Depression

I have a question for Lorelei and Molly: What should a Christian who has clinical depression do when their prayers are not aswered for the removal of this trial from their lives? Prayers are not always answered "Yes". sometimes they are "No" or "Wait".

I am not Lorelei or Molly but wanted to answer your question.

. 8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. 9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. 10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

 

Interesting Thread.

I certainly can understand where those are coming from who state that we have been given a Spirit of peace and a sound mind. This is Biblical and therefore true. However, most people I see on a daily basis don't have the Holy Spirit since they are not believers. They aren't interested in hearing about spiritual issues because many of them have stoney hearts (see Parable of the Sower). I treat these folks with antidepressants and most respond favorably; some more so than others. Of course the underlying spiritual issues need to be dealt with, but sadly most aren't interested in dealing with them .

I do have some people that come in to see me for anxiety or depression who are professing Christians. To these folks I also encourage CONTINUED prayer (and many say they have been doing this) and I point to passages such as Phil 4:6-7 and Matt 6:25-34 for meditation. However, I also offer them anti-depressants. I don't believe they are sinning by asking for or taking these as long as they keep in mind that God is still the GREAT PHYSICIAN (and most do recognize this). I do believe that God has been gracious enough to allow these compounds to be discovered that there is a place for them in the treatment for clinical depression.

 

Mom O Five,

Thanks so ever much for your wonderful heartfelt and loving post! It lifts my spirit to hear the truth spoken so freely and to have the love of God lifted up, not dragged down! Thank you ever so much! I guess the hardest thing to do is describe the indescribable peace and love of God! You did an awfully good job at it anyway!

AMEN!

~Lorelei

 

Exactly, but are you helping them by covering up the problem?!?! The world is trying to cure the incurable! The problem with the world is that they NEED the Lord. They don't want to admit it and their spiritual struggle drags them down. But by fixing the symptom you are hiding the truth from them! My anxiety began before I was saved, and PRAISE GOD I continued to feel that way until I realized that God and God ALONE was the cure for that!

My mother has been on pills for over 15 years and she can NOT sleep without taking them. I have been trying to share the love of Christ with her, but she doesn't feel she needs it, because guess what, the pill works, at least to cover the pain of spiritual separation from God.

~Lorelei

 

I have only seen it on one side. I have asked for scripture from the opposing viewpoint, but that confused them for some reason.

My arguments do not expect anyone to assume the role of God. We need to stop trying to do things on our own because we are indeed NOT God. However, God does live in us and the Bible IS God's Word. I can know what He has chosen to tell me about Himself and He chose to tell me that my mind would be kept sound in Him.

The depression itself is not a trial, it is an emotion caused by some other trial. If God said NO that trial were to remain, you should do as Paul stated in the verse that Mom quoted. Lean on God's grace to get through it. You are told not to be depressed about it.

Dont' worry, don't be anxious, you obviously have a choice. Isn't the first part of the cure admission that there is a problem. We have to admit that our state of mind is not from Christ before we can let Him take over.

God NEVER says WAIT on His Spirit, we already have it. He never says NO my Spirit will not always give you peace. He says to walk in the spirit, the choice to do so is ours.

His depression was not an illness it was his concern over why he went through the trials that caused that emotion. Yes, we know from this book that we shouldn't let the trials of life effect us, we should always lean on God.

Another great lesson from job, men make terrible counselors.

~Lorelei

 

Thank God that for what? 6000 years where there was no peace for man? That God's promise was not available until today?

So is this how love is supposed to feel?

~Lorelei

 

What an excellent example on how it's all on our focus! Look at what you just quoted! You wanted to use God's Word to prove that we will have trials and you did. But what does THIS verse say about that trial???

BE OF GOOD CHEER!!!

Depression is not a trial, it is the result of a person not being of good cheer when they reach one.

~Lorelei

 

I would like to see Lorelei and Molly answer these questions too.

Why is it that when someone makes a valid point , it isn't given the respect of an earnest reply?

 

Scroll up, I replied.

~Lorelei

 

You said that you only saw one side post scripture, Yet here you acknowledge that I posted scripture in this quote?

 

Yopu enjoy putting words into peoples mouths don't you, twisting what they say, biy, you are vicious aren't you.

 

You wanted some scripture, here it is.


