospel that those who are given to hear will hear and respond.

But that is for a different thread.

 

You are reading your theology into the text. And please remember Sola Scriptura.
1Jn 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.
So tell me what word or words mean elect? And what word or words make His propitiation limited?

 

“There is therefore No Condemnation to those in Christ Jesus”.

the Wrath of God is appointed specifically for the ungodly, just as I and JonC have posted.

Is that not validated in the opening of Romans?