Jesis is now forever more the God-Man, and he still has that same nail scarred physical body was raised in, so when he returns, will be in that same body, but manifesting fullness of His glory, as John in Revelation beheld!
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Christology and Preterism
- Thread starter John of Japan
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Let me reiterate a question to full preterists:
If the material resurrected body of Jesus Christ that He used to consume food with the disciples post resurrection is not in heaven,
what happened to it and/or where is it now?
This is not a trick question but one of sincerity, please answer.
HankD
If the material resurrected body of Jesus Christ that He used to consume food with the disciples post resurrection is not in heaven,
what happened to it and/or where is it now?
This is not a trick question but one of sincerity, please answer.
HankD
Ian asked:
And when every eye will see Him what will 10 billion people around the earth see?
John replied:
They will see the Risen Christ in all His glory as portrayed in Rev. 1.
And when every eye will see Him what will 10 billion people around the earth see?
John replied:
They will see the Risen Christ in all His glory as portrayed in Rev. 1.
Will we/they all see his risen human physical body in the same size & shape - all-glorious?
Will 10 billion people see that same physical body - all in the same moment?Yes said:
1 Cor. 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
I am happy to leave this as a glorious mystery. We shouldn't provoke Paul's rebuke:
35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.
Of course they will. Why in the world wouldn't they?
I'm always amused by suggestions that something about the 2nd coming is unreasonable or impossible. As if the incarnation, atonement and resurrection of Christ were all reasonable events!
Of course they will all see Jesus at the same time. Why in the world do you doubt that? God delights in miracles.
If the whole world can see Trump at one time on their i-phones, why would God not be able to show Christ to the whole world at once?
I've been to two different 3rd world countries, and even there everyone--EVERYONE!--had cell phones. They were mostly i-phones in the African country I was in last year.
I really have no idea what point you are trying to make about the 2nd coming with this quote about the resurrection of the saints.
Now, you still have not answered the main question of the thread. Did Christ come spiritually in AD 70 or physically?
God created the Universe out of nothing, so think getting all to see Jesus pretty easy for Him to pull off!
So that would be too difficult for God to do?
prophecy70
Active Member
Hopefully my phone is charged the day Jesus comes. Or Ill miss out on seeing him.
prophecy70
Active Member
I believe he came in Judgement, Like the cloud comings of the OT. Did God really send a sword, or ride a cloud?
Yes, we have already ascertained you don't understand Matthew 24.
Jesus speaks with His disciples gives a second "great commission" to be witnesses...both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth" then ascends bodily into heaven while they watch Him ascending
Acts 1
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
looked - with their eyes not their imagination.
this same Jesus - Jesus - not the Roman General Titus
shall so come in like manner - bodily
as ye have seen him go into heaven - visibly
Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
every eye shall see Him - Not Titus.
HankD
Acts 1
10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.
12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.
looked - with their eyes not their imagination.
this same Jesus - Jesus - not the Roman General Titus
shall so come in like manner - bodily
as ye have seen him go into heaven - visibly
Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
every eye shall see Him - Not Titus.
HankD
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prophecy70
Active Member
Revelation 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
What if I bold and underline that?
People who pierced him are waiting a long time for him to come?
the Jewish nation of Israel - yes they have been waiting for almost 2000 years for their Messiah.
HankD
Maybe, but the people of Israel believed in their thousands when the risen Lord Jesus Christ, Messiah, was preached. They were convicted of their sin of piercing their Messiah. They saw with understanding what they did not see with their eyes. John 12:37-41
And they immediately became, by faith, citizens of the holy nation, the redeemed people of God. 1 Peter 2.
So if humans can broadcast all over the world, surely God is powerful enough to do so, don't you think?Hopefully my phone is charged the day Jesus comes. Or Ill miss out on seeing him.
(Just so you don't misunderstand as badly as Covenanter did, I mean with a miracle, not through cell phones.)
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You are not answering the OP. How did Jesus come in judgement, physically or spiritually?
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Ian asked John:
"Will 10 billion people see that same physical body - all in the same moment?"
John replied:
Wonderful! Now a lot of people have i-phones Jesus can come & his coming will be seen by everyone - {EVERYONE-with a phone.}
That means of course that everyone with a phone, switched on, at the right setting, will see his glorious appearing. Christians at services & prayer meetings, & people driving, & everyone without a phone, or with their phone switched off , or asleep, will be left behind - the exact opposite of the popular scenario
I understand that a TV camera is permanently focused the Mount f Olives, to ensure everyone sees Jesus' return.