Psalm 42
TO THE CHIEF MUSICIAN. A CONTEMPLATION OF THE SONS OF KORAH.
1 As the deer pants for the water brooks,
So pants my soul for You, O God.
2 My soul thirsts for God, for the living God.
When shall I come and £appear before God?
3 My tears have been my food day and night,
While they continually say to me,
Where is your God?
4 When I remember these things,
I pour out my soul within me.
For I used to go with the multitude;
I went with them to the house of God,
With the voice of joy and praise,
With a multitude that kept a pilgrim feast.
5 Why are you cast down, O my soul?
And why are you disquieted within me?
Hope in God, for I shall yet praise Him
For the help of His countenance.
6 O my God, my soul is cast down within me;
Therefore I will remember You from the land of the Jordan,
And from the heights of Hermon,
From the Hill Mizar.
7 Deep calls unto deep at the noise of Your waterfalls;
All Your waves and billows have gone over me.
8 The LORD will command His lovingkindness in the daytime,
And in the night His song shall be with me
A prayer to the God of my life.
9 I will say to God my Rock,
Why have You forgotten me?
Why do I go mourning because of the oppression of the enemy?
10 As with a breaking of my bones,
My enemies reproach me,
While they say to me all day long,
Where is your God
11 Why are you cast down, O my soul?
And why are you disquieted within me?
Hope in God;
For I shall yet praise Him,
The help of my countenance and my God.


The writter says their soul is cast down within them, they are filled with tears day and night,he no longer even goes to worship God, he questions himself, why has this happened to me, he questions God, why has this happened to me. But all through it all he remembers God, and repeadtly goes back to what God has done for him in the past, knowing that God will do it again now. He sees that no matter what he is n ot, can not be seperated from the love of God.


Gal.6:2 Bear one another’s burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. 3For if anyone thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself.


1John4:21 And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also. Can one love their brother or sister in Christ if they are judgemental and critizing them, thinking they themselves are better becasue they don't have what that other person does(depression). Is that the right way of helping a fellow christian who needs support and love?

Luke 18: 10Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. 11The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. 12I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. 13And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. 14I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

Yep, the pharisee thought he was all good and righteous too didn't he?


Mat.7: 1“Judge not, that you be not judged. 2For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you. 3And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye? 4Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me remove the speck from your eye’; and look, a plank is in your own eye? 5Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.


2Cor.1: 8For we do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, of our trouble which came to us in Asia: that we were burdened beyond measure, above strength, so that we despaired even of life

Paul 'worried' about his life, according to oyur previous post he was sining becasue he did not trust God for his life.

David's psalm in hopelessness and depression.
Psalm 143:4 Therefore my spirit is overwhelmed within me, my heart within me is distressed.

1 Kings 19, Elijah depressed.
From the Bible Reader's Companion on this chapter and depression
"God’s remedy for depression. Doctors today believe that most depression is chemically based rather than psychological. Whatever the basis of depression, God’s way of dealing with Elijah helps us see how to help ourselves. Note these steps: (1) Don’t blame yourself. God didn’t blame, and was even willing to provide nourishment so His prophet could run away (vv. 7-8). (2) Express your feelings. Elijah needed to talk, even though what he says seems only loosely related to the fear that triggered his bout of depression. You can express your feelings freely to the Lord, or find someone willing to serve as God’s listening post (v. 10). (3) Remember God speaks to the hurting in gentle whispers. Don’t imagine God is angry or disgusted with you (vv. 11-14). (4) Return to work. Inactivity feeds depression. God had a task for Elijah that would give him a renewed sense of purpose (vv. 15-17). (5) Reality-test your perceptions. Anyone who is feeling despair will have his or her view of things colored by the emotion. Elijah felt alone, but God told His prophet he was one of thousands who worship Him. Let facts shape your feelings, rather than letting your feelings distort the facts (v. 18). (6) Share with a friend. If you have no close friends, ask the Lord to give you a companion. Loneliness and depression often walk hand in hand (vv. 19-21).
Ministering to the depressed. If you have a friend or loved one who suffers from depression, you can apply the principles above to help them.
Elijah’s tasks. The men Elijah was sent to anoint played critical roles in Israel’s immediate future. Hazael of Syria (Aram) became a chief foe of Israel (2 Kings 8:7-15). Jehu wiped out the family of Ahab and the Baal cult in Israel, though for political rather than religious reasons (cf. 9:1-13). And Elisha, Elijah’s successor, nourished the return to Yahweh that Elijah’s public triumph over the priests of Baal stimulated."


