Continued - Israeli-Palestinian peace settlement.

[GoodTidings]

I struggle to read Christ in anything you spew. But there are many Christs,right? Sorry. You support terrorism but because the term is traumatizing you call it by other name. Not clever at all. Israel has no better right to existence than the Arabs it expelled. Zionism is the origin of all this bloodshed pitting Muslims against others and against themselves. I sometimes marvel at Satan for such a novel innovation. Imperialism is exactly that regardless of who perpetrates it. Real patriotism is speaking truth to power and not mindlessly rallying behind your leader. Your country is greater than anyone in office. There are millions of lives wasted in the name of imperialism. I won’t list the senseless wars again.Is Iraq better? Is Libya better? Is Afghanistan better? Is Venezuela better? There is not a single country that is better as a result of American imperialism

Jesus hates Islam, too. He died so that people would not be held captive to sin and the false god of Islam.

I don't support terrorism at all. But I support Israel's right to exist. And I have never called for Israel to destroyed and I have never said that Arabs don't have the right to exist, either.

But all you put out are Islamic talking points and rant about non-existent imperialism. None of those countries are in the shape they are in because of the US. They were all hell-holes as a result of the scourge of Islam. Afghans were far worse off under Taliban control. Islam and Iraq were never worth much as countries. The entire Islamic world is nothing but a place of oppression, death and violence and they were that way before the US stepped one foot in the middle east.

The thing is, If I were on this board saying that Jews have no right to exist and should be exterminated and America is the great Satan, you would have no problem with me, at all. You would join the chorus. That is what I see in your posts. Just hatred for the very existence of Jews and hatred for America. That is the drumbeat you march to.

 

[Covenanter]

Do you support Islamic terrorism that seeks to annihilate Israel on the grounds that Israel is illegitimate should not exist?

I don't support terrorism, whether by Muslims, the IDF, Israeli settlers, or by by the US or UK.

As for those farmers and those checkpoints... Those were made necessary because of terrorism being inflicted upon Israel by the Palestinians.

Bethlehem Bible College
I don't respect Bethlehem Bible College. It is nothing but an anti-Semitic, Islamic gathering meant to demonize Israel and nothing more. It is a reproach to Christ and does not reflect authentic, biblical Christianity.

What people like you do, is you want to talk about Israel's defensive countermeasures without talking about the terrorism that precipitates those actions. You try to present Israel's actions in a vacuum and that is simply unfair and distorts the historical record.

If you don't respect a Christian college all your opinions are worthless.

 

[GoodTidings]

I don't support terrorism, whether by Muslims, the IDF, Israeli settlers, or by by the US or UK.

People like you that broaden the meaning of "terrorism" to promote liberal, politically correct pabulum in order to demonize the US and Israel.

If you don't respect a Christian college all your opinions are worthless.

It hosts an anti-Semitic gathering called "Christ and the Checkpoint" and masks itself as Christian while promoting radical Islamic hatred for Israel. That is not Christian; at least it is not what followers of Jesus do.

And if you don't like my views and think they worthless, you are welcome to ignore me from here on out, I don't really care.

 

[church mouse guy]

Europe does not think that Germany was a socialist country under Hitler. Germany now dominates Europe with money and has called for Muslim immigration and migration to countries with high welfare payments.

Europe is making money off Iran and China and has different interests from the USA. A nuclear Iran would attack several Arab states as well as Jerusalem and Europe.

The USA is energy independent and does not need Arab or Persian oil.

Nine Eleven cemented the American military alliance with Israel. The Israeli army is better than almost all other armies in the world. Israel has built a wall and the USA is trying to build a wall. The UK is a police state with no bill of rights.

 

[FollowTheWay]

Ah yes, Wikipedia, the most unreliable source for information on the Internet. Wikipedia completely misrepresents what 242 and 338 actually refer to.

Resolution 338 is not about lasting peace. It was a call for a ceasefire in the Yom Kippur War. Israel had routed the Egyptians and Syrians and when Israel had driven Egyptian and Syria forces with in just 30-40 Kilometers of their respective capitals, the UN called for a ceasefire.