Where in Scripture do you find phone & TV & other needed technology?
Your OP is concerned that Preterism requires a separation of Jesus hypostasis. Your beliefs require not only universal modern technology but for everyone to be switched on & watching at the exact time.
Time to close this thread which was design to ridicule our belief in the fulfilment of Jesus prophecy.
"Will 10 billion people see that same physical body - all in the same moment?"
1 Cor. 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
John replied:
"Of course they will all see Jesus at the same time. Why in the world do you doubt that? God delights in miracles.
If the whole world can see Trump at one time on their i-phones, why would God not be able to show Christ to the whole world at once?
I've been to two different 3rd world countries, and even there everyone--EVERYONE!--had cell phones. They were mostly i-phones in the African country I was in last year."
If the whole world can see Trump at one time on their i-phones, why would God not be able to show Christ to the whole world at once?
I've been to two different 3rd world countries, and even there everyone--EVERYONE!--had cell phones. They were mostly i-phones in the African country I was in last year."
Wonderful! Now a lot of people have i-phones Jesus can come & his coming will be seen by everyone - {EVERYONE-with a phone.}
That means of course that everyone with a phone, switched on, at the right setting, will see his glorious appearing. Christians at services & prayer meetings, & people driving, & everyone without a phone, or with their phone switched off , or asleep, will be left behind - the exact opposite of the popular scenario
I understand that a TV camera is permanently focused the Mount f Olives, to ensure everyone sees Jesus' return.
Where in Scripture do you find phone & TV & other needed technology?
Your OP is concerned that Preterism requires a separation of Jesus hypostasis. Your beliefs require not only universal modern technology but for everyone to be switched on & watching at the exact time.
Time to close this thread which was design to ridicule our belief in the fulfilment of Jesus prophecy.
How could you have so completely and totally missed the point of my post???? Here it is once again, simplified just for you: if humans can reach around the globe with their technology, why cannot God, who is all-powerful, reach around the globe with a miracle (not through cell phones) so that everyone in the world can see Jesus at once? To doubt this is to doubt the power of God.Wonderful! Now a lot of people have i-phones Jesus can come & his coming will be seen by everyone - {EVERYONE-with a phone.}
That means of course that everyone with a phone, switched on, at the right setting, will see his glorious appearing. Christians at services & prayer meetings, & people driving, & everyone without a phone, or with their phone switched off , or asleep, will be left behind - the exact opposite of the popular scenario
I understand that a TV camera is permanently focused the Mount f Olives, to ensure everyone sees Jesus' return.
Where in Scripture do you find phone & TV & other needed technology?
Your OP is concerned that Preterism requires a separation of Jesus hypostasis. Your beliefs require not only universal modern technology but for everyone to be switched on & watching at the exact time.
You're being ridiculous. My OP is completely serious. Your problem appears to be that you can't answer it.
Let me try the OP's question again, which you have ducked several times. Maybe I should rephrase it. If Jesus came spiritually in AD 70, where was His body at the time?
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At this moment, this thread is nowhere near the closure limit. A serious question was asked in the OP.
John - I answered your OP in several posts on page 1.
e.g.
I didn't miss your point in -
You're using the Pharisees method when they asked Jesus trick questions. I cannot supply an answer that violate Jesus divine/human nature - the sort of answer you want so you can prove my belief false.
Perhaps you didn't notice the clause in my above post:
People were asking questions about the resurrection body, which Paul dismissed as foolish. And you are asking questions about the resurrection body of Jesus simply to prove I am in error.
You've had all the answers I am prepared to give.
e.g.
I didn't miss your point in -
You're using the Pharisees method when they asked Jesus trick questions. I cannot supply an answer that violate Jesus divine/human nature - the sort of answer you want so you can prove my belief false.
Perhaps you didn't notice the clause in my above post:
"I am happy to leave this as a glorious mystery. We shouldn't provoke Paul's rebuke:
35 But someone will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?” 36 Foolish one, what you sow is not made alive unless it dies. 37 And what you sow, you do not sow that body that shall be, but mere grain—perhaps wheat or some other grain. 38 But God gives it a body as He pleases, and to each seed its own body.
John replied:
"I really have no idea what point you are trying to make about the 2nd coming with this quote about the resurrection of the saints."
"I really have no idea what point you are trying to make about the 2nd coming with this quote about the resurrection of the saints."
People were asking questions about the resurrection body, which Paul dismissed as foolish. And you are asking questions about the resurrection body of Jesus simply to prove I am in error.
You've had all the answers I am prepared to give.
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