What are those?
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Charles Stanley
- Thread starter evangelist6589
- Start date
What are those?
Good post. It is because of these three reasons that I no longer listen to his sermons.
If I remember correctly, annihilation, soul sleep, loss of salvation, and in general a number of errors from an eschatological perspective.
It's been a while since I looked at those threads.
Any of these make the doctrine in view seem mild in comparison, because it does not deny certain truths which form the foundation of a proper soteriological view. Of course, that is just my own opinion, but, there are certain doctrines which I think we should view as being of higher priority to address than others.
God bless.
I didn't see that in the doctrine, simply an erroneous purgatorial element which is, of course, not Biblical. "Sinning Christians in Hades during the Kingdom." Shame it's not allowed to be discussed...
All false doctrine should be fair game.
But if that is the case then I agree completely, that is heavy.
God bless.
I would not pick too much on Stanley. Last I checked his church is a Way of the Master one as they teach it in their evangelism classes.
I didn't see that in the doctrine, simply an erroneous purgatorial element which is, of course, not Biblical. "Sinning Christians in Hades during the Kingdom." Shame it's not allowed to be discussed...
All false doctrine should be fair game.
But if that is the case then I agree completely, that is heavy.
God bless.
His church is way of the master and his name is on a Comfort book and I believe also in Hells best Kept Secret.
I didn't see that in the doctrine, simply an erroneous purgatorial element which is, of course, not Biblical. "Sinning Christians in Hades during the Kingdom." Shame it's not allowed to be discussed...
All false doctrine should be fair game.
But if that is the case then I agree completely, that is heavy.
God bless.
Christians have to earn a secondary salvation, through good works, in order to make into the Millennium.
So since they use TWOTM any other errors are fine.
That is so wrong on so many levels.
Can you cite book quotes from eternal security where he teaches this? Please give me page numbers.
Nope, you can go look for it yourself, go look into the archives on this board, or contact his ministry yourself. I will tell you that a key word to look for in the book is outer darkness. Any time he is talking about that he is talking about Christians being excluded from the Millennium.
Also, Stanley quotes Zane Hodges is I remember correctly in that book. Hodges is a primary pusher of that doctrine. Also I think the use of the word overcomer is significant among Millennial Exclusionists as it indicates those Christians who have served God well and will go into the Millennium.
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I used to run in those Millennial Exclusion circles, so to speak. Grace Evangelical Society most prominently.
And I can tell you that ME has many faces. Along the lines of Walvoord's idea that there will be numerous resurrections, there was one brand with the overcomer being included in the Millenium and Marriage Banquet, and the lackluster believer not being resurrected until afterward.
It was Millennial Exclusion, and that was it.
Sometime after I abandoned that camp over Hodges' "Crossless Gospel" heresy, the M.E. position morphed into this heinous punishment type of exclusion.
If I'm not mistaken, many prominent Dallas grads from the 60s-80s still hold to the previous sort - Tony Evans, Stanley, Swindoll, Lutzer, et al.
I'm not sure about David Jeremiah
One previous pastor of mine has a doctorate from DTS, was there with Swindoll, Joseph Dillow, and a few others. And he would probably have the same view.
In short, Millennial Exclusion began as a teaching of what unfaithful Christians will NOT experience, with no real teaching as to what they WILL experience.
Of course, I'm open to correction about any of the above stated info. It's been almost 15 years since I ran in those circles
And I can tell you that ME has many faces. Along the lines of Walvoord's idea that there will be numerous resurrections, there was one brand with the overcomer being included in the Millenium and Marriage Banquet, and the lackluster believer not being resurrected until afterward.
It was Millennial Exclusion, and that was it.
Sometime after I abandoned that camp over Hodges' "Crossless Gospel" heresy, the M.E. position morphed into this heinous punishment type of exclusion.
If I'm not mistaken, many prominent Dallas grads from the 60s-80s still hold to the previous sort - Tony Evans, Stanley, Swindoll, Lutzer, et al.
I'm not sure about David Jeremiah
One previous pastor of mine has a doctorate from DTS, was there with Swindoll, Joseph Dillow, and a few others. And he would probably have the same view.
In short, Millennial Exclusion began as a teaching of what unfaithful Christians will NOT experience, with no real teaching as to what they WILL experience.
Of course, I'm open to correction about any of the above stated info. It's been almost 15 years since I ran in those circles
Way of the Master ought not trump Scripture as a litmus test.
Okay Okay
Mitchell you are correct as I saw after a closer look at certain pages in the book Eternal Security. This would appear to be a false view, as Stanley communicates several false views in the book. Not a book I would recommend for a new believer, but just a book to read for fun. The book has some bad views none of which are heresy. But yes I would recommend The Gospel According to Jesus instead. Its a harder read, but its far more Biblical and supported by scripture.
Mitchell you are correct as I saw after a closer look at certain pages in the book Eternal Security. This would appear to be a false view, as Stanley communicates several false views in the book. Not a book I would recommend for a new believer, but just a book to read for fun. The book has some bad views none of which are heresy. But yes I would recommend The Gospel According to Jesus instead. Its a harder read, but its far more Biblical and supported by scripture.
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I do not recommend Stanley for this book. I recommend Stanley for his association with the Way of the Master, his book on the Holy Spirit, and his book on Biblical success.
Stanley and Lutzer are wrong, but this view is not a heretical one. I do not recommend these pastors for their books on this topic, but for their books on other topics.
Yes because following Comfort and TWOTM is how we should judge all churches. Just ignore all unbliblical teaching and practice as long as they have a Comfort book in their library.
The earliest form of Millennial Exclusion would not be a heresy, imho. It simply teaches greater rewards for those who endure to the end, or "overcome" (see Revelation 3:5). Those who don't would simply miss out on some great blessings when Christ returns. Simply, exclusion from the Millennial reign of Christ. You'll find this in many earlier Dispensational teachings. And it wasn't called Millennial Exclusion.
But the more recent brand, which includes punishment for those who are unfaithful, etc, runs very close to a Purgatory teaching, as someone else stated previously.