Resolution 242 was rejected by the Arabs. And was never lived up to after the Oslo Accords by the Palestinians. Resolution 242 did not require Israel to withdraw to its pre-1967 borders, nor did Resolution 338. Your plagiarized source totally mispresents both of those Resolutions.

The Oslo Accord was not the two-state solution. And the Palestinians violated the agreement very quickly after it was signed, and that led to a lot of murdered Jews, some 2000 Jews paid for Rabin's error even after Rabin was assassinated. Oslo was dead within a year after Arafat signed it. He never intended to live up to his end of the deal. What Rabin essentially did was reward terrorism. To the Palestinians, Oslo was an indication that terrorism works and given enough time, terrorism will make your enemies capitulate and so the Palestinian Authority's answer to Israel's concessions was more terror. More terror, in their eyes, will lead to more concessions.

After the Palestinians were granted self-governance, they took over Bethlehem and many Christians paid the price and had their property confiscated and had to leave Bethlehem. Many fled to Jerusalem.

In 2000, Yasir Arafat, at Camp David, rejected Ehud Barak's offer that amounted to an initial 93% of what Arafat demanded and he walked away from it. The remaining 7% was to ceded to PA as they proved that they had given up terrorism against Israel. Even Bill Clinton was completely flabbergasted at Arafat's complete dismissal. They could have had a two-state situation in 2000, but as always, the Arabs and Arafat rejected the offer.

Any proof?

 

[church mouse guy]

People like you want these murders to go on. Why?

Are you accusing people of condoning murder? I thought you said that you were a successful engineer aho should be in charge of the universe.

 

[GoodTidings]

People like you want these murders to go on. Why?

What murders? Where are you when terrorists shred babies in city buses? Where are you when a young family is ambushed by terrorists on an empty road? Where are you when restaurants and playgrounds and shopping malls in Israel are bombed?

Where are you when Palestinians use their own children as canon fodder? Most of the Palestinians die at the hands of the terrorists because the terrorist use them as human shields.

 

[church mouse guy]

Maybe somebody is in a safe place of white privilege sipping soy milk.

 

[GoodTidings]

Any proof?

Proof of what? It's common knowledge. You can look it up.

 

[GoodTidings]

4,000 Palestinians were killed in Syria's civil war. Where is the outcry about that? The truth is that most people who pretend to care about the Palestinians only care about them they can make Israel the villain. When Palestinians die the hands of other Palestinians, these bleeding hearts say nothing. When they die at the hands of other Arabs, the bleeding hearts say nothing. They only care about the plight of the Palestinians when they can use it as a platform to smear Israel.

 

[Covenanter]

People like you that broaden the meaning of "terrorism" to promote liberal, politically correct pabulum in order to demonize the US and Israel.

We all agree that car bombs & suicide bombs are acts of terrorism
but
Is it terrorism when hospitals, schools, shelters, sewage & water & electricity supplies are bombed? Or paramedics caring for sniper victims are also shot?

It hosts an anti-Semitic gathering called "Christ and the Checkpoint" and masks itself as Christian while promoting radical Islamic hatred for Israel. That is not Christian; at least it is not what followers of Jesus do.

And if you don't like my views and think they worthless, you are welcome to ignore me from here on out, I don't really care.

You do have biased views - based on prejudice.

 

[GoodTidings]

Is it terrorism when hospitals, schools, shelters, sewage & water & electricity supplies are bombed? Or paramedics caring for sniper victims are also shot?

I am assuming you are talking about Israel. Can you give any specifics, or just make unfounded accusations? Seriously, I would like to see each of those claims given dates and times and locations for review. Most of the time, these are just false accusations or the context of those actions is ignored.

You do have biased views - based on prejudice.

No, based on facts. Christ at the Checkpoint is nothing but an anti-Israel, anti-Semitic gathering where liberal Christians and Palestinians sit around and promote radical Islamic talking points and pretend that it's "Christian" to hate Israel.

 

[church mouse guy]

We all agree that car bombs & suicide bombs are acts of terrorism
but
Is it terrorism when hospitals, schools, shelters, sewage & water & electricity supplies are bombed? Or paramedics caring for sniper victims are also shot?