From the bible, some casues of depression, notes are from the Handbook of Bible Application
Judges 15:18
"Depression often follows exhaustion. Samson was physically and emotionally exhausted. After a great personal victory, his attitude declined quickly into self-pity—”Must I now die of thirst?” Emotionally, we are most vulnerable after a great effort or when faced with real physical needs. Severe depression often follows great achievements, so don’t be surprised if you feel drained after a personal victory.
During these times of vulnerability, avoid the temptation to think that God owes you for your efforts. It was his strength that gave you victory. Concentrate on keeping your attitudes, actions, and words focused on God instead of yourself."

1Kings 19:1-9

Depression sometimes follows great success. Elijah experienced the depths of fatigue and discouragement just after his two great spiritual victories: the defeat of the prophets of Baal and the answered prayer for rain. Often discouragement sets in after great spiritual experiences, especially those requiring physical effort or involving great emotion. To lead him out of depression, God first let Elijah rest and eat. Then God confronted him with the need to return to his mission—to speak God’s words in Israel. Elijah’s battles were not over; there was still work for him to do. When you feel let down after a great spiritual experience, remember that God’s purpose for your life is not yet over.


I also found that Job, Solomon, Jeremiah, Elijah, Paul suffered from depression. No where were they belittled,and told they didn't have faith in God, no where did God treat them or talk to them like you have here. Nor did He tell anyone else to do so. You say no one has used scripture, yet several times people have asked you questions that require a biblical answer.

Gal. 5:22
But the fruit of the Spirit is love , joy, peace, longsuffering , kindness , goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness , self-control .

 

</font>[/QUOTE]As I said, the scriptures proved my point, not theirs. Also the person who quoted scripture was not one of the posters who I had been asking for scriptures from. Do you follow the thread or are you just seeking anything you can find to discredite me? Why not discredit me with God's Word, I will listen to that.

~Lorelei

 

Scroll up, I replied.

~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]No, actually you didn't. I think you tried to double talk around the questions asked instead of actually answering them.

 

Lorelei,
If someone you cared about came to you and said they had been suffering from depression, how would you treat them? Like you have people here? If it were your mother, sister, grown child(when they are grown, would you belittle them, make them feel even worse, tell them they have no faith in God, compare them to false religions?
Or would you love them, support them, help them, pray for them, help them work through it all? Would you even care why they have depression? Would you car eif it were from menpause(proven to be chemical)? Or from pregancy(proven to be chemical)? Or what if it were a proven hormonal problem, which results in depression, as hormones are chemical.
Would you be gentle, loving, kind, and longsuffering?
Or would you yell at them and tell them they are faithless, and no good, disliked by you and God?

 

Scroll up, I replied.

~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]No, actually you didn't. I think you tried to double talk around the questions asked instead of actually answering them. </font>[/QUOTE]Shes very experienced and skilled at double talk.

 

</font>[/QUOTE]As I said, the scriptures proved my point, not theirs. Also the person who quoted scripture was not one of the posters who I had been asking for scriptures from. Do you follow the thread or are you just seeking anything you can find to discredite me? Why not discredit me with God's Word, I will listen to that.

~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]Scripture is scripture, and it doesn't matter who posts it, this is a public conversation, and anyone can take part in it.
No, it doesn't matter if it is God's word or not, if it disagrees with you, you aren't going to listen.

 

</font>[/QUOTE]As I said, the scriptures proved my point, not theirs. Also the person who quoted scripture was not one of the posters who I had been asking for scriptures from. Do you follow the thread or are you just seeking anything you can find to discredite me? Why not discredit me with God's Word, I will listen to that.

~Lorelei </font>[/QUOTE]No need to get angry with me. Charlotte made the statement that both sides have quoted scripture. The person who quoted scripture was me. Yes, of course I followed the thread, I said as much with my first post. I think what is happening here is that you have become very emotionally attached to this thread and now are taking things as personal attacks, when actually is not the case. My point in saying this is that you said something didn't happen as a response to someone saying that it did. Your own statement has contradicted your statement. Are you getting confused as to what you mean to say? That's okay, that happens when topics grow long. Perhaps you should take a break and regroup.

God bless you. And by the way, although I don't agree with many of the things you say, I never considered us to be on opposite sides. We are both Christians, so we are both on the same side. Sorry, that you feel differently.

Laurenda