You do have biased views - based on prejudice.

Of course, you have no problem with bombings and rockets fired from Gaza against civilian targets in Israel, correct? Another problem with your point of view is that many of these buildings are marked as one thing in Gaza but are really military supply dumps for the Arabs. Perhaps you remember when you British bombed women and children and other civilians at a place that was called a fort but was really just a warehouse for supplies? It was called Fort McHenry and it was bombed incessantly during the War of 1812. But then we wanted freedom from you because you have no Bill of Rights and now plans to ever acquire a Bill of Rights. You were making a lot of money from Iran and still are making a lot of money from China. Germany has the big piles of cash in Europe and dictates European policy from a bank vault in Berlin. Your policy no longer coincides with American policy, which is not to appease the jihadi psychopaths in Iran and elsewhere in the Islamic world. Today we are allied with not only Israel but also Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia. No one in that alliance wants to keep feeding people crammed on a tiny strip of land dating back to 1948. Not even Egypt wants those people around.

We are abandoning China also for their threats against our Asian allies and their illegal attempt to stop shipping in international waters in the China Sea. We are tired of China since they went communist after WW II and for their seizing of Tibet and their repression there and for their refusal to allow free elections in Korea and their brutal repression of North Korea and for their attempts to impose even more brutality against Hong Kong. The Chinese are liars and thieves.

 

[GoodTidings]

Of course, you have no problem with bombings and rockets fired from Gaza against civilian targets in Israel, correct? Another problem with your point of view is that many of these buildings are marked as one thing in Gaza but are really military supply dumps for the Arabs.

You raise a good point.

What many of Israel's critics don't know is that much of the housing, sewer systems, schools, hospitals that are in Gaza and the West Bank were actually built for the Palestinians by Israel. Israel's presence in the West Bank and previously in Gaza raised the standard of living for Palestinians by 200%. Prior to that, the Palestinians were under Jordanian and Egyptian administrative control and were dying of preventable diseases and the life expectancy was low. After Israel assumed control of Gaza and the WB, they gave the Palestinians health care, built modern sewers, schools, hospitals and free housing. The Jordanians and Egyptians would not allow the Palestinians to seek health care and would not provide it.

The reason that the Palestinian population has exceeded 6 million, is because of their access to health care and benefits provided by Israel. Israel's critics say that Israel is committing genocide, but the facts don't bear that out, particularly when you start with 850,000 Palestinians and now have over 6 million. Genocide decreases populations; it doesn't increase them. Most of what the critics claim are really just lies and don't fit with observable. facts.

The PLO and now Hamas have taken some of those facilities and they use them as weapons depots and bomb making factories. They are still using the signs outside for what they were originally for, but inside they are being used for terrorist purposes.

That's why Israel was bulldozing houses that were being used for terrorist purposes. The enemies of Israel spin these stories to make it appear that Israel does these things to terrorize the Palestinians, but it is the Palestinians who are using what Israel built to help them into facilities to support terrorism against Israel.

In Gaza, Israel built a school for deaf children. But Arafat took that school and turned into an armory. But when Israel bombed it, it was reported that Israel bombed a school for deaf children.

Israel's critics are dishonest and don't represent the conflict truthfully. They distort the facts and omit any information that would not support their false narrative.

 

[FollowTheWay]

Proof of what? It's common knowledge. You can look it up.

Common knowledge doesn't get it.

 

[FollowTheWay]

Europe does not think that Germany was a socialist country under Hitler. Germany now dominates Europe with money and has called for Muslim immigration and migration to countries with high welfare payments.

Europe is making money off Iran and China and has different interests from the USA. A nuclear Iran would attack several Arab states as well as Jerusalem and Europe.

The USA is energy independent and does not need Arab or Persian oil.

Nine Eleven cemented the American military alliance with Israel. The Israeli army is better than almost all other armies in the world. Israel has built a wall and the USA is trying to build a wall. The UK is a police state with no bill of rights.

Europe is right about Hitler. (You brought that up not me.) He was an extreme right fascist not a socialist. But Germany has turned its back on Hitler. In fact it is illegal to wear a swastika or show anything that is reminiscent of that sad chapter in their past. There is nothing wrong with Europe making money off China. Isn't that what Trump is trying to do but has failed? There were sanctions included in the agreement with Iran but Trump turned his back on it. Therefore, there's no problem with Europe making money off Iran.

The USA is energy independent. Therefore we don't have to try to prop up bankrupt coal companies. We can move forward with solar, wind, etc.

 

[GoodTidings]

Common knowledge doesn't get it.

Everything I said is searchable. If you disagree with any facts I presented, then you are free to debate them and show where what I said was wrong. I am not going to search high and low for "proof" because you don't EVER respond to facts I present.

You make a blanket quote of my post and then respond with something else and never grapple with what I present. So, it is a waste of my time to look for evidence that I know you will simply ignore and brush aside.

If I thought you would actually engage me on the facts and evidence, I would be happy to provide them, but you cannot be trusted in a debate.

 

[church mouse guy]

Europe is right about Hitler. (You brought that up not me.) He was an extreme right fascist not a socialist. But Germany has turned its back on Hitler. In fact it is illegal to wear a swastika or show anything that is reminiscent of that sad chapter in their past. There is nothing wrong with Europe making money off China. Isn't that what Trump is trying to do but has failed? There were sanctions included in the agreement with Iran but Trump turned his back on it. Therefore, there's no problem with Europe making money off Iran.

The USA is energy independent. Therefore we don't have to try to prop up bankrupt coal companies. We can move forward with solar, wind, etc.

So if Hitler wasn't a socialist, what was his reason for murdering so many Jews, or do you even think that he murdered a lot of Jews? Germany, UK, and France made a lot of money from Iran helping them build the bomb. Now they are aligned with them because they do not think that Germany was a socialist country that murdered Jews.

 

[GoodTidings]

Europe is right about Hitler. (You brought that up not me.) He was an extreme right fascist not a socialist.

He was as socialist and he made the same socialist promises that the Democrats are making today, to the American people. Socialists can be fascists. Hitler's brown shirts carried out his fascist policies and he was just as socialist as Bernie Sanders, Joseph Stalin, Mao Tse Tung and other socialists who the Democrats admire.

 

[church mouse guy]

You raise a good point.

What many of Israel's critics don't know is that much of the housing, sewer systems, schools, hospitals that are in Gaza and the West Bank were actually built for the Palestinians by Israel. Israel's presence in the West Bank and previously in Gaza raised the standard of living for Palestinians by 200%. Prior to that, the Palestinians were under Jordanian and Egyptian administrative control and were dying of preventable diseases and the life expectancy was low. After Israel assumed control of Gaza and the WB, they gave the Palestinians health care, built modern sewers, schools, hospitals and free housing. The Jordanians and Egyptians would not allow the Palestinians to seek health care and would not provide it.

The reason that the Palestinian population has exceeded 6 million, is because of their access to health care and benefits provided by Israel. Israel's critics say that Israel is committing genocide, but the facts don't bear that out, particularly when you start with 850,000 Palestinians and now have over 6 million. Genocide decreases populations; it doesn't increase them. Most of what the critics claim are really just lies and don't fit with observable. facts.

The PLO and now Hamas have taken some of those facilities and they use them as weapons depots and bomb making factories. They are still using the signs outside for what they were originally for, but inside they are being used for terrorist purposes.

That's why Israel was bulldozing houses that were being used for terrorist purposes. The enemies of Israel spin these stories to make it appear that Israel does these things to terrorize the Palestinians, but it is the Palestinians who are using what Israel built to help them into facilities to support terrorism against Israel.

In Gaza, Israel built a school for deaf children. But Arafat took that school and turned into an armory. But when Israel bombed it, it was reported that Israel bombed a school for deaf children.

Israel's critics are dishonest and don't represent the conflict truthfully. They distort the facts and omit any information that would not support their false narrative.

Don't tell the Brits about Palestinian treachery. They have a special relationship with the Palestinians.